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Dec 17, 2012 4:31 PM CST
Name: Mark Mallon
seattle wa
Region: United States of America Region: Pacific Northwest Region: Southwest Gardening
you can get hens and chicks to grow in heat by dumping larger rock in pile then planting cold cracks and protected north side
DON'T PANIC
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Dec 17, 2012 7:00 PM CST
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
Garden Art Birds Dog Lover Cat Lover Region: Pacific Northwest Hummingbirder
I agree Mark, good advice
Tee lovely photos
Not sure who said it above, to water plants before a freeze, but even on the Nmexico plant list it says plants do better drier before a freeze. I had to reread that part several times, it stated that weak and lush plants receive more damage from frost than stronger, less full plants. Interesting,
I'm in the process of redoing my 2 raised beds so they have a couple inches of pea gravel about 8 inches below the soil to allow drainage, where I've already accomplished this the plants look totally great, even with all the rains we've been having Thumbs up
Semps are Hen and chicks Smiling
Cheers all
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Dec 17, 2012 9:06 PM CST
Name: Mark Mallon
seattle wa
Region: United States of America Region: Pacific Northwest Region: Southwest Gardening
In addition, as water freezes, heat is released; 80 calories for each gram of water that freezes

something like that although i don't think it would do any good to have wet roots overnight on your cacti or succulents
DON'T PANIC
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Dec 17, 2012 9:08 PM CST
Name: Mark Mallon
seattle wa
Region: United States of America Region: Pacific Northwest Region: Southwest Gardening
greg check this out http://www.puyallup.wsu.edu/~l...

a raised bed is essentially a large container
DON'T PANIC
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Dec 17, 2012 11:36 PM CST
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
Garden Art Birds Dog Lover Cat Lover Region: Pacific Northwest Hummingbirder
Hilarious! Well, at least I did use coarse soil, that is mixed with pea gravel on top of my pea gravel layer Big Grin Honestly I usually just go by what works or isn't working (for me the layer of gravel on the bottom seems to help my plants (indoors and outdoors) but I'm highly suggestable Hilarious!
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Jan 3, 2013 1:26 PM CST
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Give PEACE a chance!
Adeniums Cat Lover Garden Photography Region: California Houseplants Plays in the sandbox
Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Composter Cactus and Succulents Dragonflies Hummingbirder
Took some photos this morning, 03Jan2013. Sharing how my succulents are faring this winter. We have been having very cold nights 28F-31F and temps rise up to low 50's during daytime. Thankfully no rains for the past 2 weeks, so my succulents are enduring the cold season much better than other winters so far.

Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/bfe500 Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/e29a4f Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/cf901b

Hmmm now something wrong with the photo upload..the photo goes sideways even if it is right side up in my hard drive...too bad... Confused
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Jan 3, 2013 1:47 PM CST
Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Container Gardener Foliage Fan Sempervivums Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Garden Ideas: Master Level
Last nite, I also had similar temps of 29F to 30'sF in Tarev's home state...aren't we California girls lucky? Rolling my eyes.

Here's my band of Aeoniums that were banged up against patio wall and covered at nite with shade cloth just now unveiled for the day:

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Jan 3, 2013 2:01 PM CST
Name: Mark Mallon
seattle wa
Region: United States of America Region: Pacific Northwest Region: Southwest Gardening
Your plants are doing great... are those graptoveria?
blue chalk sticks all chewed up by sugar ants in the fall
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this one is toast
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Mexican firecracker
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and sedum multiceps seems to actively be growing now with the nights down into the high 20's and the days in the mid 40's go figure
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and this grapto something has been completely bulletproof and was growing up untill just before XMAS

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DON'T PANIC
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Jan 3, 2013 2:22 PM CST
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Give PEACE a chance!
Adeniums Cat Lover Garden Photography Region: California Houseplants Plays in the sandbox
Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Composter Cactus and Succulents Dragonflies Hummingbirder
Trying the upload again..
Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/2b84f2 Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/91059b
Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/96c88f Thumb of 2013-01-03/tarev/abdb82
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oh well ..sorry for the lopsided photo on some..
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Jan 3, 2013 3:10 PM CST
Name: Sheryl
Hot, hot, hot, Feenix, AZ (Zone 9b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Charter ATP Member Keeps Horses Dog Lover Cat Lover Permaculture
Butterflies Birds Cottage Gardener Herbs I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises
Hi everyone, but hopefully all of you had wonderful holidays and didn't gain as much weight as I did....

