Roses forum: Rose Question

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Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
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jakedasnake89
Apr 4, 2012 4:29 PM CST
I am pretty novice when it comes to rose culture. I have had only two rose bushes so far that I purchased since last year from stores like Home Depot or Lowes and I have made them take off and nearly double in size. An example being my little Mini Rose, though on the second pic the AZ sun has already singed the edges a bit lol.

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There is about 10 months between the pics.

My other is this pink that I love


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So my question. Well I was feeling pretty good about Roses so I decided to purchase a Mr. Lincoln rose bush about three months ago online from I think its was Jackson and something maybe Perkins. They mailed it off to me bare root all trimmed down with no foilage or little branches. I planted it like i did the previous two, using the method that I do with daylillies and irises. Make a hole with the center of it mounded up so the roots go down and around while the base remains ground level. cover her up and watered. Well its been abut three months and I still have no sign of any life, Is this normal for roses mailed bare root and all? Or did I do something wrong in planting? I love roses and I want to add to my collection, but I will purchase in person next time unless I can figure this mystery out. I still water it as if its dormant, I just dont know and I hate to give up. I can go out and take a photo if needed! Thanks!
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Apr 4, 2012 6:14 PM CST
I would expect it to have sprouted out by now unless it is still very cold there. Are the canes green? If not, perhaps they sold you a dead rose.
Porkpal
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Apr 4, 2012 8:40 PM CST
Jake - I suspect that the only thing you did wrong was to order from Jackson & Perkins! LOL! You buried it just fine and, if it were going to survive, it should have sent out a few buds by now. What color are the canes? Are they green / black / brown? You definitely want them green. If they're green, one thing you can *try* is to get some "Super Thrive" http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDi...

You can get that at any Home Depot. It's a bit pricy, like $14 / bottle, but it only takes a drop a gallon, so we're talking it will go a LONG LONG ways.

I'm sorry that your rose isn't doing well. Mr. Lincoln is one of the few reds I adore. HUGE HUGE *RED* blooms, scented from heaven, lasts forever.. And don't look down upon the big box stores! That's where I get a TON of my roses when I don't order them from here, there, & everywhere else. I have to get roses that are already pretty robust to survive my zone.. and my ineptitude! You should be able to pick up a Mr. Lincoln almost anywhere that sells potted roses.. Home Depot / Lowes / Walmart / grocery stores!

Welcome to Roses! It's an addiction, but such a pretty addiction!!
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
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jakedasnake89
Apr 4, 2012 11:01 PM CST
Thanks porkpal and Toni!

The canes went from a green to brown over that course of time. Tomorrow I will go out and check them for any greenish hue. If they have some green I'll use some superthrive, I have a good amount of it since I use it in conjuction with other fertilizers and root stimulates for daylilies.

As for Mr. Lincoln it was your exact description that drew me to it Smiling As for box stores, lol, I don't look down on them hahal. Must have typed a confusing sentence up there lol, my pink rose came from Lowes and it is doing great, Does Jackson and Perkins, have a reputation? I had never used them previously. Anyways the only other thing I can think of is water frequency, I live in Arizona in the valley where temps hit in the 120s in Summer and as of now we are grazing the 90s. Do roses love water or do they prefer a duration of time between waterings to let the ground dry out. I water normally every couple days by hand until it is 100+ then I go to daily watering for my daylilies as I can visually see my plants wilt in the heat. Funny how some areas have winter dormancy, but I have summer dormancy where plants drop back until the fall, lol.

Thanks again for the quick response, its a pleasure to meet your aquaintance! May we all have many more conversations as I learn and grow these flowers.
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Apr 5, 2012 8:27 AM CST
I have a saying that I follow: If it ain't broke, don't fix. If your roses that you put in last year from the big boxes are thriving, then you're doing the right thing. They'll let you know when they're unhappy. As far as drying out, just check the leaves. If they're happy & shiny w/o blackspot, you're watering enough. If they turn yellow & fall off, obviously you're watering too much. If they're crispy, then by all means, water more!! Roses are SOOOOOOOO easy to take care of...

J&P sucks. Just being honest. LOLLLL! Check out Zuzu's blog on J&P (http://garden.org/blogs/view/zuzu/ - scroll down to March 20th). I ordered from them back in .. '07? '08? for my mom for Mother's Day. Ordered in like March, they messed EVERYTHING up, and the roses that my mom *did* get croaked almost immediately. I can't blame J&P 100% for them croaking on my mom as she has a black thumb, so I'll blame them about 95%. But I know I personally will NEVER EVER EVER order anything from J&P. If you want to order roses, there are a TON of places to order that have gorgeous roses that you won't find (mostly) locally (at least I can't, which is why I order them!). I personally will recommend Palatine (http://www.palatineroses.com) and Roses Unlimited (http://www.rosesunlimitedownroot.com). Palatine.. you have to jump on the bandwagon when they first open up their ordering in September otherwise they sell out of the cool stuff fast. Roses Unlimited is a good choice for you as you're in a warm environment (they can't really handle the cold too well). Palatine sends out this MASSIVE bareroot roses (the roots will be about 2' long!!) while RU will send out own-root 2-year old plants usually between 10-24" tall in little 1gal pots. Only problem is the shipping costs. RU can get pretty expensive (for this far west, they average about $25/rose with s&h plus the rose itself), but I've gotten some gorgeous roses from them that I will never be able to get locally!

