Brugmansias forum: Brug foliage

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Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 7, 2016 8:59 AM CST
Brugs are a new plant to me. Does the photo show the infamous 'Y'? Of the four rooted cuttings (all the pink ones) I got last fall, three are doing this. Some of the leaves have a pronounced asymmetrical look on the 'Y' growth, but I'm sure it's too hot for them to bloom right now. We are entering the time where triple digit temps are normal.
Thumb of 2016-07-07/needrain/cb8e93

The tallest plant that's not showing the 'Y' growth is 'Tequila Sunrise', the orange/apricot one. It and two of the pink ones are having foliage that is puckering badly. Normally I'd think this was caused by some kind of sucking insect, but I can't find one. Is it possible the high temperature is causing the new leaf growth to pucker? They get water every day, but they still wilt some in the hottest part of the day.
Thumb of 2016-07-07/needrain/cc45f1

@Bubbles

Donald
Name: Sandi
Austin, Tx (Zone 8b)
Texas Gardening
Forum moderator Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Master Gardener: Texas
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Bubbles
Jul 7, 2016 10:08 AM CST
Mine all wilt in the heat of the day, but they perk up as the temperature cools in evening. Not sure what is causing leaf curl. Could be a lack of some nutrient or the dreaded broadmites. I am sending a link to your treemail that might be helpful. If you're worried, just toss them. Better to be safe than sorry. I haven't had curled leaves to deal with, so can't answer that one.
I am waiting for the spider mites to show up next month, if not sooner. I usually get a couple of brugs that start to droop and I see the webbing. Most of mine are in pots so I can treat them individually. I hope someone else will be able to help you like @gone2seed
Name: Cheryl
Kingwood, Texas (Zone 9a)
Region: Texas Greenhouse Composter Plant Identifier Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Amaryllis
Plumerias Ponds Foliage Fan Enjoys or suffers hot summers Tropicals Garden Ideas: Master Level
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ShadyGreenThumb
Jul 7, 2016 10:37 AM CST
I changed up my watering schedule to in the heat of the day around 4 pm. It helps my brugs and EE's. They never wilt and seem to stay healthier that way. A weak plant, after all is a susceptible plant. Sometimes they get water in the mornings when i deep water the lawn. On those days they don't wilt at all in the heat. I think our water-loving brugs are so much better with almost too much water when it's 100º outside. Of course, if you have watering restrictions, this would maybe make you water them by hand each and every day. Not practical for some, I imagine?

While on vacation one of my potted brugs didn't get enough water and has lost all it's leaves. It is still alive but will need some TLC to come back. The ones in pots typically need way more water than the ones in the ground.
Life is short, Break the rules, Forgive quickly, Kiss slowly, Love Truly, Laugh
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mkb136
Jul 8, 2016 7:29 AM CST
Mites some plants are magnet to these others are resistant to them mite spray. You can pull the leaves off bag them then treat the plant you have to spray under the leaves.
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 8, 2016 8:35 AM CST
I found this list of symptoms for broad mites on the net:

Leaves pale. They appear yellow in color.
Leaves darken on the edge. Edges appear brown in color (necrosis). The feeding activity of mites tends to turn leaves yellow with a dark edge.
Leaves have dark speckles on the underside of them. The dark speckles left by Broad Mites will be found predominantly on the underside of the leaves, especially along the veins. These speckles are actually small scars caused by the feeding activity of the mites.
**Leaves are deformed or twisted.
**Leaves curl down on the edge.
Leaves have yellow spots on them.
Leaves have streaks on the underside of them. These streaks may give the entire underside of the leaves a silvery appearance.
Leaves are brittle or cracked.
Plant growth is slow.

The only two symptoms that match I've marked with two asterisks. None of the other symptoms are evident. The plants are growing rapidly, the puckered leaves are not scarred or discolored in any way. I have a lot of plants of many types growing and currently am having another surge of aphids on some plants, but I can't see any aphids on the brugs. I have a lot of very close relatives to African violets growing and that seems to be the other plant most likely to have these mites attack but, so far, they look healthy and normal. A tiny mite makes sense, but other than the leaves puckering, there doesn't seem to be any other signs.

This list of symptoms came from this web site: http://www.optimara.com/doctoroptimara/diagnosis/broadmites....