Kristi, my first thought when you described your bed was to erect a cold frame of sorts over it for the winter using straw bales around it and either putting old windows over them or even sheet plastic. That would give you protection from both frost and some from moisture.

I remember Palmbob describing his plants when his area of California had an extremely wet and cold winter. I seem to remember it raining for days on end. He was surprised to find that some of his less hardy plants that were exposed to a lot of rain and cold survived just fine because they had *perfect* drainage with almost no dirt.

I do know that plastic as a cover is a no-no if it touches plants.
In the end, only kindness matters.

Science is not the answer, it is the question.


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Jan 3, 2013 7:41 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Kristi
east Texas pineywoods (Zone 8a)
Herbs Region: Texas Vegetable Grower Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 2
Excellent to see the results that Tarev has had. It amazes me that even those in the cocoa fiber liner are quite impervious to the freezing temps. A question please, at what temperature would you provide protection? Or do you have duplicates so you leave these out as a test?

Mark ~ are those sugar ants the Argentine ant? I am guessing they are not eating your plants for moisture but rather for food? Have you tried controlling them?

Lovely Aeoniums Bev. I, for one, am jealous of your ideal climate. lol

Hey Sheryl ~ there is no chance I gained weight for the holidays. Been running hard, trying to catch my tail. Last year, this succulent bed was new so I used frost cloth to protect it. It does not receive much moisture at all, being under the eaves. The only rain it would catch would be a blowing wind. But I have decided it needs to be toughened up so have left it the the mercy of the weather. Good decision as I've been out of state for a funeral and running at work when home. I know my husband would be no help.

We've had some nights in the low 20s, quite a few in the high 20s but I haven't taken photos lately. I'll try to do so this weekend.
Tell us what you have planted in ground in your lovely (at this time of year) home.
Believe in yourself even when no one else will. ~ Sasquatch
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Jan 3, 2013 10:39 PM CST
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Give PEACE a chance!
Adeniums Cat Lover Garden Photography Region: California Houseplants Plays in the sandbox
Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Composter Cactus and Succulents Dragonflies Hummingbirder
Hi Kristi,
Those were not cocoa fiber liners but dried up sphagnum moss. Those in the basket are the duplicates, the mother plants are also freezing in their containers outdoors. Big Grin I just leave my succulents outside to fend for themselves. I think as long as there is good air circulation around them, good drainage and good sunshine on a cold day, however cold it is, they survive well. They will go stressed for awhile but bounces back when warmer weather returns. But I do worry when it starts raining for several days, always keeping my fingers crossed that the succulents will endure. Luckily the past couple of weeks has been cold but dry, so my succulents are coping well this winter.
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Jan 4, 2013 2:13 AM CST
Name: Carole
Clarksville, TN (Zone 6b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Avid Green Pages Reviewer
I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar Garden Ideas: Master Level Cat Lover Birds Region: Tennessee Echinacea
You are so right ... wet can be a real killer. Even worse than cold sometimes. Glare
I garden for the pollinators.
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Jan 4, 2013 12:15 PM CST
Name: Mark Mallon
seattle wa
Region: United States of America Region: Pacific Northwest Region: Southwest Gardening
Kristi -
they are called sugar ants around here but who knows what they are.
It was aphids on the fred ives and roses. i brought ladybugs in and the aphids went away but the ants that were farming them were still there. They started cutting wounds into the plants then sucking up the juice. They really really like the chalk sticks and young prickly pear pads other then that they dont eat anything.
When we took out the front chimney in my home it damaged the plater on the inside of the room. In the process of repair i removed 5 sq feet or so of plaster and found a massive ant nest between the layers of paint and wallpaper and the plaster. They had a entrance in the mantel and another one 6 feet away in the driveway slab outside!!! An hour after i found in the wall they started pouring out of the driveway!!!
DON'T PANIC
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Jan 4, 2013 6:34 PM CST
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Give PEACE a chance!
Adeniums Cat Lover Garden Photography Region: California Houseplants Plays in the sandbox
Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Composter Cactus and Succulents Dragonflies Hummingbirder
This winter my early casualties are my Euphorbia candelabra and Aloinopsis luckhoffii Sad I guess these are the types I should have kept indoors..lesson learned for next time! For awhile I thought the Aloinopsis revived when rains returned, but the combination of cold hit it hard.

