Daylilies forum: Breakthoughs in daylily culture

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Name: Charlie
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hementia
Sep 3, 2010 2:58 PM CST
Lets discuss where the breaks came from
I believe ruffled tet daylilies originated with Virginia Pecks DANCE BALLERINA DANCE 76 with 258 kids and Munson's FRED HAM 82 with 63 kids
i think the dark picotee edges originated with ELIZABETH ANNE HUDSON Munson 75 and Marsh's PICOTEE series
I believe ruffles in dips originated with BARBARA MITCHELL,Pierce 84
Any ideas on this and where other breaks came such as teeth,multi eyed,patterns,double and tripple edge
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Name: Fred Manning
Lillian Alabama

Charter ATP Member Region: Gulf Coast I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Seller of Garden Stuff Dog Lover Region: United States of America
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spunky1
Sep 4, 2010 4:59 AM CST
Good subject Charlie, wish I could remember a little more of what I have learned in the pass twenty years.
I would have to say the Lee Gates had the best reds in his day and his Scarlet Orbit is still used today as the standard for red daylilies.
I think Pat Stamile had the biggest break in daylilies I will see in my lifetime with his Admirals Braid which came from his own Wedding Band. Registered in 1990 it was the daylily to have if you were a hybridizer. It was the first daylily I paid $150 for(two years after it was released) and had to buy it from someone else because Pat was sold out. I think it was the most used tet in the 90s, if you look in the background of today's modern daylilies many will go back to AB. With its gold edge and blue eyed gene it changed the whole look of daylilies.
Name: Juli
(Zone 5b)
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daylily
Sep 4, 2010 11:55 AM CST
Being able to convert Grand Masterpiece to Tet certainly had a big influence on today's purples. Moldovan and Hanson got some wonderful purples out of it. I know someone else used it too at that time - but the name escapes me ...

Did anyone have teeth before Brother Reckamp? I don't recall any that pre-date his. Techny Spider was 1987 and it had teeth.


Edited to add that the third user of Tet G. M. early on may have been Carpenter. Had a discussion with a friend, and that name seemed to ring a bell.
Name: Charlie
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Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Daylilies Vegetable Grower Seller of Garden Stuff Ponds
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hementia
Sep 5, 2010 7:21 AM CST
I agrre with Fred and Juli regarding WEDDING BAND,ADMIRAL'S BRAID, SCARLET ORBIT and TET GRAND MASTEPIECE and like to add tet RUFFLED MASTERPIECE and BETTY WARREN WOODS
As far as teeth are concerned I believe the dormants originated with YUMA,STARTLE and tet SPINDAZLE
The evergreens may have originated with FORTUNE DEAREST,FORBIDDEN FANTASY,SEA URCHIN or their parents.
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Name: Juli
(Zone 5b)
Region: United States of America Charter ATP Member Cottage Gardener Daylilies Garden Photography Enjoys or suffers cold winters
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daylily
Sep 5, 2010 8:19 AM CST
I don't recall Yuma having teeth when I grew it, but that was a LONG time ago - and maybe they need warmth of the south to happen. I had to look up Startle as I remember when it came out. I didn't think it was all that "old"... 1988....

I've been at this a long time Whistling Whistling
Name: Charlie
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hementia
Sep 5, 2010 1:18 PM CST
Here is Yuma as bloomed in my garden a few years ago.
I have never seen teeth on SPINDAZZLE or its conversion however a sleeping gene must exist
.Thumb of 2010-09-05/hementia/1e0c1b
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Name: Fred Manning
Lillian Alabama

