I go in and out of this forum...

Some may remember me for my small 425 gallon raised pond in my backyard since 2017.



Last May (2021) we started an 8500 square foot Food Forest in the field behind our house and backyard, and we have decided to build a pond to grow more water plants and attract more wildlife. We only started building the pond in the past week or so.

It will be 15 x 10 when finished with a 15" wide x 12" deep shelf all the way around the perimeter, another level at 24", and a final level at least 30". Since it is down in the field behind our house, and there is no electricity unless we run a line, we have decided to use a solar pump that is rated for 900 gph. (https://www.solariverusa.com/p...) This pump will be used solely for aeration and water movement. We are not planning any filter at this time. We plan to heavily plant the pond to help with water quality.

We are closely following the advice of Robert Pavlis in his book Building Natural Ponds: Create a Clean, Algae Free Pond without Pumps, Filters, or Chemicals and his Building Natural Ponds playlist on YouTube channel at https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

Since the area is filled with shale pieces and has a shale shelf running underneath, we started by digging a test whole of 30" to see if it would be viable to build a pond in the area we picked out without hitting solid rock. About 18 inches down there is real good clay which holds water well, but rather than having to "treat" the first 18" of the walls, we decided to use a 45mil Firestone EDPM liner.

There is a 13.5 inch drop between the high side and low side, so we will be building up the low side and taper it down to the high side. To do this, we ill be using concrete blocks that will eventually be covered with clay and have a sloped area behind them that we will use for planting herbs.

We will be digging the pond by hand with the aid of an electric jackhammer. We are both 66 y/o, so we need all the help we can get! Even at this age, we do everything by hand on our property.



Here are a few pics of our progress so far. I welcome any questions, comments and/or suggestions.

Looks like an interesting project. Keep us updated.

I think with just over a foot of difference in elevation I would either dig the high side a bit deeper and landscape around the berm, or use what you excavate from the hole to raise the lower side, sloping gradually away from it on all sides until you run out of material. Of course, if I were doing it, I'd put in a small waterfall on the upslope.

I'll watch for more on your progress. 66 is plenty young for building ponds. Can't let the young'uns have all the fun.

psa said: Looks like an interesting project. Keep us updated.

I think with just over a foot of difference in elevation I would either dig the high side a bit deeper and landscape around the berm, or use what you excavate from the hole to raise the lower side, sloping gradually away from it on all sides until you run out of material. Of course, if I were doing it, I'd put in a small waterfall on the upslope.

I'll watch for more on your progress. 66 is plenty young for building ponds. Can't let the young'uns have all the fun.

I actually did think about digging the high side deeper, but opted to build up the lower side. I am going to use the dirt I dig out to raise up the lower side, gradually sloping away all around until everything is level. Since I don't know my arse from our elbow when it comes to building ponds, I thought those heavy concrete blocks in the last picture would help reinforce the lowest part when covered with the dirt. Do you think they are necessary or are they overkill?

Still on the fence about a waterfall...

Young'uns!

Oh, burying the blocks. I'm seriously not qualified to say how that will affect soil stability. I want to say they're overkill, but I just don't know what I'm talking about.

As for waterfalls, I like moving water, and they're free aeration.

The tops of the blocks will have a modest layer of dirt to level everything off which will then get covered with the liner. The back of the blocks will be covered with dirt on a slope. The block faces will be the side of the pond on the lower side. I thought this might be better than trying to build up with soil alone on the lower side. My thought was the blocks will give the retaining part of the lower side more "umph" with the concrete blocks buried in the wall, and also allows to have a more vertical drop into the pond on that side, rather than "sloping" into the pond if I used dirt alone.

Your post got me looking online last night at waterfalls. Seems pretty involved building your own waterfall from scratch. Have you done that, or do you use one of the preformed ones that can be hidden by rocks?

I see preformed waterfalls can be quite pricey and many also serve as a filter utilizing filter pads, bio balls, etc., but simple spillways are much more reasonable in cost and can create a simple waterfall effect. I am tending to shy aware from a fountain for aeration because of the evaporation factor, but a simple spillway would make a nice little feature and give me the aeration I will need.

I do have a 550-gallon rainwater tank on order, but it won't arrive until Oct/Nov. The tank will be used to water the Food Forest (gravity fed from the hill above the FF), but since I can easily collect 50 - 60,000 gallons of rainwater per year from my roof, I plan to use the tank overflow to replenish the water in the pond (with a pond overflow if I get too much rain at once). I bought a 5 x 35-foot liner to create a riverbed to the pond that will carry the overflow down the hill.

