Daylilies forum: Daylily Culture in Winter

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(Zone 7a)
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dormantsrule
Jul 7, 2014 8:45 AM CST
I mentioned on another thread that most of the 800 established cv's here have stunted scapes and I lost 38. Some cvs were reduced to pencil thin fans. Last week should have been peak and I only had 28 or so in bloom here in 7A.

Over the winter we had 6 ice storms within 5 weeks and a hailstorm May 21. Hail was the size of golf balls that dented cars. I really don't know which caused the stunted scapes or maybe both events did.

I'm wondering if ice affects the resting buds in winter??
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[Last edited by dormantsrule - Jul 25, 2014 12:37 PM (+)]
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Name: Gerry Donahue
Pleasant Lake, IN (Zone 5b)
Hostas Garden Ideas: Master Level
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profesora
Jul 7, 2014 9:09 AM CST
What are cvs?
Name: James
South Bend, IN (Zone 5b)
Hostas Enjoys or suffers cold winters Birds Seed Starter Annuals Region: Indiana
Region: United States of America Dog Lover Daylilies Container Gardener Plant and/or Seed Trader
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JWWC
Jul 7, 2014 9:13 AM CST
Cultivars?
Name: James
South Bend, IN (Zone 5b)
Hostas Enjoys or suffers cold winters Birds Seed Starter Annuals Region: Indiana
Region: United States of America Dog Lover Daylilies Container Gardener Plant and/or Seed Trader
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JWWC
Jul 7, 2014 9:15 AM CST
I don't know if it is ice but the winter certainly affects some. HAPPY HAPPY once again is alive and putting up scapes but they will be very very short again. I'm thinking of potting it up and bringing it indoors to see what it will do.
Name: Bob Watson
Terre Haute, IN (Zone 5b)
Daylilies
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BobW
Jul 7, 2014 9:16 AM CST
We have had a good spring here and have lots of scapes. Our garden is in south/central Indiana near the Illinois border. Minimal winter losses this spring. We have, however, noticed much lower than average buds per scape this year and wondered if that could be the effect of a bad winter, with two spells of fifteen below. Wondering if severe or sudden cold could kill the buds that form the scapes and/or the buds???

Sorry to hear about your lousy spring. Since these are established varieties, it sure seems like it was something in your winter or spring weather that affected them. I hope you have a good summer and the ones that are hanging in there will recover completely. Bob
Bob
(Zone 7a)
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dormantsrule
Jul 7, 2014 2:57 PM CST
BobW said:We have had a good spring here and have lots of scapes. Our garden is in south/central Indiana near the Illinois border. Minimal winter losses this spring. We have, however, noticed much lower than average buds per scape this year and wondered if that could be the effect of a bad winter, with two spells of fifteen below. Wondering if severe or sudden cold could kill the buds that form the scapes and/or the buds???

Sorry to hear about your lousy spring. Since these are established varieties, it sure seems like it was something in your winter or spring weather that affected them. I hope you have a good summer and the ones that are hanging in there will recover completely. Bob


I don't know when scapes start forming before we even see them but I'm guessing that the monster hail
storm in April didn't help. I found a total of 6 so far that had heaved and I suspect that it was caused by all the winter ice/thaw cycles. Edited to add that there are also stunted scapes in a donated bed 5 miles away and lots of damaged hydrangeas.

Here is a bed that has only tall cv's a week before peak. You can see how lonely Phoenix Flying is. PF is 1 of 5 in that bed that has normal scape size. Notify Ground Crew, Lotus Position, Yellow Titan, Screamcicle are the other 4. Last year, this same bed was blazing with blooms.


