Cactus and Succulents forum: Starting Lophophora Williamsii seeds

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(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 22, 2019 9:10 PM CST
Hello guys, I am new here and have stumbled across a thread or two about the Lophophora Williamsii and they were really helpful to read. I'm hoping to get a little guidance on my very first Lophophora grow. In terms of growing medium I have mixed 1 part Cactus and Succulent soil, 1 part Perlite, and 1/2 part river rocks. As I am typing this this I just realized I probably didn't need the river rocks until they are ready to be potted on their own.

From what I've read they need to be in the 70°- 80° range to germinate, is that correct?

My next question is should I be adding bone meal to the mix in a small amount to help the roots?

Next question, How much light should they be getting from two 24W 6400K T5 bulbs

Also should I buy a seed tray warmer? to keep the temp of the dirt consistent?

That's all I can think to ask right now I am going to be getting the seeds tomorrow and would like to get started on them as soon as possible.Also I will be posting pictures of how my dirt mix looks for pointers on how it looks and maybe how to improve it. Thanks guys for taking the time to read this and I am excited to see what you all have to say. Also I will post pictures of what I was planing on using to germinate them in to see what you guys think.
Thumb of 2019-01-23/Yonatin/9a434b
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
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Baja_Costero
Jan 22, 2019 10:12 PM CST

Moderator

Looks like a good setup. Try to sterilize the container and the soil before you sow the seeds. You can spray bleach bathroom cleaner on the plastic, then rinse well with clean water. I like to cook the soil. I typically get it wet (saturated) with purified water and then microwave on low power (15%) until the air in the room starts smelling earthy. Smiling Then let it cool slowly to room temp covered inside the microwave, and rewet to saturation with purified water before sowing seeds. The seeds are pretty small, so young seedlings take a while before they are independent, and in that time you don't want other things growing in that moist, protected environment.

Daytime temps in the 70s are probably good for germination. It can cool down at night as long as it doesn't actually get cold. You don't need to add bone meal or anything else if the soil you're using is reasonably good. At some point down the road, once they have sprouted and gotten big and strong enough to tolerate the lid being lifted, you might consider providing a steady trickle of nutrients. I guess it sort of depends on how much of a hurry you're in, but there's no need to decide that until months from now.

I cannot advise on artificial light as I rely exclusively on natural light for all my succulent seedlings.

Welcome!
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Jan 22, 2019 10:17 PM (+)]
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Name: Daisy I
Reno, Nv (Zone 6b)
Not all who wander are lost
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DaisyI
Jan 23, 2019 12:15 AM CST
Welcome!

Along with Baja's suggestions, I would put some holes in the bottom container for drainage and a couple holes in the top for air. I usually germinate my cactus seeds in a north facing window on a seed germinating mat (reptile mat).

The seeds are so tiny, I don't think I would bury them but I don't make my soil flat but rather leave it fluffy so the seeds fall into the cracks. Smiling

Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming...."WOW What a Ride!!" -Mark Frost

Webmaster: osnnv.org
[Last edited by DaisyI - Jan 28, 2019 12:44 AM (+)]
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(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 9:53 AM CST
I will sterilize the dirt doing that, I read about doing that and didn't know it was that easy. I left a thermometer in the room they will be growing in and the low was 58°, is that too low at night? I am thinking about getting one of those warming mats that Daisyl mentioned to help keep the seeds from getting too cold at night. I do have a South facing window or an East facing window I can put them in that would only get to 63° at night, would that be a better option? I am really looking forward to growing these and don't want to mess them up. As for the holes, is that something I need to do at the start or later down the road when it's time to ween them off of the covered environment? I ordered around 200 seeds and will probably start 20 or so just in case it doesn't go well. I will be updating this thread regularly and post progress pics along the way. Thanks again guys for the help, it is much appreciated.
[Last edited by Yonatin - Jan 23, 2019 9:55 AM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
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Baja_Costero
Jan 23, 2019 10:35 AM CST

Moderator

I would pop a few holes in the bottom as Daisy suggested but not make any holes in the top. They are not necessary and they will only invite the entry of organisms. To block off the bottom holes when you don't need them (which will be almost all the time, except at the very beginning and then much later when you start watering), place the whole clamshell thing on a clean (ideally sterilized) platter. I like to reuse old plastic lids for that purpose. The bottom holes will be necessary at the very beginning when you water the soil to saturation before sowing the seeds. You want saturated soil at that point but not a lake underneath it, and that's where the holes are useful.

The nighttime temps you are describing are fine.

A south facing window should provide the most light and would be the best alternative.

I look forward to seeing progress reports as you advance in the process.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Jan 23, 2019 10:39 AM (+)]
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(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 2:10 PM CST
I just got done cooking the soil and am waiting for it to cool. The soil looks pretty saturated right now without adding more water.I poked about 5 or so holes in the bottom with a soldering iron, so I wouldn't crack the plastic. I took a lid from the clam shells and cut it off and turned it upside down and placed the container in it to catch the water. When I re-saturate it am I only looking for a slight trickle to come out? I also took rubbing alcohol and wiped down the water catcher before placing the container in it. So now all I have to do is wait for the dirt to cool and sow the seeds right?

