Ask a Question forum: 238th Street Ivy: retail source in NYC

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SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 8:36 AM CST
Our garden committee needs some more 238th St. Ivy, but we don't know what retailers in town sell it these days. Plant info at the Botanical Garden suggested that you might have some contact information.

Thank you,

Susan Tabor
taborsusan@gmail.com
711 Amsterdam Ave., NYC
Name: Dave Whitinger
Jacksonville, Texas (Zone 8b)
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dave
Apr 1, 2014 8:41 AM CST

Garden.org Admin

Hi Susan, I'd never heard of this variety of ivy before. We do have an entry for it in our database, although the entry is completely devoid of any details. English Ivy (Hedera helix '238th Street')

Hopefully someone here knows something about it and especially where to buy it. You'd think it'd be available somewhere.

SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 9:16 AM CST
Thanks for your reply, Dave. If you can find someone there with some further information, please let me know. This is the toughest form of English Ivy we've found. A NYBG gardener found it years ago, climbing up a church wall on 238th St., in the Bronx. It's extremely cold and wind resistant.
Name: woofie
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woofie
Apr 1, 2014 9:24 AM CST
I did a little looking around and the only place I found that claimed to have it is in Wisconsin. They don't appear to do mail order and are closed till April 19, but it might be worth a call then.
http://www.theflowerfactorynursery.com/search-perennials.asp...
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obliqua
Apr 1, 2014 11:00 AM CST
I looked online and found:

This ivy is Hedera Helix 'Baltica'.

[url=www.classygroundcovers.com/]www.classygroundcovers.com/[/url] carries this ivy.
Name: Dave Whitinger
Jacksonville, Texas (Zone 8b)
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dave
Apr 1, 2014 11:12 AM CST

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A 1981 article from the NY Times says:

Many of the vines that hold their shiny green leaves all year long are sold labeled simply as ''English ivy,'' but not all of these are very resistant to extreme cold. There are two tough varieties to look for specifically. One of these is called Baltic ivy (Hedera helix baltica) and the other, which is even more hardy, has the unlikely name of ''238th Street'' (Hedera helix 238th Street).


http://www.nytimes.com/1981/07/23/garden/gardening-vines-in-...

SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 11:17 AM CST
Thanks to both oblique & Dave. Obliqua, see Dave's quote from the Times to see the difference between Baltica $ 238th St. varieties. If I can't find the 238th St., I'll take your link for the Baltica. Thanks again!

Susan

Name: Deb
Pacific Northwest (Zone 8b)
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Bonehead
Apr 1, 2014 11:18 AM CST
Warm welcome from the Pacific Northwest, Susan. We have a horrible time with escaped English Ivy (Hedera helix) in our neck of the woods. It has literally swallowed up some of our mature parks, climbing the trees and scrambling through the underbrush. Just a caution. It may not be a problem in your area. Once established, though, it is very difficult to eradicate (I unknowingly planted some years ago, soon realized it was not a good plant for me, and am still pulling out upstarts). Hopefully the named cultivars are less exhuberant about taking over the world!
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[Last edited by Bonehead - Apr 1, 2014 11:20 AM (+)]
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Name: Dave Whitinger
Jacksonville, Texas (Zone 8b)
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dave
Apr 1, 2014 11:19 AM CST

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I tip my hat to you.

Classy Groundcovers is a good source. I'd suggest you contact them and see if they can find a supplier. If anyone can, I bet they could.

SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 1:38 PM CST
Thanks, Dave, I will try it.

@Bonehead: We grow these plants in pots; they don't escape.

Susan
Name: Greene
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greene
Apr 1, 2014 1:47 PM CST
It might be called 'Ripple'; I found that in a book as an alternate name for 238th St Ivy.
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Name: Deb
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Bonehead
Apr 1, 2014 1:49 PM CST
@SusanTabor - thank you for the clarification. I was not at all being critical and hope you did not take offense - just adding caution from my experience in the PNW (English ivy may well be a non-issue on the east coast). Some plants just give one a 'yikes' reaction -- I find I have to rather hide my cultivation of Bishop's Weed (Aegopodium podagraria 'Variegatum') as it is a loathsome invasive for many folks, but is not any problem for me. Looking forward to your posts and pictures, and again welcome to ATP. Deb
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Name: Rick Corey
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RickCorey
Apr 1, 2014 2:51 PM CST
Hi Susan!

I found a claim that "Sprainbrook Nursery" used to sell it, but they've been out of business for some time.

I wonder if this would help you propagate the plants you have left? If cuttings from adult plants won't root, maybe this would let you revert one plant or one shoot, and then take cuttings from it.

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2439564?uid=3739960&ui...

American Journal of Botany © 1960 Botanical Society of America
Abstract:

Plants of arborescent Hedera helix sprayed with gibberellic acid produced juvenile shoots. Juvenile characters appeared in December to March from applications of gibberellic acid made from May to July. Gibberellic acid modified inflorescences toward a vegetative condition. Previous reports that seeds of arborescent Hedera helix produce juvenile plants were confirmed. Seedlings of a variant, Hedera helix `238th Street,' which has adult-shaped leaves on a vine type of growth produced vines with lobed leaves. Heavy pruning of arborescent Hedera helix caused the production of juvenile shoots.

SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 5:30 PM CST
My goodness, what fun this day has been! Thanks to all of you for your input. I have emailed my horticulturalist at the Frick Collection, where I work,, to see if any of our providers - one of which, I think, used to be Sprainbrook - , has access to 238th St. Ivy. It's really funny, because we used to be able to get it everywhere.

And yes, Rick, we might be able to propagate from our existing plant. I think we were looking for an easy out…..as I say, it used to be so easy to find this cultivar.

Susan
Name: Karen
Cincinnati, Oh (Zone 6a)
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kqcrna
Apr 1, 2014 5:35 PM CST
We're just a fun bunch, Susan.

Welcome!

Karen

SusanTabor
Apr 1, 2014 5:58 PM CST
You are, you are, and with good suggestions and contacts!
Name: Rick Corey
Everett WA 98204 (Zone 8a)
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RickCorey
Apr 1, 2014 6:06 PM CST
I understand!

If you can't buy it and HAVE to propagate your own, you might offer it back to the vendors who no longer carry it.

With seeds, at least, pointing out that a variety "was almost lost forever" gives it a big slaes bump.

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CindiKS
Apr 4, 2014 11:58 AM CST
Hi Susan!
The Flower Factory in Wisconsin is a good lead. Someone should be there now, even if they aren't open, because they do grow most of their own plants.
Cindi
in windy, windy Wichita where we missed you at our sorry sorta lawn and garden show.
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SusanTabor
Apr 5, 2014 5:41 AM CST
Thank you, Cindi, I will definitely contact them.

Susan
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pirl
Apr 13, 2014 8:08 PM CST
Did you locate it, Susan?

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