Appreciate your input.

It's looking great, Jim. Ponds are so interesting. Water life in general, actually. Or maybe they're just so interesting to me because I don't have one, lol, or at least a filled one.

Keep us updated.

Just a note …When using cinder block building my small pond I also added gravel under them to allow for dampness and water drainage. The winter freeze cycle is a issue here. To keep them solid no slipping added rebar quick dry cement and attached the rebar together with heavy wire ties.

Water is a lot of weight going down hill and when it rains/snows the water goes everywhere some places we never imagined. Not to mention the wild critters that like to swim and search for food in ponds. The sound of water , 'Calling all creatures' !
It's a huge project and will be absolutely worth it…

Any plans for fish and water plants? What type of filter are you planning on using? Rocks to add once all the liner is in place it will really be beautiful when it's done and with the water fall , can't wait to see what plants you'll add. Be sure to add a few hardy water Lily's in a section of still water area in your pond and lots of shelves for water plants . The sound of water is delicious and hope a few solar lights for night will be added. And maybe a trail cam. Can't wait to see it completed…

For more info EscondidoCal has a great pond in….
Our Duck Pond The thread "Pool to Natural Pond Conversion" in Ponds and Water Gardening forum.
Sending good building vibes your way…

The blocks will have rebar driven in. I tamped a clay base for them to sit on and filled them with clay. I will probably throw in some feeder goldfish. That is what I put in my other pond back in 2017 and they are all between 6-10 inches now. Since I do not plan to use any filter at all, I will plant heavily with oxygenating plants. I expect to have algae problems the first year or so until the plants get established and grow; this is normal in a natural pond when not using a filter. I have a water lily in my smaller pond. While they help shade the water, they don't do much for oxygenating the water, so they will be added later if added at all. I am planning an 18" shelf around almost the entire perimeter. Trail cam would be a waist since the 8500 square foot food forest is completely fenced in with a physical fence and electric fence. Same with lights since the pond is about 200 feet from my house. I am very familiar with Cal's work. He has a wonderful pond. Thanks for the good vibes!

Sounds like a good plan can't wait to see it all when it's done…

Well, we have been going back and forth the past few days....

Finally decided, we don't want to build up the low end the full 14 inches. We think the slope on the lower side would just look too "artificial". So, we decided to compromise. We are going to keep the 8-inch blocks on the lower side and dig the higher side 6 inches deeper.

Here are a few pics of the lower side with some blocks placed to bring it up to the 14 inch level (blocks not placed in final position...just to get an idea). Don't like the exaggerated height.







So, we will eliminate those extra blocks and keep the lower side at 8 inches with those concrete blocks on the bottom. We will dig the high side an extra 6 inches deep to make everything level. On the shelf on the high side, we will stack rocks up above the water line to give it a natural look.

We got some more digging done today but had to stop by noon. The temps and humidity were just too much. I was going to take updated pics, but I never got back down there this afternoon. I will post more pics tomorrow.

After checking out all your property projects on Rumble …
Lots of great designs and great ideas and well thought out. You have a knack for building just about anything you decide to take on.

bumplbea said: After checking out all your property projects on Rumble …
Lots of great designs and great ideas and well thought out. You have a knack for building just about anything you decide to take on.

Thank you!

Wow looks like a great project. Wish i lived closer, i would love to help. Ponds can really bring a yard to life and attract wildlife [good and bad]. Good luck with the project and post pics of progress.

jpm995 said: Wow looks like a great project. Wish i lived closer, i would love to help. Ponds can really bring a yard to life and attract wildlife [good and bad]. Good luck with the project and post pics of progress.

Thanks, Jim. I will post pics as we make progress. Nothing has been done since the middle of last week as I am battling a flareup of gout and wearing work shoes is quite uncomfortable. Each day I feel a little better, so I am hoping to get back at it by Wednesday of this week.

Happy 4th of July!

Between the heat and our seasonal business, not much has been happening with the pond lately. Here is where we are at this point.

I need some feedback from you folks that have much more expertise than I ever will...

The digging of our food forest pond is way behind the schedule I was hoping for because of the heat we have been having the past few weeks and because the busy season for our home business crept up on us before we knew it.

