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Avatar for scvirginia
May 11, 2021 9:31 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

While out walking the dog a few months ago, I noticed this small tree or large shrub growing on a nearby street. I didn't get a good photo of the whole plant—the light was fading—but I can re-visit it to get more photos if needed.

The photos are from February, when not too many trees are fruiting, so that may be helpful. It's in a sunny spot by the road, though I don't know if it is, technically, full sun. Thinking

The tree had a rather open, sprawling habit, and was probably about 20' tall, give or take a few feet. From a distance, the foliage has a silvery cast, like some Mediterranean and Australian plants have.

Thumb of 2021-05-12/scvirginia/9a8168

Thumb of 2021-05-12/scvirginia/9994ff

Thanks for having a look,
Virginia

Oh, I just found another photo:

Thumb of 2021-05-12/scvirginia/f1b4ab
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May 12, 2021 5:37 AM CST
Name: Janine
NE Connecticut (Zone 6b)
Cat Lover Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Connecticut Seed Starter Herbs Plant and/or Seed Trader
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
Fig?
Avatar for scvirginia
May 12, 2021 9:12 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

Thank You! for looking.

I'm sure there are plenty of fig species that I don't know well, but the only sorts commonly grown here are the edible and creeping figs, Ficus carica and Ficus pumila.

I agree that the leaves look something like the rubber plant, so could be something in that family, but I don't know of a fig that's hardy in 9a and has olive-shaped fruits in the winter.

Our climate is similar to North Florida, so I'll look to see if I can find some info about which figs and similar-looking landscape plants are grown there.

Virginia
Avatar for porkpal
May 12, 2021 12:51 PM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
Creeping fig looks like a very different plant when it is not growing on a wall or some structure. I am not sure that your plant isn't creeping fig.
Avatar for CalPolygardener
May 12, 2021 1:11 PM CST
California (Zone 9b)
It's not Creeping Fig, the fruit is purple and the leaves are smooth while the Creeping Fig fruit is green/yellow and the leaves are wrinkled. Does look like a fig though. Unless they're opposite.
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May 12, 2021 1:24 PM CST
Name: James
North Louisiana (Zone 8b)
Adeniums Cactus and Succulents Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Growing under artificial light Ferns Garden Photography
Region: Louisiana Region: Gulf Coast Enjoys or suffers hot summers Critters Allowed Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Container Gardener
looks like one of the non-native species of magnolia
Avatar for scvirginia
May 12, 2021 1:38 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

My mom has creeping fig, and that fruit is several times larger than the fruit on this tree, and the shape is quite different. The fruit on this is about the size or a bit smaller than a cocktail olive.

I'm not sure why I haven't noticed this neighborhood plant until this year. Possibly it was obscured from the street by another plant before. Wish I'd seen it in flower...

The leaves and habit don't look quite right for any types of Osmanthus I've seen, but could it be something in that family? I keep googling... Elaeagnus, Elaeocarpus, but nothing quite matches... Confused
Avatar for scvirginia
May 12, 2021 1:44 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

deepsouth said:
looks like one of the non-native species of magnolia


The leaves definitely remind me a bit of my Banana Shrub, but the fruit doesn't look like that of any magnolias I've seen. Which is not to imply that my knowledge of foreign Magnolias is even remotely comprehensive...
Avatar for porkpal
May 12, 2021 5:05 PM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
The leaf arrangement looks a bit random. Some are what I've heard called "almost opposite".
Avatar for Iochroma
May 12, 2021 5:44 PM CST
San Francisco Bay area (Zone 9a)
The fruit is not a fig, but probably a drupe. It would be helpful if the OP could show a picture or two of the fruit cut in half both ways.
The leaf arrangement says opposite to me, so again, not a fig. Magnolias are out as well.
I am not well-versed in the flora of the US SE, but I know many of the more showy species we also grow in the West. A flower picture would be instructive.
I am rather surprised that #ViburnumValley has not weighed in. I bet he will point us in the right direction.
Avatar for scvirginia
May 12, 2021 6:27 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

Iochroma said:The fruit is not a fig, but probably a drupe. It would be helpful if the OP could show a picture or two of the fruit cut in half both ways.
The leaf arrangement says opposite to me, so again, not a fig. Magnolias are out as well.
I am not well-versed in the flora of the US SE, but I know many of the more showy species we also grow in the West. A flower picture would be instructive.
I am rather surprised that #ViburnumValley has not weighed in. I bet he will point us in the right direction.


I did not see the flowers, and the fruits are long gone from the tree. I did, erm, permanently borrow a few to plant because I'm like that, but I can't supply any further photos of the fruit. If better photos of the leaves or trunk might help, tomorrow should be a nice day for an afternoon walk... it is unusually cool and pleasant here for May.

I have no reason to think this is necessarily a Southeastern US native plant, but if it is, it isn't one that's commonly grown around here. I'd be glad to hear from @ViburnumValley if he's around. Thanks for summoning him! Crossing Fingers!
Avatar for scvirginia
May 13, 2021 6:37 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

I have no idea if more photos will help, or if this is a lost cause, but these are from today:

Thumb of 2021-05-14/scvirginia/1e7330

Thumb of 2021-05-14/scvirginia/1cec3d

Thumb of 2021-05-14/scvirginia/335ae2

Thumb of 2021-05-14/scvirginia/28d16e

Thank You!
Image
May 13, 2021 8:52 PM CST
Name: John
Scott County, KY (Zone 5b)
You can't have too many viburnums..
Region: United States of America Region: Kentucky Farmer Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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I appreciate the nod from you all, but deep south broadleaf evergreens are a little past my horizon of experience - for the most part.

