Hello Everyone!

My name is Jesse and the last two years I've spent lots of hours learning about and getting my lawn restored. Now that I have it in good shape my eyes are looking around the rest of the yard and how I can beautify it. I have a flower bed that runs along a section of my driveway. Below that bed are beautiful 100 year old flagstones that get covered with crabgrass each summer. This summer I began researching options for low growing ground covers I could plant in between the flagstone. I found Turkish Speedwell, or creeping veronica, and was pretty intent on giving that a try. I called a local nursery and asked about it or similar plants I could use. The gentleman I spoke with mentioned a "gorgeous, low growing orange sedum" I asked him to repeat the name.. sedum? I had never hear of them. He explained they are a variety of succulents. I replied I wanted a perennial and one that could survive a Connecticut winter. I couldn't believe it when he said there were dozens if not hundreds of cold hardy varieties! I've always loved succulents but figured they were only a warm climate plant. Now my mind is racing and I am obessed with researching and learning more about these plants and design ideas. So here is my space I want to develop with stonecrops and hens and chicks.



I'm just overwhelmed at the moment with all the variety and but also eager to get started. The wave/super putunias I planted this year were placed way to close together and they are now leggy and weed grasses are coming through. Not sure if I should try to get some stonecrops down this fall, or if spring is better. I have completely killed all the weed grasses between the flagstones. I was planning on digging some of the soil out from between the rocks and amending with succulent sand to help with the drainage.

Am I correct in saying all stonecrop and hens and chicks are cold hardy? I am in zone 6b. These can really be covered in a foot of snow and come back in the spring? Does anyone have any good resources for getting started with Sedum / Succulents? I have no idea how to pick and place the plants design-wise.

Jesse

When planting these in between flagstones that get very weedy in the summer, how do you prevent the weeds like crabgrass? Can a pre-emergent be used if these are rooted?

Welcome @JesseInCT! I'm no expert in Sedums, but I know that not all Sedums are cold hardy to zone 6. You will have to do some research on the ones you like. You can check the Sedum database for more info on lots of different sedums here: The Sedums Database

A pre-emergent prevents seeds from germinating and it needs to be put down in early spring before the crabgrass seeds start to germinate. It will not harm already established plants.

Thanks Frenchy!

Great information on the pre-emergent Frenchy.

to NGA Jesse. So nice to meet you and glad you found your way here.
What is the limit on height that you want growing between the flagstones Jesse?
And you can do a combination of things for visual affect. Like creeping thyme? Most of them are hardy to zone 4. They will usually smother out any weeds once established. https://garden.org/plants/sear...

Phedimus spurius was previously under the name of Sedum spurium, and all are wonderful tough plants. In the spring you can cut back to the new growth, planting the cuttings for new plants. This will also make for a prettier plant.
This one was cut back this spring, making for a nice full looking display.


Here are more varieties of Pediumus spurius: https://garden.org/plants/sear...
Sedum album varieties are also hardy in your growing zone: https://garden.org/plants/sear...

And there are many more. Even 2 to 3 foot tall varieties of Hylotelephium that used to be classified as sedum.
They would be lovely in your border and are perennial and the clumps get bigger each year.
https://garden.org/plants/sear...

I hope this was helpful?

Thanks, ValleyLynn! Very helpful!

Thanks for the creeping thyme suggestion. When I spoke to the gentleman at the local nursery over the phone he also mentioned creeping thyme and even said he could give me a very good deal on some. I'd like the plants in between the flagstones to be as low as possible. Right along the wall I might plant some taller varieties, then in the bed I want a mix of different sizes, colors, textures, some hanging over the edge. It's just so hard researching because I keep finding new varieties and I think, "ooooooo, that's the one!" only to say that again and again and again! I need to take a deep breath and relax! It looks like even if I place some, then decide I don't like their location these are tough little plants that can be moved around. I would love some resources on design basics, then again my wife always seems to know these "rules", like "contrast these colors", "you have an even number of those, and should add another", but if you have any good resources for basic design using stonecrops and hens and chicks I would love to read more.

I am also now wondering if I might be able to get away with some small hens "in" the brick retaining wall. There are little areas on some of the bricks where I could set a few on a bit of sandy soil. Weed grasses come through in spots, so I wonder if hens and chicks might be able to find a way in and root. It would look cool. I am very excited to say the least! Thanks for the ideas!

Jesse, you sure can put some of the small varieties of semps in that wall, one of the arach types would be adorable.
Another plant that would cascade over the side of the wall is Delosperma cooperii. This is one tough plant. I am constantly cutting this one back when it grows all the way down to the lawn. It also blooms all growing season.

Hi Jesse, to the NGA.

You have a good bit of nice real estate to cover between your flagstones. That would make a lovely sedum, semp and thyme garden area.
Your conditions in CT. are very similar to mine here in Illinois.

Lynn's suggestion of Pediumus spurius is a good choice. I have some but in my climate the harsh winters they are only semi evergreen dying back to the stolons and coming back with vigor in spring.
For low growing I might suggest Sedum Album. Hardy, evergreen, low growing clumping type. It will spread but slowly. Cuttings root up easily for propagation and comes in many different cultivars.

Another good variety, somewhat taller growing but would look nice back against your retaining wall is Petrosedum rupestre subsp. rupestre 'Blue Spruce. I love the bright blue and the spruce needle like leaves. Tough as nails, evergreen, mine seldom gets taller than 6-8". It will spread slowly and is easily propagated from cuttings. I have some of this in hanging baskets, poor soil, harsh sun, rain, snow, ice storms, BAH! can't touch this. Grows equally well in ground. If it gets too lanky for your tastes, wack it back, root up the tip cuttings and it the original plant will produce more branches and come right back.

