Roses forum: How long from patent to introduction for a new rose variety?

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Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Apr 5, 2019 6:50 PM CST
Kordes has a new white climber, 'Alaska' http://www.helpmefind.com/rose...

It has a US patent, as of April 25th, 2017. It isn't showing up on Kordes website, or Certified Roses (who I believe is a new distributor of Kordes in the US). Does anyone have any idea how long it is from when a rose is patented to when we can get our grubby gardener hands on it?
Coastal Southern California (Zone 13a)
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jerijen
Apr 6, 2019 10:38 AM CST
3 years? 4 years?

Here's the process, as it is done in the U.S. . . . A cross produces a seedling, which is unique.

They select it for test-growing ... budding it onto rootstock, to make perhaps a half-dozen plants. They might observe those plants for a couple of years.

They select it for further propagation, and use those test plants to make as many more as it feasible. Then, they bud from THOSE, to make a crop in the field.

The process may be different in Europe, but it's still going to take time to go from one unique seedling to a whole crop of that cultivar.

Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Apr 6, 2019 3:19 PM CST
Kordes is already selling this one in Europe and I think Australia (or NZ?) but I think you might be right with the 3-4 years. Patents can take 6 months to 2 years (I read that somewhere), so unless they got mother plants started just after the application was put it it will be 2020 before we're seeing this beauty. Drat!
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Apr 6, 2019 3:59 PM CST
Did some more reading and it looks like the patent was applied for in Sept 2015. This rose was (according to HMF) bred in 2005, introduced in Germany in 2014 (why the wait?) and then in Australia in 2018.

I can see trialing possible introductions, but 9 years?! I guess now we know why Kordes roses have the rep they do. They wouldn't do the same sort of trialing in the States now that the patent clock is ticking, right? I guess I'll go ahead and put 'Florentina' and 'White Cap' together, and just invest in a good pair of gloves/gauntlets. Maybe talk to SCA and find an armorer Rolling on the floor laughing
Name: seil
St Clair Shores, MI (Zone 6a)
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seilMI
Apr 6, 2019 5:39 PM CST
They have to find a distributor here that wants to carry it and will make a deal for it. Also if they are sending plant material into the USA it has to be quarantined for a few years before they can start using it to propagate a new crop for sale here.

Roses do not need to be patented to be propagated and sold. A lot of roses are already on the market with a patent pending or no patent at all. The patent is up to the breeder to get. If they don't patent it anyone can propagate it.
Name: Mike Stewart
Lower Hudson Valley, NY (Zone 6b)
Seed Starter Container Gardener Roses Bulbs I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Peonies
Clematis Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Dog Lover Cat Lover Birds Region: New York
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Mike
Apr 6, 2019 6:07 PM CST
For what it's worth, the typical duration from the original hybridization to market entry is about nine years. It takes this long to propagate, test, test some more, test even more, then grow enough product to meet anticipated market demand, then enter the cultivar into catalogues, and launch new sales.
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Apr 6, 2019 8:51 PM CST
That's a good point about quarantine, @seilMI I hadn't even thought of that. Makes me wonder who takes care of the plants while they're in quarantine - does the USDA have a facility or does the grower have to have one? I doubt they'd wait for the patent to be approved before they started the import process (they'd lose 4-5 years off the patent's time!)

Looking at 'Madame Anisette', HMF has comments saying it was available in 2015, the patent applied for in 14, patent granted in 16. That doesn't look good for 'Alaska'.

Looking on the other forum, it seems that Star Roses is actually the distributor of Kordes. Their website does list a few new roses like 'Cherry Frost' and 'Stilletto', and at least one Kordes (coming in 2020, huh?) - a 'White Veranda'. Star's offerings are heavy on Meilland (some coming 2020, but already up) and out of patent roses. Glare It doesn't look like they've touched the Kordes website they set up since 2017.

I'm going to want to punch someone at Star Roses, aren't I? Thumbs down

EDIT: @Mike posted while I was typing - surely they don't test for another 9 years when they introduce a rose into a new country? It went from Germany in 2014 to Australia in 2018, so there's a good chance it's at least 4 years. Well, maybe there's hope we'll see it in 2021.

Still going to look for armor in the meantime.
[Last edited by ac91z6 - Apr 6, 2019 9:00 PM (+)]
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Name: seil
St Clair Shores, MI (Zone 6a)
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seilMI
Apr 7, 2019 5:11 PM CST
The importer has to have the quarantine facilities. I believe it is a three year process where the plants are inspected on a regular basis for insects and diseases. Once they get their phytosanitary certification they can be used to propagate new roses. I just posted about the Kordes OH Happy Day I got today. HMF lists it as being bred in 1999 but it was introduced in Germany by Kordes in 2015 and just released here last year by Star Roses.
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Apr 21, 2019 1:20 PM CST
SeilMI, I don't know how I missed your comment! Which is good because 3 years for patent, another 3 for quarantine, then 2-3 for growing commercial crops - we'd never see roses from outside the States! But based on that info about Oh Happy Day I'd guess the quarantine/phytosanitary process has started. Unless something got disrupted in the changeover from Newflora to Star... oh, I hope not!

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