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Mar 24, 2014 11:42 AM CST
Name: Tara
NE. FL. (Zone 9a)
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Thumbs up Sounds like a plan! Good luck with it! Green Grin! Would love to see your progress as you go forward with it! Thumbs up
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Mar 24, 2014 11:44 AM CST

Plumerias Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator
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Can you get free mulch delivered? Tree trimmers often will do this rather than pay to have it dumped.
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Mar 24, 2014 11:55 AM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
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For goodness sake cover it before you have to mow it! Good luck!
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Mar 24, 2014 11:55 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Hetty, I'm working on that. We live a long way from the tree trimmer, and they said that they do need a place to dump the chips if they are in our area, so I'm going to work on getting that set up. We're in a very rural area, so it's unlikely that they will be in our area very often, but I'll take all the free wood chips I can get. They don't deliver to our area because it's so far away, but they do work closer to our area occasionally. They do have a mulch lot though, where their business is, so they don't have to pay to dump it. The truck would fill up though, and driving from our area to their lot, just to empty their truck, would take too much time.
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Mar 24, 2014 11:56 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Dog Lover Daylilies Irises Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Hummingbirder
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@porkpal, that's what I'm thinking!! Hilarious!
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Mar 26, 2014 10:23 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Dog Lover Daylilies Irises Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Hummingbirder
Frogs and Toads Native Plants and Wildflowers Cottage Gardener Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Xeriscape
@lovemyhouse Debra, if it helps any, I've always been told that you should make the newspaper 9 or 10 layers thick, in order to kill the grass. I think it's something that is taught in the master gardener class, as every master gardener I've known has mentioned that. I have no idea how many layers you would need to kill Bermuda grass, but maybe that would be enough? This is the method that I use between my rows of daylilies, and it works well. There is no grass in the area, but it does keep the weeds under control.
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Mar 27, 2014 12:13 AM CST
Name: Tim Hoover
Elysian FIelds, Texas (Zone 8a)
Beekeeper Ponds Region: Texas Seller of Garden Stuff
Better living through modern chemistry.
Before I would do anything with cardboard ect. I would go on into my local farm store and look for a weed killer that has only Glyphosate in it. This is what RoundUp is (RoundUp is simply an expensive brand name for a cheap chemical ). Skip the brand name stuff. This will go a long way in making sure Bindweed ect. does not rear its ugly face later. In about 10 days, most stuff will be good and dead. You will need a cheap hand pump sprayer to go with this.
You can then plant or, if you still want to, go ahead and smother. Make sure that if you use Glyphosate, there is good growth on the weeds/grass. It is a contact only herbicide- if there is very little leaf area, it will not be as effective. It does not have any residual ability nor does it remain in the soil.
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Mar 27, 2014 1:03 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Dog Lover Daylilies Irises Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Hummingbirder
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Thanks Tim, but I'm still against using chemicals of any kind in this area. The only thing I would insist on spraying is the bindweed, but it hasn't started growing yet. I do appreciate the information though. I'm actually wanting the bindweed to start growing, which I never thought I would say. I do want to spray it before smothering the lawn. Luckily, there isn't much of it yet, and it seems to be taking its time growing this year.
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Mar 27, 2014 8:20 AM CST
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
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Tim, there is one area close by this bed where I might have to go the chemical route, so I appreciate the information. I have a feed-and-seed store very close to me and I will check with them for availability. Smiling