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spunky1
Sep 6, 2010 6:43 AM CST
I know very little about toothy flowers because I haven't messed with them a lot. I have lucked up and got a couple over the years but never pursued that line. They just never appealed to me.
Other than teeth I think the green daylily is the latest hunt in Tet daylilies. There have been green dips for a number of years so I think the Green One will be a lot easier to produce than the Blue, which I dont think anyone is close to a real Blue yet. The closest thing I have seen to Green Tets have been in Larry Grace's greenhouse, and he is working hard toward a true green that will hold its color in the sun.
Name: Juli
(Zone 5b)
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daylily
Sep 6, 2010 8:11 AM CST
I saw a seedling at Moldovan's a year or two before he passed away that had the glitter edge - but it was mauve/rose glitter. The base of the flower color was pink to rose, and it was trimmed with this wire mauve edge. Never saw anything like it. Was hoping we would start to see the glitter edges show in more colors.
_______________
These are not past breakthroughs --- but I think they will be seen as important in the future...

I hope that the forms that Curt is working with will really turn into something that is different and that people enjoy. They are so different, people seem to have a hard time understanding them, but I find them fascinating. They are so three-dimensional. Mother Upduff is one of my favorites for the ones that have the petals standing up, and I love Neutron Star. I don't grow either of them yet, but have seen them during selection at Curt's for several years.

This is Mother Upduff

Thumb of 2010-09-06/daylily/8b8134

a view of one of my seedlings that has this petals up appearance. I made the selection in 2001, so it has been around a while. It comes from all Hanson lines. Similar to Mother Upduff, but does not have the great plant that Mother Upduff has. Plant is ok, but budcount is under 20. The petals curl around so much, you can see them - this is not a symptom of a flower that is not opening, or haning... it is a trait that is consistent, in all weathers, over many years. The petals are SO pinched, that the petal tissue curls under the petal, creating a tunnel that you can stick your finger down in. Granted, this is not a finished flower, by any means... but it passes on this trait, and Curt has many things similar - he has taken this look and ran with it.... I did not get to see his garden this year, but I understand he has a lot of exciting things coming in this form. I think we are just beginning to open up the box of possibilities of what this form can show us.

Thumb of 2010-09-06/daylily/6a2eab

Then, of course there is the weirdness of Sigourney..... again, not everyone's cup of tea, but a beginning of what is to come.
Thumb of 2010-09-06/daylily/5d0171

Neutron Star - photo from Bob O'Neal. Neutron Star takes the Anastasia look to extreme - and puts it on a good plant. Anastasia barely survived here. Neutron Star looks flat in this photo, but actually, the petals stick up quite a ways from the sepals before recurving.

Thumb of 2010-09-06/daylily/cd624e
Name: Fred Manning
Lillian Alabama

Charter ATP Member Region: Gulf Coast I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Seller of Garden Stuff Dog Lover Region: United States of America
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spunky1
Sep 6, 2010 10:43 AM CST
Very interesting stuff Juli, I haven't seen any of these in person but I do like the form of Neutron Star. This is Abilene Crab Claws by Tommy Maddox. Here the sepals point up all the time. I grow it but personally don't care for that form, but it is different. Thumb of 2010-09-06/spunky1/1ea79f
Name: Juli
(Zone 5b)
Region: United States of America Charter ATP Member Cottage Gardener Daylilies Garden Photography Enjoys or suffers cold winters
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daylily
Sep 6, 2010 10:44 AM CST
Supreme Empire always did that. I didn't much care for it... although I still have the plant, I was always glad when a seedling from it did not have that trait.
Name: pam
gainesville fl (Zone 8b)
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gardenglory
Sep 7, 2010 9:33 AM CST
I find this so interesting, wish I could share. Im in the learning stage. Im wondering if new things just happen, or are there certain things that people know they want, but jjust havent been able to do them.

After going to the daylily show, my first, I have totally different ideas on what I would like to make. Im after some miniature poly's. Miniatures seem to win big, which makes sense, since nothing can touch anything. Their size make that easier.
Also, the poly table was totally empty.
Some nice big 6 x 6 poly's wouldnt hurt my feeling either. Ill let Leslie work on that.
Name: Sunny
Ohio (Zone 5b)
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sunday
Sep 7, 2010 8:41 PM CST
Gardenglory, I would imagine it is a little of both. I'm sure new and unusual things pop up in people's gardens all of the time. Whether, whatever that trait may be is up to the hybridizer to decide that he or she finds it intrigueing enough to hang on to it and see where they can go with it. Then, I would think an idea or a direction may lead to looking for advancements in that area.
Like so many people working on teeth now, and blue, and,...