There are plenty of "bad hair day" branches on that plant. scvirginia should clip off a chunk that has leaves - as well as some of the previously leafed section behind it - and take it to some calm place where you can photo closely the bases of leaves; tops and undersides of leaves; older part of the branch where leaves used to be attached (leaf scars); etc. More of this information may reveal identity from less gross features.

Without seeing more yet, I wonder if this could be some big old misshapen evergreen Privet species, maybe Ligustrum lucidum (Waxleaf Privet).
Avatar for scvirginia
May 13, 2021 9:33 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Virginia

ViburnumValley said:I appreciate the nod from you all, but deep south broadleaf evergreens are a little past my horizon of experience - for the most part.

There are plenty of "bad hair day" branches on that plant. scvirginia should clip off a chunk that has leaves - as well as some of the previously leafed section behind it - and take it to some calm place where you can photo closely the bases of leaves; tops and undersides of leaves; older part of the branch where leaves used to be attached (leaf scars); etc. More of this information may reveal identity from less gross features.

Without seeing more yet, I wonder if this could be some big old misshapen evergreen Privet species, maybe Ligustrum lucidum (Waxleaf Privet).



I will bring my snips when we go out walking next, and see if I can provide better leaf/ branch details.

I did think it could be some sort of privet relation, but the fruit is not at all like the L. lucidum that is rampant in our neighborhood, and quite invasive here. There are plenty of plants nearby that are as large as this, and though I call them 'disgustrum' for their invasive and allergenic properties, I will admit that they make handsome small trees with no care or pruning.

Also, the Ligustrum varieties that I've seen don't have branches that grow down then arch up and out.

I appreciate your having a look, and will try to provide a more detailed look at the leaves.

Thank You!
Virginia
Image
May 14, 2021 1:35 AM CST
Perthshire. SCOTLAND. UK
Garden Photography Region: United Kingdom Plant Identifier
deepsouth said:
looks like one of the non-native species of magnolia


Magnolia sp/cultivars seed pods look nothing like these fruits....see link.
Definitely not Magnolia.
https://www.google.com/search?...
Image
May 14, 2021 1:47 AM CST
Perthshire. SCOTLAND. UK
Garden Photography Region: United Kingdom Plant Identifier
Evergreen. Leaves are decussate.
Quote wiki...."the word decussate describes an opposite pattern of leaves which has successive pairs at right angles to each other (i.e. rotated 90 degrees along the stem when viewed from above)."

I believe this to be Osmanthus.sp.
In UK it is never warm enough to set fruits.
Would need to see flowers .... you will have different ones in USA to UK.

Quote wiki....
Osmanthus is a genus of about 30 species of flowering plants in the family Oleaceae. Most of the species are native to eastern Asia (China, Japan, Korea, Indochina, the Himalayas, etc.) with a few species from the Caucasus, New Caledonia and Sumatra.

"Osmanthus range in size from shrubs to small trees, 2–12 m (7–39 ft) tall. The leaves are opposite, evergreen, and simple, with an entire, serrated or coarsely toothed margin. The flowers are produced in spring, summer or autumn, each flower being about 1 cm long, white, with a four-lobed tubular-based corolla ('petals'). The flowers grow in small panicles, and in several species have a strong fragrance. The fruit is a small (10–15 mm), hard-skinned dark blue to purple drupe containing a single seed. "
https://www.google.com/search?...
Last edited by Silversurfer May 14, 2021 2:24 AM Icon for preview
Avatar for porkpal
May 14, 2021 6:45 AM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
I am not familiar with osmanthus. I thought it looked like a sickly ligustrum of some sort.
Image
May 14, 2021 6:49 AM CST
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4b)
Annuals Native Plants and Wildflowers Keeps Horses Dog Lover Daylilies Region: Canadian
Butterflies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Sages Plant Identifier
Funnily enough the first picture I found of Osmanthus fruits is this one:

Avatar for CalPolygardener
May 14, 2021 6:57 AM CST
California (Zone 9b)
If that is what it is (I'm pretty sure it is) it is one of the most wonderfully fragrant plants anywhere (that's what SWMBO says anyway). I've never seen one growing like that, I'll have to go look at our 50-75 year-old one and look for fruit.
Image
May 14, 2021 7:17 AM CST
Perthshire. SCOTLAND. UK
Garden Photography Region: United Kingdom Plant Identifier
CalPolygardener said:If that is what it is (I'm pretty sure it is) it is one of the most wonderfully fragrant plants anywhere (that's what SWMBO says anyway).


Yes super scent.
We used to grow 6 different sp in old garden.
This one is Osmanthus delaveyi.

Thumb of 2021-05-14/Silversurfer/afc81e
Last edited by Silversurfer May 14, 2021 7:18 AM Icon for preview

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