Roses forum: will this save my rose bed?

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toledo ohio (Zone 5b)
Native Plants and Wildflowers
Tisha
Sep 3, 2016 7:51 PM CST
will digging up my 15+ rosebushes, planting them into 10gal. plastic trash tubs, then resinking the tubs into the garden work? the prince, dark lady,munstead wood are the types of bushes I`m working with. please help how would I go about this project?
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
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dyzzypyxxy
Sep 3, 2016 8:03 PM CST
Hi Tisha, and welcome to garden.org. Um, what exactly is wrong with your rose bushes that makes you want to take this drastic action? A picture of them and the area would help a lot.

How old are these rose bushes? If they are growing adjacent to trees that have roots invading the rose area then yes, re-planting them in tubs and sinking the tubs might help, but another problem with planting roses near trees is that the trees will also shade the roses at some point, and full sun is definitely a part of a successful rose garden.

You also will want to wait until your roses go pretty much dormant in the fall before rousting them out of where they are, I think.

But please! First tell us the history and problems you're seeing.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
[Last edited by dyzzypyxxy - Sep 3, 2016 8:09 PM (+)]
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Name: Celia
West Valley City, Utah (Zone 7a)
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Zencat
Sep 3, 2016 8:07 PM CST
Welcome! Tisha!

I agree. We need more info into why you need to do this.
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
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RoseBlush1
Sep 3, 2016 10:30 PM CST
Welcome! Tisha

Whatever the reason you are choosing to dig up your roses and plant them in in containers and then sink them back into the bed, yes it can work. The most important thing to remember is to drill enough drainage holes both at the bottom of the pots and all around the pots so that the roots can grow through the pots and are not limited to just the container and so that water will drain well and your roses will not stay too moist.

Edited to add:

This method of planting is often used to protect roses from gopher damage.
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
[Last edited by RoseBlush1 - Sep 3, 2016 10:33 PM (+)]
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Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 4:57 AM CST
I've never been there but I don't think they have gophers in Ohio? Maybe Tisha expects to move house, winter the plants in a greenhouse or something. It sounds more like a soil problem though from the title. I agree we need more information on the reason to know if it will work.

Edited to add, forgot to say welcome Trisha!

[Last edited by sooby - Sep 4, 2016 5:28 AM (+)]
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Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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RoseBlush1
Sep 4, 2016 7:33 AM CST
Sue ... I wasn't talking about the specific problem, but the planting technique. It works. That is just one of the problems it is used to solve. Caging the roots in a plastic container vs a metal container or wire is more effective in that the metal or wire deteriorates much faster over time.

I am just affirming that burying the root mass in plastic containers can be effective problem solving.
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 7:40 AM CST
Sorry, Lyn, I did realize that's what you meant but I was just kind of thinking out loud that that wouldn't be a reason why Tisha wants to do this. Do you think sinking tubs would work even in heavy clay without filling up with water? Not that we know that's the problem either Whistling
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
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RoseBlush1
Sep 4, 2016 7:57 AM CST
Yes, it does work, if there are sufficient holes drilled in the container. There may be some other factors that may have to be considered, but that will require more information about the problem being solved.

Many people have used metal or wire to cage the roots of their roses for problem solving and ended up having to dig them up again because the within a couple of years because they just didn't hold up, so plastic turned out to be a better solution both for sandy and clay soils. I haven't worked in "heavy clay", so someone with more experience with that kind of soil can probably address that question better than I can.
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 10:51 AM CST
I was just wondering if, in some soils, having holes on the outside of the tub might allow water to drain in rather than out and whether holes just in the bottom might be better.
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
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RoseBlush1
Sep 4, 2016 12:35 PM CST
Sue ...

The feeder roots on a rose are located near the top of the root mass and they need to spread out. If they do not have room to spread beyond the container, the plant will become root bound in very quickly and will not thrive. The roots at the bottom are only anchor roots.