Thumb of 2014-07-07/dormantsrule/1e7d9b

James, I've never brought a daylily inside but considered it when deer found their way to the neighborhood from state park. I've been waiting to see ffoe on Tall Blonde bloom this year. It's in a pot in lockdown mode; I move the pot all over the property everytime I see deer tracks. It's currently on the front porch and hoping deer don't hop up the steps and eat the buds. lol
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[Last edited by dormantsrule - Jul 7, 2014 6:18 PM (+)]
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(Zone 7a)
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dormantsrule
Jul 25, 2014 5:36 AM CST
Updated thoughts on winter damage. I have donated increase to non profits and took a drive by 2 donated beds yesterday. I found normal sized scapes in both beds from the same plants with stunted scapes or no scapes here. The difference is that the 2 donated beds escaped the monster hail storm May 21.

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[Last edited by dormantsrule - Jul 25, 2014 12:38 PM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Jul 25, 2014 6:40 AM CST
Interesting, so it seems the donated beds experienced pretty much the same winter, less the pounding barrage of hail? So the scapes were not stunted in the donated beds, did the bud count appear to be normal? Were many of those buds starting to bloom?
(Zone 7a)
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dormantsrule
Jul 25, 2014 7:23 AM CST
Seedfork said:....So the scapes were not stunted in the donated beds, did the bud count appear to be normal? Were many of those buds starting to bloom?


Everything seems normal and I'm guessing that maybe growth tips or scapes are starting to form before we even see them and hail did them in ??? Foliage looked like it had been through a paper shredder.

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Name: Maurice
Grey County, Ontario (Zone 4b)
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admmad
Jul 25, 2014 11:26 AM CST
At least the first scapes on a substantial proportion of daylily cultivars are formed the year before they bloom. I have never seen any research about when rebloom scapes are formed. My opinion is that rebloom scapes are formed after the first scape (as opposed to at the same time as it) and probably in the same year that the rebloom scape normally would bloom.

Daylilies that flower late in the bloom season appear to not have their scapes present the year before.
Maurice
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Jul 25, 2014 11:31 AM CST
admmad
Any ideas on how the hail would have damaged the not yet visible scapes, or do you have another explanation for the difference in the growth of the two beds?
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jul 25, 2014 12:09 PM CST
Since the leaves were shredded then presumably photosynthesis was compromised so perhaps the short scapes were the result of reduced manufacture of food for growth? There could also be differences in soil nutrient balance between the two locations.

FWIW here is a picture I took a few years ago of a baby scape one November. I'd dissected a few fans to see if baby scapes were visible, and this one was the most advanced at that time, I think it was about half an inch in length. This was from an unnamed but presumed Hemerocallis lilioasphodelus that flowers late May or early June here.
Thumb of 2014-07-25/sooby/0c21b1

Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Jul 25, 2014 12:17 PM CST
Hey, great photo!
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jul 25, 2014 12:35 PM CST
Thanks, I just found a couple more in a different folder, would have been taken at around the same time as the above.

The first one shows what was left of the crown after I'd finished hunting for a baby scape, the little bit sticking up is the baby scape of 'Purple Waters' (next to a pen to show the relative size).

Thumb of 2014-07-25/sooby/f0100d

This one shows the above 'Purple Waters' baby scape through the microscope, you can already see a bract and a forming bud, maybe two.

Thumb of 2014-07-25/sooby/2657b4

(Zone 7a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Avid Green Pages Reviewer
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dormantsrule
Jul 25, 2014 12:56 PM CST
Very sorry, I edited my posts with correct date of hail storm which was May 21, not April 21. I have 5 beds @ home, soil is within normal range and early cv's blooms usually start end of May. I would guess that the scapes were ready to push up and hail battered them.

Also lost 3 established hydrangeas and tons of heucheras.



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Name: Maurice
Grey County, Ontario (Zone 4b)
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admmad
Jul 25, 2014 8:19 PM CST
Seedfork said:... ideas on how the hail would have damaged the not yet visible scapes, or do you have another explanation for the difference in the growth of the two beds?
When plants are stressed they often abort their flowers. The shortened scapes might be a symptom of the effects of incomplete/partial decisions to abort the scapes (due to the stress of the hail and associated weather) that were then reversed. On the other hand I have seen scapes blooming on fans that have lost all their leaves by natural aging/summer dormancy.

Sue's idea is a definite possibility.
Maurice

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