Ask a Question forum: Candy Lily = Iris????/Daffodil = Amaryllidaceae???? Need Help!

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Name: Ian McBeth
Lincoln NE (Zone 5b)
Horticulture, Photography, & Art
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Amaryllis Irises Daylilies Lilies
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SonoveShakespeare
Mar 31, 2019 8:18 AM CST
I was on the internet the other day, and I came across a plant that's been growing at my house for several years. It surprised me that the plant I've been growing was actually something completely different. Therefore mistaking the plant, entirely. I also own daffodils and surprise lilies and are both related to the "Amaryllidaceae" family. I also heard Peruvian Daffodils ( look like a combination of a daffodil and a Surprise Lily) which are also related to the "Amaryllidaceae" family. So here it is, spring, and my list of what to breed is still not complete.

Here are some questions I have that go along with my discovery:
1. Are candy lilies, tall bearded (TB) irises and siberian irises all the same species?
2. Is it possible to breed a candy lily with a TB or siberian iris?
3.Can the pollen from a TB or siberian iris be saved for later blooming irises? (such as Candy Lilies)
4. What other irises can I breed with TB or siberian irises.
5. Do all irises have the same species?

Here are some daffodil and surprise lily Questions:
1. Can a daffodil be breed with a surprise lily
2. Can pollen from a daffodil be saved for a surprise lily or vice versa?
3. How should the seeds of be germinated or grown?


Your answers and suggestions will be helpful for me, with my disovery, and along for future breeding
- Ian

PS: To help you out, I included a couple pictures of the candy lily that I own.

Thumb of 2019-03-31/SonoveShakespeare/df7a04


Thumb of 2019-03-31/SonoveShakespeare/e22020

Not only people give others signs, but plants do too.
[Last edited by SonoveShakespeare - Mar 31, 2019 8:19 AM (+)]
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Name: Sally
central Maryland
Seriously addicted to kettle chips.
Charter ATP Member Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: Mid-Atlantic Composter Region: Maryland Birds
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sallyg
Mar 31, 2019 9:57 PM CST
An understanding of the levels of plant families, subfamilies, genera, and species will help you get started. Species is the narrrowest, most specific categorization, and those iris are in different species. Same species fertilize each other and make 'cultivars' hence all the different colors of traditional bearded iris (species germanica, genus Iris) but siberians are species siberica. Whether you can cross anything in different species, I am not sure. Someone else may know. I am pretty sure different genus will not cross, or not easily at home anyway.

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Name: Joshua
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (Zone 10b)
Köppen Climate Zone Cfb
Region: Australia Bookworm Cat Lover Lilies Orchids Irises
Seed Starter Annuals Container Gardener Garden Photography Forum moderator Avid Green Pages Reviewer
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Australis
Mar 31, 2019 10:30 PM CST

Moderator

Ian, welcome to the world of taxonomy.

As Sally has suggested, reading up on the different classification levels will help. The most common ones you will deal with are family, genus and species.

For example, Dietes (common name: Wild Iris) and Iris are two genera (the plural of genus) within the Iridaceae family.

Often you will find common names have little to do with the genus or even family. "Lily" in particular has been applied to an absurd number of plants (most of which aren't even in the Liliaceae family or the Lilium genus).

Hybridising is easiest when working within a genus. Even then there will be species that are too far apart genetically to hybridise without modern techniques.

Intergeneric (or hybrids involving parents from different genera) is most common in the Orchidaceae family (i.e. Orchids). Outside of these, they do exist, but are few are far between and often require intervention (i.e. embryo rescue, etc.) to germinate and survive. Amarines (Amaryllis X Nerine) is one of the newer intergeneric hybrids I'm aware of.
Plant Authorities: Catalogue of Life (Species) --- International Cultivar Registration Authorities (Cultivars) --- RHS Orchid Register --- RHS Lilium Register
My Notes: Orchid Genera HTML PDF Excel --- Lilium Traits HTML PDF --- Lilium Species Crosses HTML PDF Excel --- Lilium Species Diagram
The current profile image is that of Iris 'Volcanic Glow'.
Name: Joshua
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (Zone 10b)
Köppen Climate Zone Cfb
Region: Australia Bookworm Cat Lover Lilies Orchids Irises
Seed Starter Annuals Container Gardener Garden Photography Forum moderator Avid Green Pages Reviewer
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Australis
Mar 31, 2019 10:39 PM CST

Moderator

To address your specific questions:

1. Are candy lilies, tall bearded (TB) irises and siberian irises all the same species?
No. TB irises are a category of bearded iris hybrids. My understanding is that Siberian Irises are a different group, descended from Iris siberica as Sally mentioned.

2. Is it possible to breed a candy lily with a TB or siberian iris?

3.Can the pollen from a TB or siberian iris be saved for later blooming irises? (such as Candy Lilies)
Yes. Iris pollen can be collected and stored in the fridge for use on later-blooming irises.

Pollen from many plants can often be saved for later use, but storage methods depend on the type of plant. In the case of Liliums, pollen must be harvested and allowed to air-dry for several days before storage in a freezer (after which it can remain viable for years). I have never tried this with Lycoris or Narcissus, but it may work.

4. What other irises can I breed with TB or siberian irises.
Most of the bearded Irises will have some degree of compatibility with each other. You won't know until you try - some crosses will work, others will not (you will also find that Parent A X Parent B works, whilst Parent B X Parent A does not!)

5. Do all irises have the same species?
No. There are quite a few species and thousands of man-made hybrids. Many of these are quite complex, involving the genetics from a number of different species.

Here are some daffodil and surprise lily Questions:
1. Can a daffodil be breed with a surprise lily

This would be crossing the Narcissus genus with the Lycoris genus. I don't know if this has been done, but suspect it would require special techniques to make it work (if they are even compatible).

2. Can pollen from a daffodil be saved for a surprise lily or vice versa?
See above post and answer.

3. How should the seeds of be germinated or grown?
Depends on the genus. Narcissus seeds can be planted straight out (at least in my climate) and will germinate.


Your Surprise Lilies are in the Lycoris genus. They are in the same family (Amaryllidaceae - the Amaryllids) as Nerine, Narcissus (Daffodils and Jonquils), Agapanthus, Amaryllis and Hippeastrums (to name a few).

Nerines X Lycoris may be possible, given they are quite similar. Note that Surprise Lily (Lycoris squamigera) seems to be a sterile triploid, by the way.

Daffodils and Jonquils will probably hybridise, but you will probably find it depends on the cultivar selected.


Plant Authorities: Catalogue of Life (Species) --- International Cultivar Registration Authorities (Cultivars) --- RHS Orchid Register --- RHS Lilium Register
My Notes: Orchid Genera HTML PDF Excel --- Lilium Traits HTML PDF --- Lilium Species Crosses HTML PDF Excel --- Lilium Species Diagram
The current profile image is that of Iris 'Volcanic Glow'.
[Last edited by Australis - Apr 1, 2019 5:41 PM (+)]
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