The soil in the container should be firm enough so that water does not drain into the container.
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
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zuzu
Sep 4, 2016 1:23 PM CST

Moderator

Holes in the bottom of a container sometimes aren't enough, Sue. I often have to drill holes in the sides of a container because the roots have plugged up the holes at the bottom. It doesn't become apparent until after a heavy rain, when i suddenly notice that the water is not draining away and the plant is in danger of becoming waterlogged. If the plant and the container are so large that I can't lift them to prune the roots, I have no choice but to drill holes in the sides of the container.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 1:32 PM CST
Zuzu, these are to be sunk in the ground so presumably then the holes in the sides would have to be big enough that the roots themselves don't block the drainage? I'm not sure the dimensions of a ten gallon trash tub, on Google they mostly seem to be tall and narrow in which case I'm not sure I'd want to be digging the 15 holes to sink them in Whistling Or maybe Tisha means those tubs with the rope handles, which are somewhat wider.
[Last edited by sooby - Sep 4, 2016 1:38 PM (+)]
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Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
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zuzu
Sep 4, 2016 1:49 PM CST

Moderator

The "side" roots on most roses wouldn't be large enough to plug up holes in the sides of the container, but I agree with you that digging holes for 10-gallon trash tubs is nothing I'd want to do, so I have to wonder why the OP is taking this drastic step.
toledo ohio (Zone 5b)
Native Plants and Wildflowers
Tisha
Sep 4, 2016 2:47 PM CST
I don`t know how to use the computer so bare with till I muddle thru
yes sue I`m waiting for my house to move due to extreme mole activity

have been building a plan based on conversation so far
plastic 10 gal.tubs are 14" diam. x 17" deep IS THIS SIZE OK?

NEXT check drainage
drill bottom holes,place tub in hole, add 2 gal. h2o
time drainage
IS 1 HOUR GOOD?
DO ANCOR ROOTS NEED SOME HOLES?
how do I add little images to my post?

NEXT drill holes for feeder roots
plan to sink tubs additional 2" deep for h2o well, winterizing etc
HOW FAR DOWN DRILL HOLES FOR FEEDER ROOTS TO GROW OUT IF THEY NEED
HOW FAR DOWN FOR DRAINAGE OF WATERING?




toledo ohio (Zone 5b)
Native Plants and Wildflowers
Tisha
Sep 4, 2016 3:05 PM CST
I`m 62yrs. I don`t want to dig any holes Grumbling
how do I add the little faces to my post?
I love and need my corgies and my roses Lovey dubby
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 3:31 PM CST
I'll leave the tub details for @RoseBlush1 and @zuzu but when are you moving, is it before winter? If it is before winter do you really need to sink the tubs in the ground? You can add images to your post by selecting "Upload an Image", the green button on the left below the text entry box. It will ask you to select an image from your computer. The little faces are also below the text entry box, just click on one to add it.
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
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zuzu
Sep 4, 2016 3:44 PM CST

Moderator

Well, Tisha, I see you got the hang of adding the faces. Smiling

I don't think I've ever moved a rose because of mole activity. Moles eat bugs and aren't interested in plant roots or any other part of a plant. They can tunnel under plants and leave the roots exposed to too much oxygen, I suppose, but I always flattern the tunnels when I see them. I don't remember ever losing a rose because of mole activity, and I've been growing roses for at least 40 years.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
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sooby
Sep 4, 2016 3:50 PM CST
Could it be voles rather than moles, Tisha? Voles will damage plants.

Voles:
https://www.google.ca/search?q=meadow+vole&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8...

Moles:
https://www.google.ca/search?q=moles&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en...
toledo ohio (Zone 5b)
Native Plants and Wildflowers
Tisha
Sep 4, 2016 7:02 PM CST
sue Thank You! bout the images
being sarcastic bout `moles` moving my house Rolling on the floor laughing
I don`t handle the windy cold as when younger
need to get tubs as close to being ready for the transplants as possible
drilled sunk 3/4 full of soil mix
ready to receive as poss
toledo ohio (Zone 5b)
Native Plants and Wildflowers
Tisha
Sep 4, 2016 9:02 PM CST
zuzu surface tunnels are not really visable till I turn my ankle
then I do step them down
they return within hours
the deeper tunnels are 12" to20" down
disc plowing works
not practical
water and nutrients run down the tunnels
plants roots don`t grow in air pockets Sad
hose flooding tunnels doesn`t work it just runs down and away Angry

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