Orchids forum: Hard to find hybrids

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Name: Lore Lisa
Central New York State (Zone 4b)
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Lorli
Dec 16, 2014 7:10 AM CST
I wondered why certain hybrids are difficult to find for purchase, even though they are described as easy, fast growers. I'm thinking specifically of C. Margaret Hort. I haven't found I anywhere but on eBay and have been outbid on it twice, one time if went for more than $60. (I would be afraid to spend that much to buy a plant, sight unseen, from a seller that I know nothing about).

Descriptions of the plant always mention its vigour and how quickly it grows. i. don't know if there are others, but why wouldn't there be?

Thanks.
Lore Lisa

"We have met the enemy and he is us."
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
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dyzzypyxxy
Dec 16, 2014 2:43 PM CST
The laws of supply and demand apply for orchids and other plants too. Once a plant gets hyped as a really great one, everyone wants one and it takes a while for the growers to supply a larger number of plants. Then the price will drop, and they'll be widely available. It's not like manufacturing where the latest toy can be mass produced for the holiday season, right? It takes at least 2, and maybe 3 years to grow an orchid to near blooming size.

Also, Buyer Beware!! applies. Maybe some grower has a bunch of one type of orchid, and they decide to promote it as the next great plant . . . be sure you get those recommendations from private owners of the plant, not from a promo that originated with a grower. It might grow well and bloom prolifically for somebody in Hawaii or Florida, but indoors in New York is a whole different world to an orchid . . Smiling

You're right, $60 is way too much to pay for any orchid, sight unseen. I think even $30 is too much. Make a trip to the closest orchid show coming to somewhere near you, and you'll be much happier with what you can buy for that kind of money. @Ursula knows the shows and growers up in your neck of the woods.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
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Ursula
Dec 16, 2014 2:52 PM CST

Moderator

Regarding C. Margaret Hort - I would say that 60 bucks was a steal for a piece of this plant. l had to look it up, it was registered in 1962 and it is absolutely gorgeous. I would suspect this is one of those Heirloom Cattleyas which usually sell for several 100 Dollars.
If I were to use this particular Orchids in a breeding program, I would try to contact growers like Waldor Orchids. Waldor Orchids post sometimes old Cattleyas like that. Or simply search for Heirloom Cattleyas.
My question is - why persue an Orchid like that when there are dozens of just as gorgeous white Catts around for a lot less money.
Name: Jim Hawk
Odessa, Florida (Zone 9b)
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hawkarica
Dec 16, 2014 5:49 PM CST
Like Elaine said, this is not just an orchid issue but an issue with almost every plant you can think of. For example, we can grow over 60 species of palms in central Florida yet when I walk around my neighborhood, I count only 6. If I go to the big box stores, I find those same 6. Growers concentrate on a small number of varieties that are quickly and easily grown and transported and that is what we are stuck with. My response is to fight back. I now grow over 30 species of palms on my property and speak at libraries and garden clubs on rare palms and where to get them. Looking for the hard to find plants you want is part of the fun. Good luck.

Jim
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Charter ATP Member Spiders! Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Pennsylvania Greenhouse Cactus and Succulents
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Ursula
Dec 16, 2014 6:36 PM CST

Moderator

Yes, and those ca 6 Orchids are found in Trader Joe's, local Supermarkets, Big Box Stores and such.
If one wants to see other Orchids, species and wonderful hybrids alike, I would always recommend visiting Orchid nurseries and walk through Orchid Shows, so you can see what's out there, besides those big box Orchids. ( some of those can be very pretty too....)
Walking through the greenhouses of Waldor Orchids, Silva Orchids (both in NJ) Oak Hill years ago, (Chicago), Hausermann (Chicago), Parkside in PA and truly most fortunate me - Ecuagenera in Ecuador, are great experiences. All of those nurseries sell online and at Shows. And there is Andy's Orchids with loads of wonderful species. Looking for Slipper Orchids - there is Glen Decker of Piping Rock Orchids (Galway, NY) and so many many more!! My beautiful C Chocolate Drop 'Kodama' came from Odoms Orchids years ago and I have picked up a few gems from Carter and Holmes.
So many good vendors!!
Name: Jim Hawk
Odessa, Florida (Zone 9b)
Charter ATP Member Hibiscus Birds Bromeliad Greenhouse Master Gardener: Florida
Garden Photography Region: United States of America Roses Tropicals Region: Florida Orchids
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hawkarica
Dec 16, 2014 6:54 PM CST
By all means, support those growers that care about the plants, not just the profits. The folks that take the care and the time to grow rare but beautiful orchids deserve our support.

