Adeniums forum: Not Good... I think I've lost this one.

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Name: Robert B
Bradenton, Florida (Zone 9b)
Plumeria to trade!!!
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RobertB
Jul 29, 2012 1:59 PM CST
My other big adenium had a bad caudex, its been drying now for 3 weeks and it has not gotten any better, in fact it is gotten worse... should I just throw it away and cry or can this be saved...Thumb of 2012-07-29/RobertB/6ce4d3



the darker area is soft while the green area is hard,,,

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Crying Crying Crying Crying Crying Crying


RobertB I'm all ears!
[Last edited by RobertB - Jul 29, 2012 2:44 PM (+)]
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Name: Michael Hicks
Clermont, Fl
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Plumerias Orchids Tropicals
Amaryllis Region: Florida Region: United States of America Roses
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chefmike92
Jul 29, 2012 4:16 PM CST
OH Robert


its not looking good BUT i NEVER toss any until i am sure nothing can be saved. IF it where me i would get an ice cold beverage of your choice sit down out side with a good SHARP SHARP knife and CLIPPERS. use alcohol or peroxide to clean the knives and clippers. I would start on the smallest farthest ends of the roots and start cutting. and keep cutting until you see 99% good white/green root. do that to all the tangled roots. I say 99% because i clean my clipper or knife just after that cut and make one more cut for a good clean cut.... then i have been told to dip it in peroxide and see if it bubbles like it would a cut if not let dry part way and cinnamon.

If there is any of the root system left its not a lost cause. branches can also be planted also. It is hard to let anything dry out now because everything needs water is prime growing so it keeps using the storage it has. there are a few people that try to seal plumeria with a torch i am going to try this to seal it, I am going to heat up a piece of metal red hot and hold on for a few seconds just to cauterize and not cook the flesh. i have been dipping my adenium cuts in rooting hormone

i have an idea for a rotted caudex and it is set the caudex on pea gravel and take peat moss damp and cover just the edge of the cut on the caudex so no moisture reaches the inside but is on the edge to try to stimulate root growth, have not tried it yet but just a theory im thinking about. in a pic i say how stems root they root on the outer edge not the center of the branch keep it dry it wont rot???

It looks like you will be left with the top and maybe a small amount of root system

good luck
Name: Hetty
Sunny Naples, Florida (Zone 10a)
Plumerias Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Database Moderator
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Dutchlady1
Jul 29, 2012 4:59 PM CST
Be sure to remember the cold beverage. Sticking tongue out
Name: Robert B
Bradenton, Florida (Zone 9b)
Plumeria to trade!!!
Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Region: Gulf Coast Amaryllis The WITWIT Badge Seed Starter
Bromeliad Plant and/or Seed Trader Tropicals Ponds Dog Lover Plumerias
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RobertB
Jul 29, 2012 7:09 PM CST
Hilarious! :iagree:


Thanks Mike I knew this wasn't going to be good.. I'm going to "operate" next weekend.

RobertB
Name: Sylvain Forest
Delray Beach, FL (Zone 10a)
Almost like Lucy and me.
Orchids Plant and/or Seed Trader Plumerias Ponds Region: Florida Tropicals
Container Gardener
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lourspolaire
Jul 30, 2012 7:52 AM CST
Hi.

I would operate yesterday, to remove whatever ails it and maybe, just maybe, thwart its spreading any further. And don't skimp on the tool cleaning between each cut; you don't want to spread this stuff to healthy tissue. And then, it's a case of Captain Cinnamon to the rescue!

Best of luck with that and please let us know how things went.

Sylvain.
Name: Michael Hicks
Clermont, Fl
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Plumerias Orchids Tropicals
Amaryllis Region: Florida Region: United States of America Roses
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chefmike92
Jul 30, 2012 12:05 PM CST
lourspolaire said:Hi.

I would operate yesterday, to remove whatever ails it and maybe, just maybe, thwart its spreading any further. And don't skimp on the tool cleaning between each cut; you don't want to spread this stuff to healthy tissue. And then, it's a case of Captain Cinnamon to the rescue!

Best of luck with that and please let us know how things went.

Sylvain.


I agree I agree
the sooner you get that rot off that plant the better it just keeps spreading day by day.
Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
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coconut
Jul 30, 2012 1:15 PM CST
Wellllll,,,,,,

I had a small plant that had rotted most of the caudex. I didn't have time for fooling with it. Hung it out on the fence, didn't cut anything. The rotted part dried up in a few days, and the top part healed at the edgeg of the rot. I was amazed. I have another little plant doing the same thing.