Natalie, I used 2-3 layers of cardboard, not sure how that would translate into sheets of paper, but sound like it is at least as much. Smiling
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Mar 27, 2014 8:44 AM CST
Name: Ken Ramsey
Vero Beach, FL (Zone 10a)
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I would guess that 2-3 layers of cardboard is equal to 6-10 layers of newspaper.
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Mar 27, 2014 8:46 AM CST
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Name: Dave Whitinger
Southlake, Texas (Zone 8a)
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The nice thing about cardboard is that it's more open. The corrugation lets water and air seep throughout and aids in the breaking down. With newspaper, I find that they tend to mat together and form an impenetrable barrier to water and anything else. I've had newspaper still be readable after being buried for a year! While cardboard is always broken down and gone within 6 months.
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Mar 27, 2014 9:25 AM CST
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
Rescue dogs: Angels with paws needi
Dragonflies Dog Lover Bookworm I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Photography Bee Lover
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Thank you. Smiling
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Mar 27, 2014 10:09 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Dog Lover Daylilies Irises Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Hummingbirder
Frogs and Toads Native Plants and Wildflowers Cottage Gardener Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Xeriscape
Thanks Dave! That is really interesting! I'll have to check and see how my layers are doing. I used newsprint paper, without ink, and I'm not sure if that will work differently, but I'll find out in a year.
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Mar 27, 2014 10:23 AM CST
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
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My newspaper decomposed very quickly, but I did wet it as I laid it down and kept the area moist.
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Mar 27, 2014 10:58 AM CST
Name: greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
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Just to get this clear - when talking about 'layers' of newspaper,
some people may think a layer is one single sheet of paper; others think a layer is a section of newspaper, or more.

Either way, I believe @dave is correct about the cardboard being better than newspaper, in my experience.

I hadn't chimed in earlier because I went the old fashioned route, working slowly and steadily in small amounts, using a shovel to lift and turn each piece of sod up side down - each a good healthy shovel full with all the roots - then lay the overlapping cardboard, then compost and mulch. Plant a 'first year' crop directly into the top layer of organic material and wait for year two to dig any deeper. That's how my dad did it and it has worked for me. Plus I can do this alone, without overburdening DH (which in my case is dead husband!) and feel pride in my solo accomplishment. But that's just my two cent's worth.
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Mar 27, 2014 11:00 AM CST
Garden.org Admin
Name: Dave Whitinger
Southlake, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Seed Starter Vegetable Grower Tomato Heads Vermiculture Garden Research Contributor
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frostweed said:My newspaper decomposed very quickly, but I did wet it as I laid it down and kept the area moist.


I'm sure that helps a lot.

When I do the cardboard, I lay it down dry and never wet it. Laziness. The rain and irrigation end up getting it moist eventually.
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Mar 27, 2014 12:19 PM CST
Plants Admin
Name: Rob Duval
Milford, New Hampshire (Zone 5b)
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Are we talking single or double walled cardboard? And does anyone know what type of glue is used to put cardboard together? Is that stuff safely breaking down as well? I've always wondered that but have always assumed it must be ok since this method has been used by so many for so long.
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Mar 27, 2014 1:04 PM CST
Garden.org Admin
Name: Dave Whitinger
Southlake, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Seed Starter Vegetable Grower Tomato Heads Vermiculture Garden Research Contributor
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Region: Ukraine Garden Sages
I'll use any cardboard. Double wall is my favorite, though. As for the glue, I have no idea.
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Mar 27, 2014 1:07 PM CST
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
Rescue dogs: Angels with paws needi
Dragonflies Dog Lover Bookworm I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Photography Bee Lover
Plays in the sandbox Butterflies Region: Texas Garden Sages I sent a postcard to Randy! Charter ATP Member
Plus outside printing/coating. Much of the cardboard I put down is from diaper boxes (so what else would I do with it? Hilarious! ). Unless one is talking about tons of boxes, I don't know that the quantities of ink and/or glue would be a significant factor? Just my opinion, though.
It’s okay to not know all the answers.
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Mar 27, 2014 1:34 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Dog Lover Daylilies Irises Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Hummingbirder
Frogs and Toads Native Plants and Wildflowers Cottage Gardener Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Xeriscape
The majority of my boxes are double walled. Some have more ink than others. No idea what is in the ink, or the glue. We know where glue comes from, and I would think that it would break down, but I'm less worried about the glue and ink than I am chemicals. Who knows? Maybe the ink and glue is actually worse. Either way, I'm not going to worry about it. I've had great success in the past doing things this way, and I know it works. I've never lost a plant where I've used this method, so I have to think that the ink and glue is safe. But, I've never planted veggies in a bed that I've done this in. Since I'll be planted some veggies in this area before the grass is probably completely dead, I'm still not worried about it. I'll remove that section of grass by hand, and will mulch. The cardboard probably won't be broken down by then, so if there is anything harmful, which I doubt, it will be removed anyway.

I think our puppy would be dead if the ink and glue was harmful. He's been chewing on the boxes for a week now, and still going strong. Hilarious!

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