Jim
Name: Lore Lisa
Central New York State (Zone 4b)
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Lorli
Dec 16, 2014 7:03 PM CST
Thank you.

Ursula, I'm glad you agree that there is something really special about that Margaret Hort. I have also been looking for Myrm. Herbert Osterreich but haven't been able to find it, Iwonder if that is another old variety. It's really pretty and I thought it would be kind of fun because my father, who is 88 years old, is named Herbert and he is from Vienna! But it's mostly because it is pretty!

I guess it will just take some looking to find a white flower with the flower shape and plant appearance that I like. Good excuse to look at lots of beautiful pictures! I had never heard of some of those nurseries before, so I will look them up on the map and plan for a field trip I the spring!

How do you hear about shows? I used to get emails from Parkside about open days, including other growers, that sounded great, but haven't had any of those since they changed hands. I do wish I had gone to them.

I imagine that most shows in this area are in the spring or summer, so it's something to look forward to.
Lore Lisa

"We have met the enemy and he is us."
Name: Carol
Santa Ana,Ca. (Zone 10b)
Sunset zone 22
Charter ATP Member Hummingbirder Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Orchids Region: California Plant Identifier
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ctcarol
Dec 16, 2014 7:47 PM CST
Many of these vendors will let you know when they have sales or will be at shows if you have purchased on line from them. That puts you on their mailing list. You can also check their websites, which often say what shows they will be at, and dates. Another resource is your local Orchid Society website for that info. I still get e-mails from Parkside, after 5 years, and Andy's sends me almost weekly e-mails, though I only ordered on line once either. Of course you can always watch this forum, where our local up coming shows are usually mentioned. The shows are always fun, and you get to know the vendors.
Name: Roberta
Cherokee Village, Ark (Zone 7a)
Region: Tennessee Orchids Irises
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901Bertwood
Dec 16, 2014 8:14 PM CST
You are right about Margaret, Ursula. Likewise some of my most expensive orchids are not that pretty or easy to grow. For instance C Jacqeline Kennedy was over 300 and rare to get but for a collector it is worth it. These rarer orchids are not for beginners and therefore are going for better price, but on ebay you have to know the dealer!!!
Bert
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Charter ATP Member Spiders! Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Pennsylvania Greenhouse Cactus and Succulents
Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Ponds Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: New Jersey
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Ursula
Dec 16, 2014 8:58 PM CST

Moderator

Absolutely, Roberta!

Lore, there is a Cattleya Herbert Oesterreich
http://apps.rhs.org.uk/horticulturaldatabase/orchidregister/...
Name: Lore Lisa
Central New York State (Zone 4b)
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Lorli
Dec 17, 2014 1:35 AM CST
Ursula, thank you! No wonder I couldn't find it!!! Looking at it again (I had seen a photograph of I a long time ago and wrote the name down) it reminds me of the Cattlianthe Confetti that I have in sheath now.

I had to look up C. Jacqueline Kennedy and I can't believe th price, especially when there are other flowers that are just as pretty. I would e afraid to buy such an expensive plant, I'd probably knock it off the windowsill or the cat would eat it or something like that.
Lore Lisa

"We have met the enemy and he is us."
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Charter ATP Member Spiders! Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Pennsylvania Greenhouse Cactus and Succulents
Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Ponds Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: New Jersey
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Ursula
Dec 17, 2014 7:52 AM CST

Moderator

I should mention that I subscribe to Orchids/the magazine of the AOS, and it lists the upcoming shows. Looking at the events in my area, the Northern NJ Orchid Society has a show Jan 16.-18. And the Deep Cut OS Show will be held Febr. 5. - 8.
Also, from The Silva Orchids website -their open house is on Jan. 23. - 25.

Now for me this is already plenty opportunity to get into trouble.... nodding Smiling
Name: Ken Ramsey
Starkville, MS (Zone 8a)
[url=www.tropicalplantsandmore.com]
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drdawg
Dec 17, 2014 8:53 AM CST
The orchid business is an interesting one. I purchase my orchids from two major growers/hybridizers in Hawaii. I recently contacted one of those growers and gave him a list of ten plants that I had purchased before but had not been able to purchase again. They simply have not been listed on the website again . I explained that I would like to re-purchase these ten varieties and to let me know when any of them would be available again. I got an email saying basically that he would probably never have them again. He went on to explain that the reputable growers always limited the number of plants of a variety they grew so as never to "flood the market" with a variety. In other words, they attempt to keep the prices stable, particularly for hard-to-find and/or popular varieties. I think he has told the truth (at least when it comes to his being honest about not having varieties again), since several of my "most-wanted" plants were purchased five years ago and none of them have come up for sale again.