Here is what I'm working with right now. Just a couple of pics to show progress.
The fog on the bottom is where the holes are.

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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
Image
Baja_Costero
Jan 23, 2019 2:58 PM CST

Moderator

Ideally water until there's plenty coming out the bottom, that's how you know it's saturated. Let all the water exit the bottom, giving it plenty of time to come out, then put the tray underneath and you're ready to go.
(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 8:02 PM CST
Ok, the seeds are sown and the heating mat is ordered, now for the fun part, which is waiting haha. I watered the dirt until plenty of water came out and gave it a long time to drain. I did 17 seeds in one container and 15 in another.
Thumb of 2019-01-24/Yonatin/2e57e5


This is on a unrelated note, but Baja is that a Aloe Plicatilis in your profile pic?
Name: Daisy I
Reno, Nv (Zone 6b)
Not all who wander are lost
Garden Sages Plant Identifier
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DaisyI
Jan 23, 2019 8:09 PM CST
The heat mat will heat about 10 degrees above the ambient temperature. If it gets too warm in the daytime, you may want to turn it off.

PS: where did you find seeds?
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming...."WOW What a Ride!!" -Mark Frost

Webmaster: osnnv.org
(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 8:19 PM CST
Ok, I will keep an eye on the temps during the day, I might lift the light higher once I get the mat to help keep the temps down.

I can message you the link to the website I used, they came from a nursery in Germany. They were really easy to work with and very nice.
Name: Daisy I
Reno, Nv (Zone 6b)
Not all who wander are lost
Garden Sages Plant Identifier
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DaisyI
Jan 23, 2019 8:23 PM CST
Thank you.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming...."WOW What a Ride!!" -Mark Frost

Webmaster: osnnv.org
[Last edited by DaisyI - Jan 28, 2019 12:45 AM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
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Baja_Costero
Jan 23, 2019 8:30 PM CST

Moderator

Yonatin said:Baja is that a Aloe Plicatilis in your profile pic?


Yup. Smiling
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers Greenhouse
Ponds Keeper of Koi Forum moderator Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Adeniums Spiders!
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Ursula
Jan 23, 2019 8:52 PM CST
Is the source a secret? Reading this it took me about 5 seconds to find it. Would you like me to post it openly?
....I lived about a mile away from the nurseries.....
[Last edited by Ursula - Jan 23, 2019 8:55 PM (+)]
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(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 8:55 PM CST
No it's not a secret, I just didn't know if I was allowed to post the link in public. Also since I'm new I can't post links haha.


Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers Greenhouse
Ponds Keeper of Koi Forum moderator Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Adeniums Spiders!
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Ursula
Jan 23, 2019 8:56 PM CST
Oh I see.
This one?
http://www.kakteen-haage.de/in...

Kakeen Haage is a well known Nursery in Erfurt/Germany.
Walter Haage was one of the early Epiphyllum hybridizers. Some years ago at a visit to my home town, I looked them up, it is a great place to drool over Cacti!
[Last edited by Ursula - Jan 23, 2019 9:01 PM (+)]
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(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 8:57 PM CST
Baja_Costero said:

Yup. Smiling


Did you buy it locally or did you have to order it online? I am about to buy one and would like to know where you got yours if you got it online.
(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 8:58 PM CST


Actually it's this one. www .uhlig-kakteen.de/en/lophophora-williamsii-seed-on-request.html
I thought the one you posted was it but when I clicked it it didn't look the same so I just posted the one I had bookmarked.

Sorry for all of the confusion editing this post 4 different times, I didn't want to make a bunch of posts to correct myself.

just take the space away after www.
[Last edited by Yonatin - Jan 23, 2019 9:03 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1894371 (17)
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
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Baja_Costero
Jan 23, 2019 9:03 PM CST

Moderator

Yonatin said:Did you buy it locally or did you have to order it online? I


Got it locally. It should be reasonably easy from seed if you can't find a plant where you are.
(Zone 7a)
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Yonatin
Jan 23, 2019 9:05 PM CST
Baja_Costero said:

Got it locally. It should be reasonably easy from seed if you can't find a plant where you are.


Ok, I will look into the seeds, the only succulent nursery we have here is not the greatest, they over charged for everything and don't have a clue as to what they are talking about. Thanks.
Name: Daisy I
Reno, Nv (Zone 6b)
Not all who wander are lost
Garden Sages Plant Identifier
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DaisyI
Jan 23, 2019 9:07 PM CST
I decided not to order.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming...."WOW What a Ride!!" -Mark Frost

Webmaster: osnnv.org
[Last edited by DaisyI - Jan 28, 2019 12:46 AM (+)]
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