No the link didn't work because there's an open [ without a close ] at the very end. If Melva edited the post & put the close braver at the end, it'll work just fine.

Melva might be busy, so I edited it. Thanks for noticing that, Toni.

thanks

How on earth did my iPhone change the word "bracket" into the word "braver"??? Weird....

I love your iPhone, Toni. It makes some funny mistakes.

I just figured it was some more "computer talk" that I didn't understand.

So did I, Porkpal. Toni occasionally comes up with instructions on various types of code that just sail over my head, so I really believed there was such a thing as a "braver" in Computerese.

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm retarded, but not THAT retarded!!! But, my phone is! Guess I should have waited until I was home to mention it, but I happen to be at Cracker Barrel (30 miles away) and just had to be a smartallack.

Love ya all, though.. and I thank you for your patience with my weirdness. :hurray:

That must be another of Toni's pets on her front porch!

I think she's too soft hearted to keep pets on the front porch, Sue. That guy must be in a cage in her living room.

I wouldn't keep him in a cage.. he's too adorable. Took me about 15 minutes of playing PeekABoo to get that shot here at the Denver Zoo.

I sympathize, Melva. I hurt my back and shoulder again and haven't been able to get a ride to the doctor's office. I can't get to this doctor on the local bus routes. (Don't get me started on the local buses, they are so unreliable that drivers head off to bars and leave you stranded because "no one is ever at" certain stops like the library. Luckily the police are friendly and will drive you home if you are stranded.) I didn't realize that basic utilities such as water, electricity, phones and basic services such as bus transportation don't necessarily work in all parts of America. Silly Me.

I still can only sit at the computer for short spells then have to stretch and use some of my various orthopedic physical therapy devices. I am wired up with a mens (no, not that kind of mens, I wish) it is like a tens - a gizmo that sends electric shocks that relieve pain and muscle spasms. I also have trouble focusing my eyes at a computer screen for extended periods of times due to the concussion.

The bf (or whatever he is these days) couldn't take me to the dentist this week so I have to wait in pain a while longer to see the doctor and get to the dentist. (One of the laminates on my from tooth came off and two crowns are loose. Luckily the laminate didn't break. All are dental work required on damaged teeth from the accident). I cancelled my plans for Christmas dinner with relatives because I look like a hillbilly with a missing front tooth and can't chew hard food because of the crowns. Besides, I am not very good company when I am in pain. Seeing everyone open their expensive gifts and talk about their winter vacation plans is just to depressing for me right now. I plan to stay home and try to forget it is Christmas.

It is hard enough being injured. It is impossible when you are injured and unable to get the medical care you need to recover. I found that out the hard way. I am enduring it again because I am at risk of losing the recovery I have made because of difficulties getting transportation to the doctor's offices. To make things worse, I keep outliving my doctors and have to start with new ones. They always want to change things. I am open to advice, but refuse to revisit a medicine treatment that hasn't worked for me in the past. I also insist on reading medical research online about any new treatment and ask for sources of independent medical reviews. My general doctor and neurologist encourage me and send me links to information. That makes me a "difficult" patient to some doctors. Too bad. I worked for a pharmaceutical company for 10 years before I had an accident, I understand more than most "the game" some doctors play and refuse to risk my health on unproved drugs so that they can qualify for an "educational seminar" in the Caribbean.

I am off to my rose list to pick at least one group of 4 roses, but will be back for more as soon as I can figure out where to put them. If I find out a way to move this spring when my lease is up, watch out! Any new place will have more garden space.

I am going to cheer myself up by buying myself a few roses for Christmas. I am hopeful that we will both be feeling better by fall. I am glad that I can help you a little bit at the same time!

I have been researching your roses on helpmefind. I always look for roses that other gardeners in similar climates have grown successfully. As you said, Melva, zone ratings aren't cast in stone. Here is a list of some of Melva's roses that I am tempted to try based on ratings and reviews that may help other potential shoppers in cold climates. Maybe the ratings and brief descriptions will help. If not, sorry for taking up valuable forum space with my sketchy notes.

Climbing Roses:
Magic Dragon - z5a+ Moore red mini climber, double
Red Wand z5a+, pinkish red double (could fit by my William Baffin)
Alchemist -z4b+ once blooming climber loved by CaliforniaSue, already on my wish list and in my top 4 from Melva

RUGOSAS
Therese Bugnet - z3b+ recc for N.Sweden, double clear pink, spring bloom some repeat, disease resistant
Mrs Anthony Waterer -z6+ very bright pink flowering, fragrant
Conrad Ferdinand Meyer z5+, silvery pink very fragrant, 6-10'