Realistically, I don't see us finishing the dig until late August or early September. As I mentioned previously, we will have a small solar powered waterfall for oxygenation but no true filter. We also plan to have a lot of oxygenating plants. We do plan to inoculate the pond with some water from our small, raised pond, but we are limited in how much we can take out of the small pond since it is only 425 gallons. I could take some water from a local pond, but I don't want to risk any problems since I don't know what be lurking in these other ponds.

Is there any pond bacteria product on the market that any of you use and know is legitimate? Is it worth it using a commercial pond bacteria?

Also, since this pond realistically will not be filled until the fall, would I be better off waiting until the spring before I fill it since the plants will be doing little as the late fall/winter get here (zone 6b). I guess what I am asking here is there an ideal time to start up a pond?

With no biological filter, keep the fish load small and you should be okay. That said, fish are really the pickiest about cycle times. It's hard to fully break the six week rule on nitrogen cycle bacteria, whatever you do, but plants are usually okay to go in the first week. I don't have any use for commercial bacteria products because I find ponds have to self-balance either way, but I won't gainsay anyone who reports different experiences with them.

I like to take it slow with a new pond making small additions over time as I learn the patterns, but it's hard to overdo plants if you're willing to take them out or thin later if needed. On the other hand, a lot of newly potted plants can bring extra nutrients with them since the soil hasn't been fully locked down and colonized.

I can't tell you whether to wait or not. You will save yourself winterizing and spring cleaning if you wait, but that excuse could be used every year to never start a pond. I don't know where your plants are coming from--some are better divided in the spring. I guess if it were me, I'd fill it up, get familiar with it, and then decide come freezing weather whether to drain it and cover it for a new startup in spring, or keep it filled through its first winter.

Thanks for that input, Paul. I appreciate it.

Good to know about the plants and the bacteria self-balancing. I thought I would have to wait to put plants until there was a nutrient buildup for them to use. I know I have to wait on the fish, and I don't plan to put in that many. I may even wait until the Spring to add fish if I fill this Fall. I put 10 feeder comets in my 425-gallon pond in April 2017 and they are 6-10 inches in size now. They do well, but I have a filter that cycles the water more than 2x per hour. This pond, when finished will be about 1600-1800 gallons, but I will probably just start with 10 feeders in it as well and see how things develop.

Initially, I plan to put in good oxygenating plants like Elodea, Hornwart, Frogbit, Cabomba, and Brooklime (if I can find this last one here in the US which I haven't been able to do so far), and most I will just float. Ornamental plants will come later around the shelves and perhaps a water lily or two, so I don't have to worry about soil nutrients right off the bat.

I really would like to see the pond filled during the Fall. I was just wondering if there were any significant drawbacks with this kind of mechanical-filterless pond. I am not expecting to have a crystal-clear pond by any stretch of the imagination, and that's OK. On the other hand, I don't want a pond where I can't see anything. I'm sure it will be a delicate balance. The purpose will be to attract more wildlife and eventually try my hand at edible water plants.

I have been watching a lot of YouTube videos on natural and food forest ponds. I also bought the book Building Natural Ponds by Robert Pavlis. He has several YouTube videos.

It certainly will be a learning experience for me, just like the small pond has been, but that's half the fun of a pond.

We are all pond lovers and enjoy the water features that we add to our gardens. Different strokes for different folks. I would fill your pond with water asap. Give it time to settle in and observe over the winter.

I keep mine running 24/7. I had a bio filter to help hold and disperse the natural elements to maintain a natural balance in each pond. I removed them and it didn't seem to make much difference once the ponds were balanced.

I never shut the ponds down as long as the pump is working the flow of water is moving they have never frozen. I put in a larger than needed pump in for this reason.

The koi are air suckers and in winters hibernate and they have nice covey holes to hide in that raccoons cannot reach. Something to consider if adding fish they keep skeeters away. I also have Plecostomus fish or catfish are bottom feeders they are great for debris at the bottom.

In my experience any plant you add will adjust before winter and go dormant . They will be fine if added later this season once water is balanced. They are all still on their own natural calendars when winter comes.

It's always a learning curve as the water and plants adjust. The bright sunny 😎 days of summers and warm temps will have its issues with water moss..algae. If you are considerin g a green pond that's ok or like a clear pond. Either way there is a balance once everything settles and adjusts over time.
Hope this helps a bit.
Anxiously awaiting this pond construction to be complete.

Bea, do your plecos make it through the winter? What sort of catfish? Corys?