All my Crassulas, Faucarias, Kalanchoes, Haworthias and Arboreums are absolutely enjoying this chilly dry season for now Big Grin
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Jan 5, 2013 12:44 AM CST
Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Container Gardener Foliage Fan Sempervivums Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Garden Ideas: Master Level
Tarev, I am in CA too but my big loss have been 27 heads of semps that got transparent and mushy. I think they suffered from the "1st year in new bed/wet conditions/not ideal drainage w/clay soil" syndrome. Crying
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Jan 5, 2013 12:53 AM CST
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
Garden Art Birds Dog Lover Cat Lover Region: Pacific Northwest Hummingbirder
I always feel so bad when I loose plants! So sending warm fuzzy's your way Bev and Tarev Group hug
I tip my hat to you.
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Jan 5, 2013 4:51 AM CST
Name: Carole
Clarksville, TN (Zone 6b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Avid Green Pages Reviewer
I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar Garden Ideas: Master Level Cat Lover Birds Region: Tennessee Echinacea
So far, I'm losing my Aloe vera this year now that it has been well below freezing at night - the two big containers are too large to move inside. Well, I needed to start a smaller one anyway. Rolling my eyes.
I garden for the pollinators.
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Jan 5, 2013 1:48 PM CST
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Give PEACE a chance!
Adeniums Cat Lover Garden Photography Region: California Houseplants Plays in the sandbox
Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Composter Cactus and Succulents Dragonflies Hummingbirder
Thanks Greg warm fuzzies always welcome Smiling

Tee, I also have one little aloe vera, so far it is struggling too, but much better than what happened to my aloinopsis. Since it is a fairly small aloe, it is in a very small container, and I have placed it backed into a cement slab for some added warmth. But it is struggling, won't open its leaves, very tightly shut, compared to my crassulas that have their leaves wide open and plump during this chilly weather. If this Aloe survives, I will keep it in indoors next time.

Bev, I feel your pain when they go mushy..can you still uproot them and put them in smaller containers maybe, and add some perlite or I also use kanuma soil to mix with my succulents media to make it more fast draining. During the late part of November when rains & winds have been coming some succulent containers of mine got toppled over, so I had to do a quick repot and it came as a blessing in disguise of sorts, had to loosen up the soil, allowed more air to dry them up and repositioned the container in a sunnier side. The plants are thriving much better now in the cold Big Grin
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Jan 5, 2013 2:22 PM CST
Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Container Gardener Foliage Fan Sempervivums Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Garden Ideas: Master Level
tarev, I am an emotional gardener Crying and when I see mush, I pull and toss. That's not to say that after your advice when I see transparent (one step before mush) I can't stop, think and then uproot and replant into smaller container. I think I will go outside now and take a wiser (thanks to you) look at the bed outside and make a more informed decision.... Glare (smiley is not glaring, but is just missing the "finger-to-corner-of-mouth" and thinking deep).

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