Irises forum: Falls that stand out

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springfield MO area (Zone 6a)
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Frillylily
May 13, 2015 3:30 PM CST
I have some iris that bloomed for the first time this year. The lower part of the iris, the petals that are supposed to fall, are standing straight out. Is this weather related or ? Will those always do that or not? I don't like this characteristic and I'd like to avoid it in the future if I order more iris. The specific one today that bloomed this way is Honey House, also Bearded Wonder. I think they look strange.
springfield MO area (Zone 6a)
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Identifier
Frillylily
May 13, 2015 3:53 PM CST
Tall Bearded Iris (Iris 'Honey House')

well here a pic of Honey House in the database and the falls do not look like they are down in it either. But when I did a google image search there were pics of it with the falls down. Do the blooms vary on the same plant?
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
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lovemyhouse
May 13, 2015 4:22 PM CST
I don't have a ton of experience, but some of the ones I have started out with horizontal falls, then the falls relaxed as the bloom matured. Some of them are bred to stand out, though, I think. I checked the Iris twiki and most of the photographs for Bearded Wonder show the falls standing out. Maybe checking both the ATP database and the twiki before buying or trading will help you avoid the ones you don't want?

http://wiki.irises.org/bin/view/Main
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Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake Lake, Arkansas (Zone 7a)
Magnolia zone
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grannysgarden
May 13, 2015 4:41 PM CST
Debra stated it very well. There are irises bred for color, type, size and form for every taste. It is important to do research if you there is a particular trait you do not prefer.
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springfield MO area (Zone 6a)
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Identifier
Frillylily
May 13, 2015 6:02 PM CST
does this particular trait have a fancy name I should be looking for in an iris description?
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
Service dogs: Angels with paws.
Dragonflies Dog Lover I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Photography Bee Lover Plays in the sandbox
Butterflies Region: Texas I sent a postcard to Randy! Charter ATP Member Annuals Garden Sages
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lovemyhouse
May 13, 2015 6:15 PM CST
Think it is called a Flared form. If you have one you are contemplating, you can search the database by that single field to see if it is registered as such.
If you don't ask, the answer is always 'no.'
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
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Paul2032
May 13, 2015 6:20 PM CST
I like flared falls....not horizontal but slightly relaxed.
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
springfield MO area (Zone 6a)
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Identifier
Frillylily
May 13, 2015 6:32 PM CST
the database describes Honey House as a Bubble Ruffled. Do all of the bubble ruffled have falls that stand out?
Name: Debra
Garland, TX (NE Dallas suburb) (Zone 8a)
Service dogs: Angels with paws.
Dragonflies Dog Lover I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Photography Bee Lover Plays in the sandbox
Butterflies Region: Texas I sent a postcard to Randy! Charter ATP Member Annuals Garden Sages
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lovemyhouse
May 13, 2015 6:35 PM CST
Hopefully, someone who is much more conversant with form will chime in. I'd like to know, as well. Smiling
If you don't ask, the answer is always 'no.'
Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake Lake, Arkansas (Zone 7a)
Magnolia zone
Region: United States of America Region: Arkansas Master Gardener: Arkansas Irises Bulbs Seed Starter
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grannysgarden
May 13, 2015 7:00 PM CST
No, not all bubble ruffled irises falls stand out. I grow Birthday Girl and her falls, although quite ruffled, do not stand out. This is a photo from the database of Birthday Girl.

I love my garden.... and Jesus, and coffee, and naps.......
Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake Lake, Arkansas (Zone 7a)
Magnolia zone
Region: United States of America Region: Arkansas Master Gardener: Arkansas Irises Bulbs Seed Starter
Gardens in Buckets Garden Art Plant and/or Seed Trader Moon Gardener Garden Ideas: Master Level Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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grannysgarden
May 13, 2015 7:10 PM CST
In my observation of newly introduced irises for some years it seems like hybridizers are trying to achieve wider falls that are more rounded and do not drop straight down from the bloom. That is really evident in the smaller dwarf forms. When the little irises are near the ground the flaring falls make the bloom easier to enjoy and photograph. And if an iris bloom has ruffled edges or an edge with a distinctive pattern or contrasting color it is easier to enjoy if the falls flare out.