Tea Roses - I thought they were not practical for my zone, but I am glad that I looked them up
Lemon Tea -I am having trouble finding much information on this one
Jean Bach Sisley z5b+ repeated flushes, pink fragrant blooms, 4' sometimes grown as a climber-need to read more about this one. I would love to try to grow a tea rose

GALLICAS - trying a Gallica rose has been on my todo list, especially after reading Paul Barden's site
Canary Island Gallica mauve/purple z4-8, grown at brooklyn botanical
Charles De Mills z4-8 ars 8.6 barden 9.5 deep red
Cramoisi des Alpes 4b+ pink picotee compact 3-4' almost dwarf - could fit this one in somewhere...
Crimson Gallica -found rose maybe super tuscan, purplish pink fragrant once blooming z5+ (tuscan is on my wishlist)
Shailer's Provence -centifolia z4b+ seedling of virgin pink fragrant

Melva's MISC
Queen of the Bourbons- z5b+ med pink
Autumn Delight z5b+ fragrant white hybrid musk single ars 7.1
Swamp Rose z5b+, pink 6-8' spring blooming once blooming
Madame Laurel de Barney z5b+ bourbon once bloom spring
Carefree Beauty buck rose zone 4b+ pink - lots of people recommend this for cold climates
Gypsy Boy bourbon violet red once blooming z3b+ sweden rec. 3'

Melba's rooted rose list:
mac-couldn't find much information on this one
apple blossom-hybrid multiflora rambler- z 5+ big 6'+ single clustered pink once bloom w repeat
natchitoches noisette z5+ fragrant double blooms, reblooming and disease resistant 3-15'
heideroslein- z6+Hybrid Musk, Lambertiana-I got this one from Melva, can't wait until it grows up, it had a couple of cute blooms this season.
wild flower - z6+ austin- single pale yellow 18"+ single
laure davoust - hybrid multiflora rambler - found rose pink double clustered 12'
yolande d' aragon -portalnd rose-z4b+ beautiful, fragrant mauve-pink blooms
cupid's mark- McCann mini red striped rose, 3'
madame louis frankel...noisette - I couldn't find any information on this one
perle d or - china hybrid, polyantha z6+, 5 protected 3-6' fragrant, peach fragrant 3' called "Yellow Cécile Brünner’"
debutante -Hybrid Wichurana-12' light pink once blooming rambler "mother days rose"


Decisions, decisions, decisions

There are others on her lists that would grow in colder climates, especially the hybrid musks, polyanthas and hybrid perpetuals. Most of them are hardy in my zone, so I didn't list them. The English roses are hardy here also.

Here is a fun fact that I just read...Narrow Water, a noisette rose said to possibly be a sport of Nastarana, was/is grown in Monet's garden.

Nastarana is called the persian musk rose. It is rated as hardier than most noisettes zone 5b+. It also gets up to 4' high and 10' wide. Narrow Water may be more compact, according to reviews.

Of all my roses, Nastarana is one whose scent is the best...I have Narrow Water and Nastarana and I adore them both...Narrow Water is 2 feet wide and four feet tall..it was in a lot of shade and the tree that was shading it, has been whacked so it will grow larger (I think)
Nastarana is 4 feet wide, and 8 feet tall..it is climbing the tree it is planted under..Nastarana

Narrow Water

Perfect timing, Melva, I was thinking about trying a noisette. I was getting ready to ask the group for advice.

Nastarana may be too big for me to squeeze in my garden, but it is beautiful. One source said it reached 4' tall and 10' wide. I loved the pictures of the pink buds opening into white blooms. Narrow Water may or may not be its sport. (I wish they would dna or paternity test these roses so that the "experts" would stop fighting amongst themselves). I visited Monet's gardens in France and love his paintings, so I am drawn to the idea of planting plants were/are grown there. That Narrow Water is more compact is a plus for me. Is Narrow Water a once bloomer or repeat bloomer in your garden?

A rosarian called Truli in zone 5 Ohio grows Natchitoches Noisette. She says "Does beautiful in my zone 5, Ohio, no spray, garden with no winter protection . One of my best performers with an abundance of blooms all summer long, superior disease resistance, excellent climber." She also says she has it trained around a pillar with a butterfly house, the hummingbirds like and it blooms constantly with no blackspot . A rose that is winter hardy in zone 5 and gets no blackspot in a no spray garden catches my attention! I also like the contrast of the yellow stigmas and the pink petals.
Here are some pic links from Truli http://www.helpmefind.com/rose...

I also loved this picture of Blush Noisette. http://www.helpmefind.com/rose...

Here are a couple of links on noisette roses if anyone is interested:
http://www.rosesonline.com/abo...
http://www.rdrop.com/~paul/noi...

Narrow Water repeats..

MAC is Madame Alfred Carriere,a Noisette
http://www.helpmefind.com/rose...

I got "Lemon Tea" from Chamblees they don't carry it anymore...