I have un-potted several large plants, say three years old, as well as the huge plants that I dug from my friend's yard, and found healed rot!
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If I find rot in the future, I'm simply going to wash ALL the soil off the roots and hang. No tedious anything, even no cinnamon.
Name: Michael Hicks
Clermont, Fl
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Plumerias Orchids Tropicals
Amaryllis Region: Florida Region: United States of America Roses
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chefmike92
Jul 30, 2012 2:26 PM CST
wow good info in sun?

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Wilfred
Jul 30, 2012 2:37 PM CST
Hellow to all my Dear Freinds, long time I haven't been able to lock on, were'er having telephone cable problem right now, haven't had telphone for a month two month and a half already and they don't know when they can fi it, it funny that the internet works from time to time but it goes out also all the time.

Hey Robert, just by looking thru your photos the plant is not lost, i noticed that in some of your last photos you scraped a little of the skin on some of the roots and it's green, the ones nest to the one you pulled off a part of it, if you want to save it you have to cut off all the rotted part as soon as you can and leave it to dry off for two days at least,, put some rooting powder on the cut so it will dry faster, Oh befor I forget, I think what is killing your deset rose is a salt build up from the fertilizers you use or in the soil. I say this because iI notice a white ring around the base of the caudex of your plant and on the out side of your pot, This is cause from salt billed up, I recommend that you take a toothbrush and wash your adenium until you get most of it off the plant by brushing it with the toothbrush and water, do the same with the pot, also use new potting mix as the potting mix you had it in would have to much salt in it and it will keep damaging the root system. Just as a reminder to all, you have to give your plants a soil flush from time to time between fertilizing to avoid salt build up. to do this you only have to put lot of water and let it drain completly, I do this at least tree time to make sure all the salt has had a chance to drain out, than i let the planted plant dry out almost completely before watery again as normaly as I do. Afther you cut the rotted parts out and set it to cure, place it in a well ventilated area out of direct sunlight so it won't further dehydrate more than it has already, you can sray it with some water from time to time but don't get the cuts wet, hang it upside down so you don't get water drips on cuts. after you plant it keep soil most ownly and if you got superthieve for rooting use it in every watering until you see new leaves on your plant. Hope this helps you.

Hey Melissa, thanks a lot for the plants you sent me, i thought some miet die but the all are doing great, they have recoved nicely after there trip here, only the yellow has bloom for me, been trying to get seed pods from it but with no success yet, can't wait till the others start to bloom to see what they are especialy the one you marked as a surprize, thank you so much.


Your Friend Wilfred
Group hug

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Wilfred
Jul 30, 2012 2:41 PM CST
OH I forgot, hey Michael, don't hot metal to heal the cuts on plant, it tends to damage tissue above the cuts you want to heal and it could rot above the cuts, just place in well ventilated place

Your Friend Wilfred



Group hug
Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
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coconut
Jul 30, 2012 2:43 PM CST
Hi Wilfred!!!!
Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
Image
coconut
Jul 30, 2012 2:48 PM CST
Mike, yes, in sun rain showers and wind.

Here's my entry for Ugliest Plant Contest

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Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
Image
coconut
Jul 30, 2012 2:52 PM CST
RobertB, I would HANG the plant. Being in a pot there is not enough air circulation. Wilfred says a few days, I say a month, ouch!
Name: Robert B
Bradenton, Florida (Zone 9b)
Plumeria to trade!!!
Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Region: Gulf Coast Amaryllis The WITWIT Badge Seed Starter
Bromeliad Plant and/or Seed Trader Tropicals Ponds Dog Lover Plumerias
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RobertB
Jul 30, 2012 3:23 PM CST
taking notes... I may try and get this done during the week..
Name: Robert B
Bradenton, Florida (Zone 9b)
Plumeria to trade!!!
Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Region: Gulf Coast Amaryllis The WITWIT Badge Seed Starter
Bromeliad Plant and/or Seed Trader Tropicals Ponds Dog Lover Plumerias
Image
RobertB
Jul 30, 2012 3:53 PM CST
OK I bit the bullet..... Crying Crying Crying Crying



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The scene of the crime....

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Crime evidence


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Victim


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I don't know... I felt like a mad scientist... ..I cut off all the mushy.. and saw no brown...and cleaned the blade after each cut.... when (if) it heals up..I will wash it and put it in a good mix and love on it a while....

