Plant ID forum: Black-Eyed Susan (Rudbeckia fulgida var. sullivantii 'Goldsturm')

Page 1 of 2 • 1 2
Views: 746, Replies: 25 » Jump to the end
Name: Kim
Iowa (Zone 5a)
I kill ornamentals... on purpose.
Enjoys or suffers cold winters Spiders! Critters Allowed Birds Houseplants I helped beta test the first seed swap
Region: Nebraska Keeper of Poultry Rabbit Keeper Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Procrastinator Garden Ideas: Level 2
Chillybean
Aug 2, 2015 2:42 PM CST
I planted this on the north side of my house in 2012. I purchased this from a general purpose nursery when I started looking for native to US plants. When asking for natives, the lady showed me this "Black-eyed Susan". I didn't pay attention to Latin names then.

It was only because someone recently told me Black-eyed Susans are a full sun plant, that I now question what this may be. It has grown and blossomed every year since I got it, but this year, the Wild Bergamot is nearly snuffing it out. I hope to transplant it to an area with more room.

But I would like to know its Latin name, if possible. I have Black-eyed Susan (Rudbeckia hirta) in our prairie patch and the leaves are smaller than this. I would say the length of this leaf is about three inches.

Thumb of 2015-08-02/Chillybean/2bd64e

Here is one of the flowers that struggled to show its face.

Thumb of 2015-08-02/Chillybean/5a029d

Thank you for your help.
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Procrastinator Birds Butterflies Bee Lover Hummingbirder Container Gardener
Image
plantladylin
Aug 2, 2015 3:02 PM CST
The leaves don't look like Rudbeckia; kinda thought maybe Helianthus Sunroots (Helianthus tuberosus) but leaves aren't right for that either. Maybe a type of Silphium?
http://garden.org/plants/search/text/?q=Silphium&button=
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
Hi Everybody!! Let us talk native.
Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Butterflies Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Birds Cat Lover Xeriscape
Image
frostweed
Aug 2, 2015 3:15 PM CST
I think it is Rudbeckia fulgida, http://plants.usda.gov/java/largeImage?imageID=rufu2_002_ahp...
Wildflowers are the Smiles of Nature.
Gardening with Texas Native Plants and Wildflowers.
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Procrastinator Birds Butterflies Bee Lover Hummingbirder Container Gardener
Image
plantladylin
Aug 2, 2015 3:19 PM CST
Hurray! @frostweed Josephine! The leaves looked too fat to me for Rudbeckia but it sure looks like it might be Black-eyed Susan (Rudbeckia fulgida)
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 3:32 PM CST
find a plant that has these stunted leaves

Thumb of 2015-08-02/bamira/69668c

I tip my hat to you.
I don't think that it is Rudbeckia, leaves has a stem
Rudbeckia leaves not stem, leaves on the base taper
[Last edited by bamira - Aug 2, 2015 3:47 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #919018 (5)
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
Hi Everybody!! Let us talk native.
Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Butterflies Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Birds Cat Lover Xeriscape
Image
frostweed
Aug 2, 2015 3:33 PM CST
I think that the leaves of Rudbeckia fulgida are very variable.
Wildflowers are the Smiles of Nature.
Gardening with Texas Native Plants and Wildflowers.
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Procrastinator Birds Butterflies Bee Lover Hummingbirder Container Gardener
Image
plantladylin
Aug 2, 2015 3:45 PM CST
Leaves can be variable in shape, size etc. Leaves can be lance shaped or ovate, lobed or unlobed, teeth or no teeth along the edges.

http://hvp.osu.edu/pocketgardener/source/description/ru_lgid...
http://www.wildflower.org/plants/result.php?id_plant=RUFU2
https://plants.ces.ncsu.edu/plants/all/rudbeckia-fulgida/
https://gobotany.newenglandwild.org/species/rudbeckia/fulgid...
http://theplantencyclopedia.org/wiki/Rudbeckia_fulgida
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~
Name: Catmint/Robin
Maryland (Zone 7a)
Region: Mid-Atlantic Butterflies Forum moderator Native Plants and Wildflowers Bee Lover Echinacea
Region: Maryland Garden Photography Cottage Gardener Garden Ideas: Master Level Celebrating Gardening: 2015 The WITWIT Badge
Image
Catmint20906
Aug 2, 2015 4:06 PM CST
frostweed said:I think that the leaves of Rudbeckia fulgida are very variable.