I re-read your posting and I'm betting dollars to donuts that Mr. Lincoln's dead. Got shot while watching a play & it's dead. *plays Taps* I'd call up J&P and raise hell, get your $$ back. Mr. Lincoln is one of the most hardiest roses on the planet. Seriously. If I can't kill it, NO ONE can kill it and I'm an expert on killing roses.

I'm guessing your pink is Sonja (http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.5868.4). She's one of the few pinks I have. She's a VERY dependable rose. HMF (http://www.helpmefind.com/roses) states that she has a fruity scent, but to me she stinks of pepper. Sad But she's a dependable rose! Your mini red could be Ruby Ruby. <3 Ruby Ruby.. one of the absolute best red roses IMO. Too bad they're so small! LOLL!!
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Suzanne/Sue
Sebastopol, CA (Zone 9a)
Sunset Zone 15
Region: California Plant Database Moderator Roses Irises Clematis Garden Photography
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Calif_Sue
Apr 5, 2012 9:37 AM CST

Moderator

Even though we don't like to direct anyone away from this website Green Grin! Garden Watchdog has been a good go-to for getting the scoop on many mail order nurseries, we're working on getting that kind of info here, it will take time though. Here's Jackson & Perkins recent ratings:
http://davesgarden.com/products/gwd/c/33/
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Name: Betty
Bakersfield, CA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Birds The WITWIT Badge Region: United States of America Roses
Irises Cat Lover Daylilies Region: California Garden Ideas: Level 1
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Betja
Apr 5, 2012 10:05 AM CST
I guess I'm really lucky that the patio tree rose of MONKEY BUSINESS I purchased from J&P two years ago has done well for me. The only problem I had was that it mildewed that first spring, but no mildew since then. But after reading those ratings I think I'll just can all those catalogs I keep getting from them now. Here is a picture from last year and two blooms from last week. It is an unusual golden yellow color, almost honey colored, that I really couldn't capture with my camera, and I love it because of the unusual color plus I love the flower form of this floribunda.

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Betty
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Apr 5, 2012 10:16 AM CST
Betty - I think you *did* get lucky w/Monkey Business. Beautiful rose. I had the choice of getting MB or Cha-Ching! so I went with Cha-Ching! 'cuz that's the name of my mom's dog. I really should pick one up for her.. but I hate driving down to her house!
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses
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Steve812
Apr 5, 2012 4:50 PM CST
Jake, Welcome!
What USDA zone are you in? Is Surprise in a valley near, say Phoenix, or is it at a high elevation. I ask because this really matters. I have bare root roses that I set in the ground in the first week of March and they are just waiting for warm weather. But I also have some that have been in the ground for two weeks that are setting leaves. I'm in zone 7, but nights here get pretty chilly (25-40F). That means that many of the roses just keep waiting and waiting for warmer weather.

While they wait it is important to keep the ground from drying out. I typically water every other day or every third day until leaves are well set. By then, of course, it's usually warm enough that I should be watering every other day anyway...

(After checking Google Maps) It looks like you are in Zone 8 or 9. That suggests to me that you should have planted Mr Lincoln in mid February and kept him well watered (almost daily) until now. Also, you probably should have buried the bud union by an inch or so. Usually rose companies send instructions on how to plant bare root roses. And most of them recommend between 1 hour and 24 hours of soaking to rehydrate the roses before planting them. In any case, if you followed the instructions and kept the rose watered and it has not produced any leaves by now I'd guess it is dead. Also, if there are no leaves soon and the bark is brown I'd expect it is dead.

J&P once sold the healthiest roses you could buy, but their reputation with this crowd right now is lower than pond-scum (which at least would make good garden fertilizer). Other possible suppliers you may want to check out are Cool Roses, Roses Unlimited, Pickering, Antique Rose Emporium, and Palatine. I have even had some luck planting potted roses from Lowes or Home Depot.
Name: Mike Stewart
Lower Hudson Valley, NY (Zone 6b)
Seed Starter Container Gardener Roses Bulbs I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Peonies
Clematis Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Dog Lover Cat Lover Birds Region: New York
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Mike
Apr 5, 2012 6:49 PM CST
Surprise is 9A/B
Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
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jakedasnake89
Apr 5, 2012 8:47 PM CST
Thanks Toni, for the wonderful compliments! As for Mr. Lincoln I'm thinking I lost it too. I'll keep up the watering for another week or two and see what that gets me after which his spot gets taken by a new recruit.

