Site Talk forum: Question about Plant Database Comments

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Name: Melanie Long
Lutz, Florida (Zone 9b)
Larva tested, Pupa approved!
Butterflies Hummingbirder Birds Bee Lover Enjoys or suffers hot summers Region: Florida
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Bromeliad Native Plants and Wildflowers Forum moderator Plant Identifier
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mellielong
Mar 27, 2015 2:59 PM CST
Hi, ATP folks. I have a question regarding what we can post under the plant database comments. I have some really old wildflower and plant books that I've picked up at antique shops and used book stores that have a lot of interesting and sometimes forgotten information. I thought it would be fun to post parts of the book as comments in the database. But I didn't know if that would be okay.

Of course, I would list the title of the book, author, and date published but I didn't want to get anyone in trouble over copyright. Also, I wasn't sure if that would be violating the "spirit" of the comments since it seems like we mostly tend toward users commenting about plants they've personally grown or seen growing. I searched ATP trying to see if anyone else had asked this, but couldn't find anything similar. I did look at a bunch of previous comments from the last few months and I see people quoting plant catalogs and even Wikipedia so I wasn't sure where ATP stood on this.

If they're not appropriate to use as comments, I thought I could start a thread in the Wildflowers Forum and do an entry every few days or however often I feel like typing. Hilarious! I just think some of the entries are really fascinating and offer a glimpse into how people viewed the plant at the time (weed, wildflower, bane of the garden?). There's also a lot of info about Indian usage, medicinal uses, and even some history. For example, one book I have says Pokeweed was not named after President Polk, as it had been discovered long before he became president, but that his supporters would wear Pokeweed stems in their lapels as a way to show allegiance to their candidate. I thought that was really interesting and I guess I just wanted to know what might be the best way to share that on ATP. And if I did just contain it to a thread, wouldn't I have to be concerned that other users might take what I've written and copy and paste it as a comment on the database?

And for the ATP users out there reading this, would that be something you would be interested in reading in the first place?

Thanks everyone!
Moderator of the best forum on ATP, the Butterflies, Bees, and Birds forum!
Name: Hetty
Sunny Naples, Florida (Zone 10a)
Plumerias Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator Region: Florida Cat Lover Garden Sages Cactus and Succulents Tropicals
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Dutchlady1
Mar 27, 2015 3:03 PM CST
Personally I think that would be great. Let's ask @zuzu
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Mar 27, 2015 3:25 PM CST

Plants Admin

I also think it sounds great. As long as you include attribution, there should be no problem. Quotes with the proper attribution are far preferable to comments with links that send people away from the ATP site.
Name: Deb
Pacific Northwest (Zone 8b)
Region: Pacific Northwest Organic Gardener Herbs Dragonflies Dog Lover Keeper of Poultry
Birds Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Garden Ideas: Master Level Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Sages Plant Identifier
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Bonehead
Mar 27, 2015 3:32 PM CST
I like the idea as well, there is some fascinating folklore to be found and shared. And, I agree with Zuzu, I would rather have a quote than a link, which I typically pass by.
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.
Name: Jay
Nederland, Texas (Zone 9a)
Region: Texas Region: Gulf Coast Charter ATP Member I helped beta test the first seed swap I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Tip Photographer Garden Sages Garden Ideas: Master Level Hibiscus
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Horntoad
Mar 27, 2015 3:41 PM CST
It sound appropriate for plant comments. As far as copyright is concerned, if it is fact, then you can post it. Facts can not be copyrighted, only the authors artist expression of those facts, so make sure you use your own original wording.
wildflowersoftexas.com
texasnatureonline.com


Name: Rick Corey
Everett WA 98204 (Zone 8a)
Sunset Zone 5. Koppen Csb. Eco 2f
I helped beta test the first seed swap Plant and/or Seed Trader Seed Starter Region: Pacific Northwest Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Vegetable Grower
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member
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RickCorey
Mar 27, 2015 3:46 PM CST
Some older works may no longer be copyrighted, even though most US copyrights last 70 years after the death of the author.

There is a chart here listing many reasons a work might NOT have copyright protection:

https://copyright.cornell.edu/resources/publicdomain.cfm
Name: Ann ~Heat zn 9, Sunset
North Fl. (Zone 8b)
Garden Sages Native Plants and Wildflowers Xeriscape Organic Gardener I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level
Butterflies Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Region: Florida Dog Lover Birds
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flaflwrgrl
Mar 28, 2015 11:33 AM CST
I love the idea Melanie!
I am a strong believer in the simple fact is that what matters in this life is how we treat others. I think that's what living is all about. Not what I've done in my life but how I've treated others.
~~ Sharon Brown ~~



Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Mar 28, 2015 1:23 PM CST
I love the idea of many more posts in the comments section. I am not qualified to commit (but I won't let that interfere with an opinion" on the copyright portion of the question. I have always "heard" it was alright to post short comments from a book if proper credit was given. I don't think large portions of a book can be posted even with the proper credit, but that is just what I have been told by no qualified source, but it does make sense, I can see where gutting the info in a book could kill sells.
Name: Melanie Long
Lutz, Florida (Zone 9b)
Larva tested, Pupa approved!
Butterflies Hummingbirder Birds Bee Lover Enjoys or suffers hot summers Region: Florida
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Bromeliad Native Plants and Wildflowers Forum moderator Plant Identifier
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mellielong
Mar 28, 2015 1:49 PM CST
Well, the book I had in mind was published in 1922 so I'm thinking it's not much of a bestseller anymore. It's called "How to Know the Wild Flowers" by Mrs. William Starr Dana. There are people selling it used on Amazon for anywhere from $72-$185 depending on condition. My copy has $30 on the inside and I think the antique store was having a sale. I never pay full price at antique stores - you gotta deal! There are cheaper versions that are newer and a softcover version, as well, that's not so pricey. The first copyright was in 1893 followed by others in 1895, 1900, and 1921. I have the new revised version featuring all new color plates! Hilarious! It's a pretty nice book, not only in how she describes the flowers, but how she talks about where they grow, what other plants they're commonly found with, and common uses of the plant.
Moderator of the best forum on ATP, the Butterflies, Bees, and Birds forum!
Name: Ann ~Heat zn 9, Sunset
North Fl. (Zone 8b)
Garden Sages Native Plants and Wildflowers Xeriscape Organic Gardener I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level
Butterflies Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Region: Florida Dog Lover Birds
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flaflwrgrl
Mar 28, 2015 2:45 PM CST
Sounds like a very interesting book Melanie - very interesting!
I am a strong believer in the simple fact is that what matters in this life is how we treat others. I think that's what living is all about. Not what I've done in my life but how I've treated others.
~~ Sharon Brown ~~



Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
Herbs Region: Georgia Region: United States of America Native Plants and Wildflowers Dog Lover Composter
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greene
Mar 28, 2015 3:07 PM CST
According to this link the book is 'not in copyright' at this time. I don't know the accuracy or trustworthiness of the link.
https://archive.org/details/howtoknowwildflo00staruoft
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
[Last edited by greene - Mar 28, 2015 3:07 PM (+)]
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