Lilies forum: Hybrid lily combos

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Name: Keith
West Babylon, NY (Zone 7a)
Region: United States of America Winter Sowing Plays in the sandbox Birds Native Plants and Wildflowers Tomato Heads
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keithp2012
Jul 31, 2014 10:25 PM CST
What lily hybrid combos will produce viable seed. mix and match these 4 kinds with each other.

asiatic
oriental
easter lily
tiger
[Last edited by keithp2012 - Jul 31, 2014 10:27 PM (+)]
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Name: Connie
Willamette Valley OR (Zone 8a)
Forum moderator Hybridizer Region: Pacific Northwest Lilies Sempervivums Sedums
Pollen collector I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier
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pardalinum
Aug 1, 2014 12:53 PM CST

Moderator

A general rule of thumb is to cross like with like. So asiatic with asiatic and oriental with oriental and so forth. Tiger lily is considered an asiatic lily. Some of the interspecifics are fertile with tetraploid pollen. For example, I can get good seed from the orienpet lily American West using tetraploid trumpet pollen. But the interspecific lilies themselves (for example, oriental x trumpet lily) are created through laboratory embryo culture procedures.

This is really a simplified explanation. For any cross you consider you can post on the lily forum here for comments from the peanut gallery. There are a few of us here with at least some experience in producing seeds.

One piece of advice I would like to give is to not try to set too many pods on one plant as seed making is a great drain on the bulb. Too many pods can mean a weak return the following season of your pod parent. I learned this the hard way! I usually do just one pollination on a small plant (maybe only 3 or 4 blooms available) and up to 3 on larger plants, say for example, a well budded trumpet lily.

Here is a link to an article describing the different divisions of lilies. Lilies within a division can be compatible for crossing (though not always):

http://garden.org/ideas/view/pardalinum/1355/Lilies-for-the-...
Name: Øystein Hermansen
Østfold,Norway (Zone 5b)
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grapus
Aug 1, 2014 2:19 PM CST
From Brian Bergman I have learn to pollinate OTs with oriental pollen. I have pods on several OTs that have been pollinated with oriental pollen that are swelling well.
Ille bra,se.
Name: Connie
Willamette Valley OR (Zone 8a)
Forum moderator Hybridizer Region: Pacific Northwest Lilies Sempervivums Sedums
Pollen collector I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier
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pardalinum
Aug 1, 2014 2:47 PM CST

Moderator

Øystein, can you use any oriental pollen or does it have to be say, tetraploid?
Name: Joe
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Lilies Region: New York Plant and/or Seed Trader Seed Starter Garden Ideas: Level 1
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Joebass
Aug 1, 2014 4:03 PM CST
I've also dabbled with that Øystein. I have a pod from Conca d'or x Dizzy and morning after x Firebolt going right now! Øystein please tell us more of what you have learned from dr bergmann
Name: Connie
Willamette Valley OR (Zone 8a)
Forum moderator Hybridizer Region: Pacific Northwest Lilies Sempervivums Sedums
Pollen collector I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier
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pardalinum
Aug 1, 2014 4:23 PM CST

Moderator

Joe, let us know how these crosses turn out for you. I would like to know if any of these seeds will germinate. I assume Dr. Bergman is not using embryo culture.
Name: Øystein Hermansen
Østfold,Norway (Zone 5b)
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grapus
Aug 2, 2014 1:25 AM CST
No, he don't using embryo culture.
To be honest I have very little experience on this, this is my first year using oriental pollen. My Silk Road was pollinated with pollen Anthony send me from Cam Alpha. I understand from what Brian B. writes that some orientals do well on OTs and some does not. You just have to try with what you have and see if it works. If some have a extra bulb from Buggys Queen series I would like to buy it or trade with some lilies I have. Imagine a spotty OT.


Thumb of 2014-08-02/grapus/9bb570
Silk Road x oriental pollen, seeds from NALS.
Ille bra,se.
Name: Øystein Hermansen
Østfold,Norway (Zone 5b)
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grapus
Aug 2, 2014 1:41 AM CST
It's also possible to pollinate orientals with OT pollen. But since some OTs are pollen sterile I have used mixed OT pollen. I have pollinated Dark Sensation and Salmon Star with mixed OT pollen, in a greenhouse.
Ille bra,se.
Name: Joe
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Lilies Region: New York Plant and/or Seed Trader Seed Starter Garden Ideas: Level 1
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Joebass
Aug 2, 2014 3:48 PM CST
Connie I will keep you updated. I've been doing a lot of reading this year and and I have come to the same conclusions that Øystein has. I figure that if certain things are fertile that you could cross them with something possibly related in their heritage. While I'm no expert (barely a novice) it appears that helps. An example is 'Morning After'. It's supposed parents are a pink oriental x henryi var. citrinum so I figured that it should cross back to either an oriental, henryi, or both. It appears that by using henryi pollen and Firebolt (red oriental) pollen, I have two good pods developing. Now it's still early to tell what ultimately happens. Also, tetra trumpet pollen appears to be very fertile on OT's based of some limited experience and what I see in the NALS seed exchange. I've also tried some OT pollen on orientals and am awaiting the results. Really fun and exciting stuff!
Name: Brian
Ontario Canada (Zone 5b)
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bearsearch
Aug 3, 2014 8:28 AM CST
From what Brian Bergman has told me, he believes that some of the newer Orientals are tetraploids, he generally mixes pollen and he doesn't protect the stigma before or after. He doesn't do embryo rescue himself but has sent pods to someone else to do it for him on occasion. I don't know how or why it works for him but he is able to cross things that seem very unlikely to succeed.
Name: Lorn (Roosterlorn)
S.E Wisconsin (Zone 5b)
Lilies Seed Starter Pollen collector Bee Lover Region: Wisconsin
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Roosterlorn
Aug 3, 2014 12:35 PM CST
Well, if you'd like to make a cross in unchartered territory, a mix of two or three pollens will sometimes provide one (mentor) that is compatible. The compatible mentor then, may 'open the door' for your selected pollen to follow. Leaving the stigma unprotected beforehand follows the same thought--that a few acceptable stray grains may enter the stigma and excite it enough so to allow a wider range of otherwise normally incompatible pollen to follow. In thinking, one could end up with a wide range of crosses, but still end up with many of one's intended target. I know of someone in Europe who works the same methods as Dr. Bergman.
Name: Connie
Willamette Valley OR (Zone 8a)
Forum moderator Hybridizer Region: Pacific Northwest Lilies Sempervivums Sedums
Pollen collector I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier
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pardalinum
Aug 3, 2014 12:56 PM CST

Moderator

I used a mix this year comprised of six different pollens including OT, 4nT, and 2n aurelian. I don't know how it is working out because I don't look again until I start gathering seeds and labels later.

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