Sue, thanks for the outside link. No worries I've been at cubits and ATP too long now for me to want to skip out.

Betty you truly are amazing. You're like air, everywhere Smiling whether its here, irises, daylilies, or lyles cubit too funny. We must have the same taste for gardening and flowers. And I love the yellow rose, beautiful, my grandma used to have one that looked very similar until my uncles moved in and killed it. :(

Steve, an Arizonan! Yeah I'm zone 9 I believe and I've followed those directions you mentioned just about perfectly. I'm sitting around 1200 ft. I know even Wickenburg is a little higher than me and it only increases as you go up Yarnel, peeples valley, and eventually into Prescott. I'm probably gonna go locally for my next one before on line again. How's your weather been, I only see Prescott every couple months when we drive someone up there by ambo.

Mike, thanks for the additional info. I always assumed I was 9. So does that mean I'm both 9A/B or one or the other?

Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Apr 6, 2012 8:37 AM CST
1200 ft. Yikes. That's too low for my lungs to handle. Anything below 3000ft and I can't breathe. I can't imagine living that low again.
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses
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Steve812
Apr 6, 2012 8:44 AM CST
Jake, I love Prescott. Every furry creature in town is happy that I have taken up rose gardening and dines in my garden when I'm not in it. I've been told this is a great location to grow roses, but I'm not having much luck here except with David Austin roses - the few cultivars that deer, squirrels, javelina, rabbits, voles, pocket gophers, and other sundry garden browsers don't find appetizing.

Another hazard here is yo-yo weather: where 70 degree spring days lure plants out of dormancy, then a winter storm blows through bringing killing frosts that demolish them. Watering is a big deal, too. This year I'm working harder than ever to overcome these obstacles. Maybe I'll get a good photo or two to post here in a couple of months.



Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
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jakedasnake89
Apr 6, 2012 8:36 PM CST
Yea, I love Prescott, your weather is similar to my dads. He lives in Heber out past Payson on your way to Show Low. He is a little higher up than you but he has been getting strange weather, Want to say he had snow a few weeks ago again.

On a different note Mr. Lincoln met its replacement. When I dug it out the roots didnt even look alive so I am happy its gone, eye sore. Anyways local stores don't have MR. Lincoln right now, so its replacement is Don Juan. Dont know much about it aside from it smells real good lol. Best of luck to me!


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Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Apr 6, 2012 10:08 PM CST
Did you get the climbing version of Don Juan? I don't like DJ as much as MrL 'cuz the roses aren't as big and they don't fade to that brilliant purpley color like MrL does. But it does smell good & probably doesn't have as bad as thorns.
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
Image
jakedasnake89
Apr 6, 2012 10:19 PM CST
Yeah it says its a climber. Trust me Toni, the moment I see MrL in store, it will be riding shotgun home. Today it was either DJ or Scarlet Knight. Aside from MrL I'm now in the market for a beautiful yellow, the wifeys favorite rose color, and a white. Any suggestions, I'm trying to avoid any mini varitities this time around.
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Apr 6, 2012 10:23 PM CST
I have read many posts raving about Don Juan. You may find it a satisfactory substitute.
Porkpal
Name: Betty
Bakersfield, CA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Birds The WITWIT Badge Region: United States of America Roses
Irises Cat Lover Daylilies Region: California Garden Ideas: Level 1
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Betja
Apr 7, 2012 8:29 AM CST
I think Don Juan is a beautiful rose, and if I remember correctly it's more of a pillar climber. So if you put a straight-up trellis behind and tie the canes to it here and there you could have a gorgeous display of blooms within a few months or by next year.

Betty
[Last edited by Betja - Apr 7, 2012 8:30 AM (+)]
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Name: Jake
Surprise, AZ (Zone 9a)
Daylilies Region: Southwest Gardening
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jakedasnake89
Apr 7, 2012 9:06 AM CST
I've been running it through the boss, the wife, if I should do just that.
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses
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Steve812
Apr 7, 2012 11:15 AM CST
I absolutely love the fragrance of Don Juan. And the color of the rose is about as good as a red rose gets. I have been surprised at how well it does here. Most HTs I've had no luck with, but DJ seems to tolerate half a day of shade, three kinds of terrible soil, and moderate neglect. I just keep planting more. It is a climber, but my understanding is that it's not a rambler. It would do fine tied to a 6 ft pillar, I imagine. Some of DJ's pluck as a plant comes from its climbing parent which has some multiflora blood in it. But that does mean its blossoms are a little smaller.

Toni, I guess I'm just not fond of the fading process that turns red roses bluish - AKA bluing. It was considered a great rose breeding breakthrough when HT roses were bred to resist it.

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