I like both but I am a bit partial to the older forms. smiles
I love my garden.... and Jesus, and coffee, and naps.......
Name: Lucy
Hamilton, MA (Zone 6b)
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irisarian
May 13, 2015 9:30 PM CST
Flared form on the dwarfs make them easier to see. As I am short, it is beter for me. The tall bearded are more variable.
Name: Sherry Austin
Santa Cruz, CA (Zone 9a)
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Henhouse
May 13, 2015 11:23 PM CST
I've also heard that form called a helicopter. I don't particularly care for it either. The angle of the camera can make the falls look like they're drooping. Rather than shooting straight on, it's kind of a 45 degree angle higher up on the standards.. It's also used to get everything in focus in micro... I do this a lot on newly opened blooms whose falls haven't drooped yet.. or to make a helicopter look like an Iris should..
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South central PA (Zone 6a)
Irises Region: Pennsylvania
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DaveinPA
May 14, 2015 5:45 AM CST
Pulling some info from the HIPS references about iris identification:

Fall position-"carriage: nearly horizontal; flaring (approximately a 45 degree angle); drooping to straight-hanging; reflexed (bending back toward stem)." Some of course start out horizontal and then assume their normal position.

As Sherry noted it can be difficult to get pictures that properly show the form of the falls.
Name: Arlyn
Whiteside County, Illinois (Zone 5a)
Irises Beekeeper Region: Illinois Celebrating Gardening: 2015
crowrita1
May 14, 2015 6:51 AM CST
I sort of like what I 'grew up with", that strappy, hound dog eared, sort of thing, but , I'm pretty *adaptable* when it comes to iris ! It's pretty obvious, when looking at all the pictures that different folks post, that *most" seem to favor the view from "just slightly " higher than the bloom, and "just off center" of the fall
Thumb of 2015-05-14/crowrita1/04f7ed
like this
but some like a more "straight ahead" view of the fall
Thumb of 2015-05-14/crowrita1/104cdd
and some prefer this angle
Thumb of 2015-05-14/crowrita1/06b0b8
But, generally the "fully flared falls ", on a "Big" iris, don't show their full potential unless you look more "down the throat"

as Lucy pointed out the "little guys, being so low to the ground ,are best viewed "down the throat", and the flared falls are more of an "advantage"
Thumb of 2015-05-14/crowrita1/87f1fa
and, of course, those that "prefer" the falls to actually "fall" usually wait for the bloom to "relax" before taking a pic, and the "fully flrared" lovers snap as soon as the bud opens, and the flower is still "stiff'. So , I guess what I'm getting at, is depending on what "agenda' the photographer has the picture *may* not be representative of how *most* of the blooms look, *most * of the time! Shrug! So ,seeing a picture, or two, of a bloom may not tell the whole story of it's form....and the 'written descriptions" often follow suit, stressing points that are "popular" at the time, and glossing over those that may seen "old hat", or otherwise thought not desirable. So I guess the thing to do is ask lots of questions of those that grow it..Does it *usually* look like that? ... Shrug!
Name: Kent Pfeiffer
Southeast Nebraska (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Plant Identifier Region: Nebraska Forum moderator
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KentPfeiffer
May 20, 2015 8:22 AM CST

Moderator

One of the reasons you see strongly flared falls in some modern irises is that many people really like the look (I know I do). But, I also suspect flared falls are at least partly a by-product of breeding for heavier substance.

One of the most significant improvements in irises over the past 20-30 years has come in the form of flower petals with heavy substance. It makes them far more durable in the face of wind and rain. I don't grow historic varieties largely because they can't stand up to the weather we have here in the spring. Wind is a given, it's merely a question of how hard it blows on any particular day. Historics, with their vertically hanging floppy falls, get torn to shreds almost as quickly as they open. There is a public display garden nearby that is dedicated to irises hybridized by the Sass brothers from the 1920's through the 1940's. It's a wonderful collection that I try to visit at least once each spring, but getting good pictures of those irises is a real challenge. It takes a couple of days in a row of ideal weather to really get a nice show from them and that's hard to come by here.

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