Edited to add there is no Marijuana growing here either! Doing web searches is turning up a lot of info suggesting broad mites are stoners LOL! If I had close neighbors, I might be wondering what they had growing in the way of a host plant.
Donald
[Last edited by needrain - Jul 8, 2016 8:42 AM (+)]
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mkb136
Jul 8, 2016 3:32 PM CST
Lol there are different also new growth will be hard discolored. But there are different mites different signs.
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 8, 2016 4:57 PM CST
Other than making the new top growth leaves turn into the shape of a parrot's beak, there aren't any other visual signs at this point. There is new growth occurring lower (and more shaded) below the terminal growth that is not growing abnormally at this time. It may later, but now it is fine.
Donald

mkb136
Jul 10, 2016 9:56 AM CST
I have had plants like here like that let it rip. Just keep close eye on them sometimes i give them overdose on fertilizer and the leaves get weird then straighten out.
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 10, 2016 11:00 AM CST
@mkb136
Thanks. As long as it stays confined to the brugs, it's not a major reason for concern, just disappointing. I'm more concerned with providing a host plant that encourages a pest that can wreak damage on other plants I'm growing successfully. I took a magnifying glass and I can't see anything at all. I've only given them fertilize one time and the puckering was already there when I did that, so I can probably rule out feeding. For the minute, I'm not really doing much at all. As long as the plants maintain good color and continue to grow, I'll just keep an eye on them. If those leaves start turning yellow or getting brown edges or growth noticeably slows down, then I'll re-evaluate. Unfortunately for them, I'm not located in what would be a brug friendly climate.
Donald

mkb136
Jul 10, 2016 3:58 PM CST
Don't worry about your other plants they will be fine. Growing season now feed them every week at least Miracle Grow once a month mix epson salt 1 tablespoon per gallon of water with the MG and watch them take off.;)
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
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dyzzypyxxy
Jul 23, 2016 11:00 AM CST
Also try hosing down the plants whenever you're near them with the hose in hand, Donald. If it is mites causing the curled leaves, just dousing the leaves with water can keep them at bay. I used to fret and sweat over my Brugs which absolutely are the favorite plant of mites. Now I just make sure to hose them down if it doesn't rain and haven't had any mite damage this year at all.

I honestly wouldn't worry about the mites moving to other plants - when I had Brugs inside my pool cage they attracted all the mites so I had no problems on my orchids. I need to move another Brug in there as a 'sacrificial lamb' because the orchids are starting to see some mite problems again. They are the only plants I ever have mite problems with, and now that I've been hosing them regularly, not much of that either. I can't hose off the orchids as often as I'd like because they need to dry out between waterings which gives the mites the dry, hot conditions they love.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 23, 2016 11:37 AM CST
Well, I have turned the spray on them a few times, but I don't think it's helped much. Yesterday I bought some Murphy's Oil Soap per this link: http://99-40.com/brugs/curled.html and will probably try it in a day or two. I'd prefer to dunk the whole plant in the solution and let it soak for a few minutes, but they have grown a bit large to manage that feat! Not even the tall water barrels to catch run-off from the roof will be enough to submerge them. I guess I'll mix a solution in my 3 gal. back sprayer to do it. It's definitely mites of some sort, though. I finally was able to see them. Look like tiny little ticks. Nasty. It's getting hotter and drier here and the humidity is dropping as the summer gets going, so I guess the mites are really liking it. I need to throw them a curve ball, I think.
Donald
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
Cat Lover Master Gardener: Florida Tropicals Multi-Region Gardener Vegetable Grower Region: Florida
Herbs Orchids Birds Garden Ideas: Level 2 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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dyzzypyxxy
Jul 23, 2016 11:56 AM CST
Just be sure to rinse off the oil soap before the plants get any sun, Donald. It can make the leaves burn if you leave it on. Once you've sprayed the plants, you can rinse them off about 10 minutes later. It's a contact insecticide. Also, be sure to re-treat the plants within about 5 days to get the next generation as the eggs hatch.

Once you've got the infestation under control, the regular spray with the hose should keep them away.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 23, 2016 12:16 PM CST
They don't get much direct sun. Early and late for a brief time. I had one that got a lot, but as the summer got going, it clearly wasn't enjoying the exposure to 'almost west' Texas sun, so I moved it into thick dappled shade under and oak tree. It was much happier until the mites found it Smiling .
Donald
Name: Sandi
Austin, Tx (Zone 8b)
Texas Gardening
Forum moderator Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Master Gardener: Texas
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Bubbles
Jul 23, 2016 2:11 PM CST
@needrain Check out the brugs that were cuttings sent to @papa in the brug thread, "5 star lineup." I believe most of those are the same that you received. He may have some suggestions. Nearly all mine are in pots because we're on limestone up here on the hill. I took the photos of the side yard when I moved everything off the patio so I could power wash. We then had unexpected company for a week, so I haven't moved things back into place. (We're still recovering).