Thanks everyone... I tip my hat to you.
Name: Michael Hicks
Clermont, Fl
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Plumerias Orchids Tropicals
Amaryllis Region: Florida Region: United States of America Roses
Image
chefmike92
Jul 30, 2012 7:58 PM CST
Wilfred

I can not understand it but a lot of plumeria growers are using torches to seal the ends of the cut branches. during this time of year the cranches are green growing the turn hollow before they heal so some are using Liquid electrical tape and some are using fire. I have 5 cuttings that i have cut and dipped in rooting hormone ( normal ) way to do it.with in 24-48 hrs they are hollow and dehydrating. i have soaked in water then put liquid eletrical tape and that helped but i can get a good callous. so the only thing i can figure is to cauterize them that is a instant heal to be able to pot with in 24 hrs. I have been told you have to have hot and most are using soldering iron I know due to i Used to be a mechanic and i can take my torch and get metal red/white hot and just touch the end to it and seal much faster and dip in to ice water right after. A trick when trying to weld fine metal with out getting the metal to hot,
I know its not a great thing to do and not herd of for adeinums but If you don't have much of a caudex to supply the needed energy it might work. I have small 1 1/2 in caudex that 80% cut off in 2 days there is nothing left but shrived plant cells. with some of these adeniums like Roberts that look like it was a rooted cutting due to no caudex all stem and roots there might not be any energy storage left. just a way that i am thinking due to problems with my plumeria.

thanks for the warning
mike

Robert ....Looking good one thing Mellisa usually said hang right side up. she knows better then i do but all the web sites i have looked at they have them stems up
Name: Robert B
Bradenton, Florida (Zone 9b)
Plumeria to trade!!!
Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Region: Gulf Coast Amaryllis The WITWIT Badge Seed Starter
Bromeliad Plant and/or Seed Trader Tropicals Ponds Dog Lover Plumerias
Image
RobertB
Jul 30, 2012 9:32 PM CST
Thanks Mike..hanging up right now. Smiling

RobertB Angel
Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
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coconut
Jul 31, 2012 1:55 PM CST
Looking great, RobertB!

Plumies have a much woodier stem than Adeniums...

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Wilfred
Jul 31, 2012 6:46 PM CST
Hello to all, Robert your doing a good job up to now, I really think it's going to recover well.
Hey Mike i say not to use hot metal on adeniums since they are not as hard as the plumeria the harder the plant the less damage it would take from something hot thouching it, plumerias are much hard than adeniums even its greener parts, for some reasone the softer the tissue of the plant the easier it get damaged from heat, its like if heat transfer through the cell faster on soft tissue than hard tissue and if the tissue of the plants gets damage they do one of two thing, they dry out or rot. Usually rotting is was happens to the softer tissue before dry out because it contains more water in it. I'll try some experiment on some plumerias to see what works best and let you know as soon as I get the results.

Your Friend Wilfred
Group hug
Name: Melissa E. Keyes
St. Croix, U.S. Virgin Islands
Zone 11+
Charter ATP Member
Image
coconut
Aug 1, 2012 10:39 AM CST
Heat penetrates and kills tissue. Adeniums are mostly water. Keep a bit of rotted root and let it dry, you will be amazed at how little material is left.

Here are some answers from the yahoo adenium group---

Roger in Bankok--"Not entirely amiss but there are many ways to cauterize other than the medieval hot-poker approach. Every surgeon today does multiple cauterization every day to control bleeding with high-voltage electrical arc, or chemical cauterizers for larger areas.

For the rotted adenium, that has been thoroughly cleaned out, I believe a 3% H2O2 (Hydrogen peroxide) wash, followed by forced-air drying and a good heavy dusting with cinnamon, sulfer, Bordeaux powder, et al, would be a better approach.

Traditional styling of Bonsai often incorporates light to heavy use of blowtorch and I think that might also prove to be an interesting and artistic approach to this problem ... naysayers caveat: "blow torches" come in flame sizes down to less than 1 mm in diameter :-)"

Stick with the pharmacy 3% concentration, or else dilute the 6% hairdresser form. Avoid 35% food grade as it is simply too dangerous to work with outside a proper lab environment.

Blow dry with an ordinary fan as it breaks down to water, which of course re-encourages the rot.

~~~


Maybe hold suggestions until you have had success. Melissa-the-grouch-today. ~~~~

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