drdawg (Ken Ramsey) - Tropical Plants & More
[url=www.tropicalplantsandmore.com]www.tropicalplantsandmore.com[/url]
If God wanted me to touch my toes, he would have put them on my knees.
Name: Lore Lisa
Central New York State (Zone 4b)
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Lorli
Dec 17, 2014 9:31 AM CST
Funny thing is, I have been looking at white cattleyas and crosses and haven't found bery many that are pure white without frills (is that what you call them? ), for some reason, I have a fancy for a non frilly flower, carried on an inflorescence, with a star shape. The best I found were some species cattleyas, today I will do some reading in books about cultivation of them. I have always believed (could be wrong) that hybrids are generally easier to grow.

Another beautiful white orchid that I'm having a little trouble finding is Cymbidium Sara Jean Ice Cascade.

But I'm having a lot of fun looking! And my wish list has now grown to two pages!

Lore Lisa

"We have met the enemy and he is us."
Name: Anne
Summerville, SC (Zone 8a)
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Xeramtheum
Dec 17, 2014 10:44 AM CST
In the meantime there is always Bletilla striata!

"We were all humans until race disconnected us, religion separated us, politics divided us and wealth classified us."

Unknown

Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Charter ATP Member Spiders! Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Pennsylvania Greenhouse Cactus and Succulents
Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Ponds Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: New Jersey
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Ursula
Dec 17, 2014 10:46 AM CST

Moderator

Have you looked at Santa Barbara Orchids for this and other Cymbidiums? They have such a huge selection of Cymbidiums, you would be hard pressed not to find any to your liking. That particular website also tells you which one are warmth tolerant. If I am not mistaken, the one you picked needs a good cold spell to bloom, surely perfect for you.
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Charter ATP Member Spiders! Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Pennsylvania Greenhouse Cactus and Succulents
Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Ponds Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: New Jersey
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Ursula
Dec 17, 2014 10:49 AM CST

Moderator

Perfect for growing outside, Anne/ perfect for Lore, close to a house wall and with some leaves for protection in the Fall to make it through the Winter.
Name: Lore Lisa
Central New York State (Zone 4b)
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Lorli
Dec 17, 2014 11:14 AM CST
It never occurred to me that any nonnative orchid could grow outside! And it really is such a pretty flower, too. I will look into it.

Santa Barbara Orchids does have a fabulous selection of Cymbidiums, Ursula, you're right. I had always tried to stick with warmth tolerant Cyms because of growing indoors, but when I looked at their list, some of the plants that are listed as cool growers (I think one was Golden Elf?) have done quite well here, probably because I have been slow to bring them inside in the autumn. Laziness has paid off!!!

I notice that, for the most part, the warm tolerant varieties are yellow/orange, very few white or pink. The newer warm tolerant hybrids have a round flower, not as much to my taste. Oh, my, aren't I getting picky now?!
Lore Lisa

"We have met the enemy and he is us."
Name: Ken Ramsey
Starkville, MS (Zone 8a)
[url=www.tropicalplantsandmore.com]
Orchids Greenhouse Vegetable Grower Ferns Region: United States of America Hummingbirder
Composter Bromeliad Master Gardener: Mississippi Cat Lover Tropicals Plumerias
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drdawg
Dec 17, 2014 11:20 AM CST
Here's some you might like, Lore. If you have interest in any, just contact me via T-Mail, and I will tell you about them.

Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/d0931a Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/280196 Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/5c360b Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/d337ad Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/31201b Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/9c028b Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/f6060b Thumb of 2014-12-17/drdawg/8dcbf3

drdawg (Ken Ramsey) - Tropical Plants & More
[url=www.tropicalplantsandmore.com]www.tropicalplantsandmore.com[/url]
If God wanted me to touch my toes, he would have put them on my knees.
Name: Roberta
Cherokee Village, Ark (Zone 7a)
Region: Tennessee Orchids Irises
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901Bertwood
Dec 17, 2014 12:00 PM CST
Try to get the C Hawaian Wedding Song 'Virgin', very easy Bifoliate and one of my favorites still after all these years!
Thumb of 2014-12-17/901Bertwood/58a7c5
Thumb of 2014-12-17/901Bertwood/88aad3

Bert

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