Mine live close together, so I stay vigilant for bugs. Spraying under the leaves of each of them would be too much work for me, though. I'd have to find another obsession. Whistling

Thumb of 2016-07-23/Bubbles/b8e487


Thumb of 2016-07-23/Bubbles/72166a

You can see this half of our backyard is shady in the mornings. I also had to drain the fountain to clean, so made a good spot for little pots.

Thumb of 2016-07-23/Bubbles/b22f0c

Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 23, 2016 2:38 PM CST
Mine will be in pots. I'm not going to plant something I have to dig to bring inside. I wouldn't find time to do that. My plants look as tall, and maybe wider because all but 'Tequila Sunrise' have multiple trunks. No hint of bloom, though. It's probably been far to hot here for that to happen. When I spray, I'll probably tip the pots on their side so I can spray thoroughly underneath and on top of the leaves. I only have one growing in a black nursery container and that one is set in a large bean pot and surrounded and covered with pine bark so the pot is concealed. That one is probably going to be the biggest hassle even though the plant is actually in the smallest container. The other three plants are in larger clay pots - heavier, but more accessible. That heat dome promised for nearly all the continental U.S. is well established here at the moment, but there's a chance there will be a bit of cool down mid week. I'll probably wait for that to spray anything on them. If a bit of cooler temperatures doesn't materialize, I'll probably spray them down anyway. If I get my act together, I should be able to time it so the mix will be on long enough to smother things and be protected from any hot sun until they get rinsed off..
Donald
Name: Sandi
Austin, Tx (Zone 8b)
Texas Gardening
Forum moderator Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Master Gardener: Texas
Region: Texas Tropicals Plumerias Ferns Greenhouse Garden Art
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Bubbles
Jul 23, 2016 5:25 PM CST
Well, just to make you feel better.....we are under water restrictions here and at the lake. Can only water here between midnight and 10 am on Sat. and same hours on Wed. Problem is...the same restrictions are an hour away at the lake place. We spend a lot of time on the highway during the summer.
Edited to add: water restrictions are between midnight and 10am, then 6pm until midnight on Sat. and Wed. at both places. Hand watering Is allowed anytime.
[Last edited by Bubbles - Jul 23, 2016 9:21 PM (+)]
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Name: charles
Anderson, S.C (Zone 8b)
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papa
Jul 23, 2016 5:31 PM CST
I dont have spider mites issues yet but I water 3 times a day and mist the leaves each time. My problem is the little brown Beatles at night. I finally resorted to using selvin dust on some of them and it seems to have slowed them down and hasn't hurt the plants.
Name: Donald
Eastland county, Texas (Zone 8a)
Region: Texas Enjoys or suffers hot summers Raises cows Plant Identifier
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needrain
Jul 23, 2016 9:01 PM CST
Bubbles said:Well, just to make you feel better.....we are under water restrictions here and at the lake. Can only water here between midnight and 10 am on Sat. and same hours on Wed. Problem is...the same restrictions are an hour away at the lake place. We spend a lot of time on the highway during the summer.


I think water restrictions are the future norm. All that rain and full lakes this year but water restrictions in place. I understand some of it, but when there is a lot of hoopla about new industry coming in with new jobs, I wonder. Those require water. I hope it rains soon. My pasture needs it and, even more, it would reduce the fire hazard a bit.
Donald
Name: Sandi
Austin, Tx (Zone 8b)
Texas Gardening
Forum moderator Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Master Gardener: Texas
Region: Texas Tropicals Plumerias Ferns Greenhouse Garden Art
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Bubbles
Jul 23, 2016 9:49 PM CST
We all worry about fire. We're one street over from a canyon full of dried brush. We had some workers from Austin canvassing the neighborhood about fire danger. They asked us if we had at least two exits in case of fire. DH pointed down the street and told them that was the only way out. They scribbled it down, but they dried brush is still in the canyon!

Water is either feast or famine here lately. So much construction has changed the course of some of the creeks and flooded homes that have been high and dry since the 50s. Guess at some point I'll have to decide to give up some of my thirstier plants. That would be the brugs, unfortunately.

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