Another pretty mounding type is Sedum hispanicum 'Blue Carpet'. Winter hardy, slow growing creeper, soft blue in summer, taking on a deeper blue/pinkish blush in winter. The mounds tend to limit themselves to roughly 8-12" in diameter but it also grows easily from cuttings if you want to spread it around or enlarge the area it occupies.



Of the different succulent nurseries listed here at NGA. (Thanks Lynn) Perennial Obsessions has a very nice variety of sedums.

https://perennialobsessions.co...

Great suggestions BigT.
And yes, Perennial Obsession has some really great sedum.

Thank you so much BigT and ValleyLynn!

I really appreciate your suggestions and will look into these varieties. I am going to get started on this project next week and will post photos.

Again, really appreciate the suggestions!

Jesse

One more question if I may...

How should I ammend the soil between the flagstone to ensure adequate drainage? I have almost zero clay content in my soil, mostly sand and silt. This area is sloped so water should naturally run off this area, but I was thinking of digging out a few inches all the way in and around these and ammending with some sharp sand and maybe a touch of compost or peat.

Any suggestions?

Thanks!
Jesse

Thanks for the suggestion on Perennial Obsession. I placed a small order. I am really excited to get started.

Jesse

Jesse, your plants should do very well in your sandy loam soil. That is what I have filled my raised beds with, and all the plants seem to thrive in it. How lucky you are to not have to redo the soil.
You can top dress the plants with chicken grit. It will help to anchor the plants until they get going.

Nice list from PO. And remember it is easy to start new plants from the tiny leaves of the 'Faro Form' and cuttings from the other sedum. Might have to wait until next spring to do this, when the plants are actively growing again.

I had a recommendation for a company selling their plants at 50% off right now. They have good ratings in our green pages, and have hardy hibiscus, sedums, a few sempervivums and much more. I had to place a big order.
https://www.growjoy.com/store/...

Will I be OK planting these sedum and semps this week? I am seeing these should be planted in spring online.. I am in zone 6b in CT. Any other tips for planting aside from well draining soil and full sun?

If you purchased from Perennial Obsessions they will most likely be bare root and need potting up anyway. Whether in ground or pots they will have the same recovery time. With what is left of your growing season until first frost, you won't see new growth, but should have time to establish some good root growth. I would put them in ground myself.

Jesse, not sure when you cold weather starts up, but I agree with BigT. I would wait to plant that area until spring. If you get plants now you can have them in containers until spring, and in the spring take cuttings that will quickly root and give more plants to do the job.

I got my first semps and sedum!

I liked Lynn's suggestion about planting them up in pots so I bought some and potted them up. After doing so I read the note the Perennial Obsessions sent along with the plants. It said not to use any mixes containing peat. The mix I used, Miracle Grow Succulent soil, had peat. I got indecisive and decided to remove them from the pots and just put them in the ground since I know my soil is sandy and with the slope I was planting on, I figured they would be happy there.

What do you all use for potting mixes for Semps? I've done a little research since planting and some swear by peat in their potting mixes and some say to avoid it. I did find a small bag of chicken grit and topdressed them with that. Also, where do you all find you specialty items like pumice and turface? Online? I paid $8 for a small bag of chicken grit at agway and would like to find it in a larger bag at a better price if possible.





I saw my mom this weekend and was telling her about my new hobby. She mentioned a friend had hen and chicks and asked her if she had any to split up. She gave me this semp yesterday and said she hadn't gotten around to planting it so she wanted me to have it...

She bought it at home depot this spring on clearance for $3.50!!

Hi Jesse,

I make a mix that is 1 part pea gravel, this is typically a 3/8" gravel. 1 part traction sand or tube sand (you probably have this in CT, it's sold to use as added weight in the rear of cars during the winter, it can also be used by spreading under your tires when stuck for added traction.) I prefer this to play sand as it also has as much grit as sand, it's 1/4" and finer. 1 part potting mix. Anymore it's hard to find any potting mix that isn't peat based or coco noir (ground coconut shell) or that doesn't have fertilizer already in it. Most of us don't use any fertilizer on our semps as it can make them have atypical growth as they contain too much nitrogen. Some do use Miracle Gro Quick Start, on seedlings. This is a high phosphorus, low nitrogen, potassium fertilizer that promotes strong root growth over vigorous top growth. I make my own potting mix from composted leaf and pine straw, mixed with the soil from my yard. Pea gravel and traction sand should be easy to find at your local home improvement center. As for poultry grit check at feed stores and farm supplies. I can get a 50# bag of Cherry Stone brand for $8.00 and I use this primarily for top dressing. You're back east in granite country, this should be cheap and readily available.

Your bed is looking like you're getting a good start on it with some very pretty semps, and it will be a good test to see how well they winter over. Folks around here are sticklers about preserving the cultivar names of their semps and typically will have some sort of name tag nearby. Unidentifiable semps are called NOIDs, no ID, which still can be beautiful. I have several myself and appreciate their beauty none the less.

That is a very nice semp holy cremoly is that pot full. It was a deal at $3.50, even better for free. That will certainly help fill in your beds.

Hey there Jesse, you have been busy.
Great photo of your new babies. You will need a lot more top dressing around and under the rosettes to keep the leaves off of the soil. During wet cold weather the soil can encourage rot.
I'm with BigT on that potted semp. WOW!! You really got your money's worth with that one.

I get my chicken grit, same as what BigT gets, from my local feed stone. $10 per 50lb bag.