I agree! I have several types of Rudbeckia, and some have narrow leaves and some have wider leaves.
"One of the pleasures of being a gardener comes from the enjoyment you get looking at other people's yards”
― Thalassa Cruso

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 4:15 PM CST
Maybe I found it
look the video
http://www.baumschule-horstmann.de/shop/exec/product/697/169...
https://sandysplants.wordpress.com/2012/08/05/rudbeckia-fulg... I tip my hat to you.

Name: Kim
Iowa (Zone 5a)
I kill ornamentals... on purpose.
Enjoys or suffers cold winters Spiders! Critters Allowed Birds Houseplants I helped beta test the first seed swap
Region: Nebraska Keeper of Poultry Rabbit Keeper Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Procrastinator Garden Ideas: Level 2
Chillybean
Aug 2, 2015 5:47 PM CST
Thank you for the replies, everyone. So it really is a "Black-eyed Susan". These common names... At least I now have the correct Latin name. Smiling This brings a question...

With the Latin name being Rudbeckia fulgida var. sullvantii, what does "var." mean? I've seen the abbreviation for subspecies, so this must be something different. I looked at the USDA site and it lists this plant, but does not have a page for it.

Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Procrastinator Birds Butterflies Bee Lover Hummingbirder Container Gardener
Image
plantladylin
Aug 2, 2015 6:06 PM CST
I'm not sure but I think it means variety.

From Wikipedia:
var
see varietas.
varietas (variety in common usage, abbreviated as var.)
(Latin) in the Linnean hierarchy a rank below that of species, between the ranks of subspecies and form.
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
Hi Everybody!! Let us talk native.
Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Butterflies Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Birds Cat Lover Xeriscape
Image
frostweed
Aug 2, 2015 6:07 PM CST
"var." means variety. USDA doesn't have a page for varieties, as far as i know. They only have a page for the main species.
Wildflowers are the Smiles of Nature.
Gardening with Texas Native Plants and Wildflowers.

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 6:23 PM CST
the basic name Rudbeckia fulgida
Genus: Rudbeckia
species: fulgida (spec.)
lower grades :
subspecies - subsp.
varieta - var.
form - f.

Watch - sp. - all species I tip my hat to you.

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 6:27 PM CST
frostweed said:"var." means variety. USDA doesn't have a page for varieties, as far as i know. They only have a page for the main species.


http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/paper.pl?language=...
http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/genform.pl
Thumb of 2015-08-03/bamira/2c2aa2

[Last edited by bamira - Aug 2, 2015 6:32 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #919160 (14)
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
Hi Everybody!! Let us talk native.
Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Butterflies Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Birds Cat Lover Xeriscape
Image
frostweed
Aug 2, 2015 7:47 PM CST
Yes they have then listed but they don't have a regular page for varieties, that is what I meant.
Wildflowers are the Smiles of Nature.
Gardening with Texas Native Plants and Wildflowers.

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 8:15 PM CST
I don't know what you mean, I think you're wrong variety for the cultivar ?

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 8:54 PM CST
for example, you may create a theoretical
Rudbeckia fulgida subsp. fulgida var. sullvantii f. alba cultivar Josephine Rolling on the floor laughing
then the name will be Rudbeckia fulgida 'Josephine'
the cultivar is not a variety or form,
subspecies - subsp.,varieta - var.,form - f. they are naturally created
the cultivar is artificially cultivate - by selecting the random variation, or targeted crossing, mostly differ just paint flowers
Name: josephine
Arlington, Texas (Zone 8a)
Hi Everybody!! Let us talk native.
Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener Butterflies Garden Ideas: Master Level Forum moderator I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Birds Cat Lover Xeriscape
Image
frostweed
Aug 2, 2015 9:02 PM CST
Well, you lost me, but if you say I am wrong then I probably am, I guess we can't be right all the time, sorry Sad
Wildflowers are the Smiles of Nature.
Gardening with Texas Native Plants and Wildflowers.
Name: Carol
Santa Ana,Ca. (Zone 10b)
Sunset zone 22
Charter ATP Member Hummingbirder Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Orchids Region: California Plant Identifier
Image
ctcarol
Aug 2, 2015 9:22 PM CST
Excellent explanation! I've never paid too much attention to those abbreviations. Now if I can just remember them.

Dog Lover Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
Image
bamira
Aug 2, 2015 9:25 PM CST
I'm sorry, I don't understand Shrug!

Page 1 of 2 • 1 2

« Garden.org Homepage
« Back to the top
« Forums List
« Plant ID forum
You must first create a username and login before you can reply to this thread.

Today's site banner is by nativeplantlover and is called "Bumble Veronica Pink"