I really think imagination and thought can probably take you about anywhere.
Name: Charlie
MS.
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Daylilies Vegetable Grower Seller of Garden Stuff Ponds
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hementia
Sep 8, 2010 7:23 AM CST
With teeth showing up in doubles it wont be long before we see pom-poms like that in the football mums.
Here is a couple of unusual ones I had hoped to do somethig with, to no avail
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Thumb of 2010-09-08/hementia/78f909
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Name: Cynthia (Cindy)
Melvindale, Mi (Zone 5b)
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Hemlady
Sep 8, 2010 7:30 AM CST
Very nice Charlie!!!
Lighthouse Gardens
Name: Charlie
MS.
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Daylilies Vegetable Grower Seller of Garden Stuff Ponds
Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Birds Farmer Seed Starter Plant and/or Seed Trader Dog Lover
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hementia
Sep 8, 2010 9:42 AM CST
Here is another that did not repeat often or throw this trait
Thumb of 2010-09-08/hementia/d73a51
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Name: Fred Manning
Lillian Alabama

Charter ATP Member Region: Gulf Coast I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Seller of Garden Stuff Dog Lover Region: United States of America
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spunky1
Sep 9, 2010 10:43 AM CST
There is no more poly classification at shows, they are now placed with the doubles. This was an AHS decision a couple years ago. Any thing with more than three pedals and three sepals has to be shown with the doubles. I think its strange also, but thats the way we judges have to look at them now. The orange one of Charlies would now be a double.
Name: Cary Peterson
Woods Cross (Zone 5b)
The Gardener at home and online.
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CaryPeterson
Sep 9, 2010 9:23 PM CST
I like this thread! Smiling I would like to know what are some of the NEW traits people are seeing today. Who has something worth saying, "Oh wow I have never seen this before in a daylily. "
My Daylilies makes me happy!
Name: Kathy
Southcentral PA.
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kathysflowerpatch
Sep 24, 2010 8:45 AM CST
Well nothing new here as far as traits go. Here is some I like to use , Fringed Catawba , pic was taken early in the season so not the best and Etched Gold Blessings. I do like the teeth on these two.
I love to dabble and am like a little kid at Christmas when those buds begin to open for the first time on the seedlings, have not so far gotten anything overly unique. Just a hobby for me.

Scarlet Orbit , I agree is one of the best reds. I had it planted 2 clumps S O with 3 clumps of Weston's Jumpstart , nice red with that white edge. Oh was that a show
!Thumb of 2010-09-24/kathysflowerpatch/41797f
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Name: Kathy
Southcentral PA.
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kathysflowerpatch
Sep 24, 2010 9:04 AM CST
Here is an older seedling , unknown x unknown . This one was the best bloomer, blooming from late June until the beginning of this month,high bud count. It is now loaded with seed pods which I must get off soon. I like the color, form is nothing new but the color if you could see it in person is amazing and stands out.Thumb of 2010-09-24/kathysflowerpatch/62e340
Thumb of 2010-09-24/kathysflowerpatch/bfd42e this one I like don't know what form you would call it? Kinda wacky
Name: Charlie
MS.
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Daylilies Vegetable Grower Seller of Garden Stuff Ponds
Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Birds Farmer Seed Starter Plant and/or Seed Trader Dog Lover
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hementia
Sep 24, 2010 1:28 PM CST
Kathy Your last one is a spatulate,pinched crispate uf

Fred have they made changes in the Judging Daylilies Handbook since 2006
We have been putting polytepals in the first 4 category according to size.
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