Plant ID forum: Indian Paintbrush ID needed please

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Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
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Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 3:30 PM CST
I'm stumped. I can't find a really good match for this one that is growing on my property. It may come down to the leaves being the deciding factor, but I can't find anything that is exactly correct. Hopefully there is an Indian Paintbrush expert here! Thanks for any help!

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Natalie
Liechtenstein
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zofi
Apr 21, 2016 4:32 PM CST
I tip my hat to you.
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
Cottage Gardener Dog Lover Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Echinacea Xeriscape
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Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 4:38 PM CST
Thanks zofi, but I don't think it is that one. The leaves look totally different to me. Here is a better view of the foliage



I meant to add earlier that I'm leaning toward Rocky Mountain Paintbrush (), which is native to my area, and it sure looks the same. The only difference I can find is that the Rocky Mountain Paintbrush is listed as having 3-lobed leaves. Mine has 3 to 5 lobes. Otherwise, it looks almost identical to me.
Natalie
Liechtenstein
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zofi
Apr 21, 2016 4:57 PM CST
is extended to Southern Washington
http://bonap.net/NAPA/TaxonMaps/Genus/County/Castilleja
look at variations
http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=photos...
[Last edited by zofi - Apr 21, 2016 5:35 PM (+)]
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Liechtenstein
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zofi
Apr 21, 2016 5:15 PM CST
Rocky Mountain Paintbrush - Castilleja covilleana You can compare
http://uswildflowers.com/detail.php?SName=Castilleja%20covil...
http://fieldguide.mt.gov/speciesDetail.aspx?elcode=PDSCR0D0K...
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
Cottage Gardener Dog Lover Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Echinacea Xeriscape
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Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 5:18 PM CST
Thanks again zofi. I still don't think it is the same one that I've got. I had looked on that page this morning, and the foliage still looks wrong to me.

I'm leaning more toward C. covilleana or C. angustifolia, but I know nothing about the plant, other than it is growing on my property, and I love it!
Natalie
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
Cottage Gardener Dog Lover Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Echinacea Xeriscape
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Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 5:25 PM CST
Oops. Cross posted.
Natalie
[Last edited by Natalie - Apr 21, 2016 9:18 PM (+)]
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Liechtenstein
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zofi
Apr 21, 2016 5:43 PM CST
the shape or the colour is not relevant,
important is the construction of the flower and the construction of the body of the plant
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
Cottage Gardener Dog Lover Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Echinacea Xeriscape
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Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 6:35 PM CST
Most everything I've looked at describes the leaves, so I don't understand how they are irrelevant. To me, that is what sets one apart from the other. Shrug!
Natalie
Liechtenstein
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zofi
Apr 21, 2016 6:49 PM CST
the shape and color of the leaf may vary according to the Habitat, some of the characters are sometimes suppressed or highlighted
compare deployment leaves,
[Last edited by zofi - Apr 21, 2016 6:51 PM (+)]
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Name: Leslieray Hurlburt
Sacramento California (Zone 9b)
The WITWIT Badge Region: California Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Xeriscape Native Plants and Wildflowers Salvias
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HamiltonSquare
Apr 21, 2016 7:03 PM CST
Hi! I've been following along and decided to pull out my heaviest tome, the Jepson Manual that has C. affinis info in it and it says, as far as the leaf issue, "0-5 lobes". Hope that helps.
Hamilton Square Garden, Historic City Cemetery, Sacramento California.
Name: Ann ~Heat zn 9, Sunset
North Fl. (Zone 8b)
Garden Sages Native Plants and Wildflowers Xeriscape Organic Gardener I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level
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flaflwrgrl
Apr 21, 2016 7:40 PM CST
Natalie, what conditions are these growing in? Lighting? Soil? What is your county? You're not in Southern Idaho -- what is the terminology they use for your area? What is your elevation?
I am a strong believer in the simple fact is that what matters in this life is how we treat others. I think that's what living is all about. Not what I've done in my life but how I've treated others.
~~ Sharon Brown ~~



[Last edited by flaflwrgrl - Apr 21, 2016 7:44 PM (+)]
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Name: Ann ~Heat zn 9, Sunset
North Fl. (Zone 8b)
Garden Sages Native Plants and Wildflowers Xeriscape Organic Gardener I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level
Butterflies Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier Region: Florida Dog Lover Birds
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flaflwrgrl
Apr 21, 2016 8:17 PM CST
According to the BONAP map C. affinis does not even occur in Idaho.
I am a strong believer in the simple fact is that what matters in this life is how we treat others. I think that's what living is all about. Not what I've done in my life but how I've treated others.
~~ Sharon Brown ~~



Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Daylilies Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Native Plants and Wildflowers
Cottage Gardener Dog Lover Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United States of America Echinacea Xeriscape
Image
Natalie
Apr 21, 2016 8:43 PM CST
I saw that too, Ann, that it doesn't grow where I live. I'm in the northern part of Nez Perce county, but almost on the border of the neighboring county of Clearwater. While Nez Perce county, at the southern tip, does appear to touch the area of WA where it grows, that is nowhere near where I live. Our area is commonly known as North Central Idaho.

It's growing in full sun, with zero shade, in very rocky soil. I can hardly get a shovel in the ground in that area.

Leslieray, thanks for the information on the lobes!
Natalie
Name: Rick R.
near Minneapolis, MN zone 4a
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Sages The WITWIT Badge Garden Photography Region: Minnesota Plant Identifier
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Leftwood
Apr 22, 2016 7:13 AM CST
Many many many many many (get the picture?) herbaceous plants have different color, size and shape leaves on the same plant, depending on where they are located on the stem, time of year or stage of maturity of the plant. That's where the "zero to five lobes" comes from in the Jepson Manual, for instance. I don't see any discrepancies, and in this case, one can only use leaf shape and color as a reinforcing guide (not a definitive characteristic). Personally, I am not very knowledgeable with this particular type of plant, and I can't give an opinion as to which species is correct.

Of course, it would be silly to expect that every square foot of earth in the USA has been botanically scoured for every bit of plant life. If a plant is officially recorded as extant in a county, it is surely possible that it exists in an adjacent county. In addition, plant life is dynamic: they have the ability to move around the landscape over they years by seed as they search for other favorable places to grow. What may have been officially recorded 15 years ago, may or may not be true today, but the information is still very relevant.

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