Irises forum→Sowing, slightly immature, Iris seeds ?

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Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
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ShawnSteve
Jun 29, 2019 7:52 PM CST
I just finished reading, some book, about Iris & it was published by Cambridge Press & it actually mentioned, someone having sown slightly immature ( not quite completely ripened) Iris seeds & reportedly had germination, within a month !

I almost couldn't believe it. In other words, if you don't harvest your Iris seeds, before you let those seeds become completely ripe, & dry them them out, before sowing them, you just may actually be causing them to take,, much longer to germinate, than one may possibly imagine. I don't have any "green "bee pods" though I'm fairly certain a neighbor or two wouldn't care, if I asked for some seeds to try & just see if it works & if it is actually true. It sure would be well worth a try, rather than the old way, taking so long...
p.s.After just having checked the fridge & finding alpine seeds germinating in a baggy, (after only just several weeks.)
Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
Image
ShawnSteve
Jun 29, 2019 8:38 PM CST
Apparently, it isn't anything new ! Leaching seeds, by decontaminating first, in a Calcium hypochlorite solution for 15 minutes ( & buffered to a PH . of 7 ) & then sowing, without even any chilling, resulted in germination, of Iris seeds, to start, in a matter of 78 days.

There must be an even older article, even about aril-bred Iris, by C.G White & "noted", observed or written about by (Wilson ,1915) as that was another JStor article I began to read about, in "Leaching of Iris seeds", using a garden hybrid Iris ( parentage x , was noted, in book, online, although I didn't bother to write them down...)
Name: Robin
Melbourne, Australia (Zone 10b)
Region: Australia Irises Garden Photography Cat Lover Seed Starter
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Totally_Amazing
Jun 30, 2019 6:02 PM CST
I've always allowed my seeds to ripen and dry before sowing. I don't know if I am brave enough to try your first method in case I kill my seeds. I would have to try it on seeds for a cross I don't care about.
Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
Image
ShawnSteve
Jun 30, 2019 7:01 PM CST
Robin, apparently, it isn't unusual as a method, even with seeds grown by a member, for Zinnia seeds too. Though, in that case, it is an attempt to get two complete cycles of plants grown , in the same year, although an easily germinated one.
I read in the literature on the specific topic & apparently it was done, over 100 years ago ! With Iris seeds, that were aril-bred & then attempted with garden variety Iris, later.

I even saw it mentioned in a garden Forum, mentioning Korean Iris, using "unripe" seeds, about ten years ago, by harvesting & sowing, before the pod turns brown, just as the seeds almost mature, but before, they do.
It was a very "early spring" here & so hot already, most are likely already brown, if any are around, at all, as they bloomed so early, before any bees could even get busy, here.

Three months, or less,seems a rather short period of time, compared to the old method, of drying & soaking seeds, then stratifying & waiting for germination in spring. Perhaps a survival mechanism, if kept mist enough & cool.

But actually, doesn't seem so unusual, to me, as I've had some difficult species & had rapid germination, as they sprouted, prior to my even having had a chance to collect them . Found at the base of the plant, under the leaves & noticed they'd had to have, almost immediately germinated, without my help !
Sure, try it & see, if it does work, with some, that aren't of much value to you & find out.how quickly , the results are, that you have with them,.
Name: Robin
Melbourne, Australia (Zone 10b)
Region: Australia Irises Garden Photography Cat Lover Seed Starter
Image
Totally_Amazing
Jul 1, 2019 1:23 AM CST
Bloom season peaks in October here. I might try this.
Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
Image
ShawnSteve
Jul 1, 2019 6:20 AM CST
Hi Robin. Then I suppose you'll be probably be among the first to find out, how quickly it can be done. . I noticed the the cleaning agent, for the seeds, was actually Potassium hypochlorite, by the chemical formula , which was given, as the "cleaning" agent, used. They named it as Calcium instead, but according to letter, as used in the Element Chart, as K, which is Potassium, ( & not Calcium, which, is Ca... )

I suppose to help prevent mold, or fungus, ( from any growth,) on the seeds., before adding, "buffering agent", (to a ph 7- neutral) & rinsing, (likely with distilled water) then sowing.
Regular "household bleach", is sodium hypochlorite, although I forget off hand, the mol, measurement stated, in amount, used, if you know anything about Chemistry & bleach has to be rinsed off thoroughly & is really rather quite potent, unless diluted first, by adding to water. ( Never, to be done, by adding water to bleach !) Because it was only the 'Abstract" of the entire article published & didn't sign up for trial use of JStor, didn't finish the entire article...
Although, it explained results were achieved, with germination of ordinary garden variety crossing of bearded Iris seeds, starting in 78 days, after sowing.. Instead of 'harvesting fully ripe seeds" drying & soaking & then waiting for germination , until spring of the Next Year !

Then, I went on to read an old Forum post, about harvesting slightly "unripe "seeds & having no problem, with quickly germinating Iris ( koreana?) seeds, & doing so, because of the faster germination, by sowing while still barely ripe, immediately. Not, after the seeds, have already started to turn brown, either. As that just may be ,a little too late !
Name: Evelyn
Sierra foothills, Northern CA (Zone 8a)
Garden Procrastinator Irises Bee Lover Butterflies Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: California
Cat Lover Deer Bulbs Foliage Fan Annuals Seed Starter
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evelyninthegarden
Jul 1, 2019 12:50 PM CST
Shawn ~ Since I have some "bee pods" this year, it would be an excellent time to try this method of sowing immature seeds. I really had no plans for crossing this year, so if this speeds up the time, it will be a good time to try that method.
"Luck favors the prepared mind." - Thomas Jefferson
Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
Image
ShawnSteve
Jul 1, 2019 1:53 PM CST
Yes , Evelyn. I think, the seeds have to be just nearly mature, but before they'd turn brown, after exposure to air & drying. I think it's when the pod is almost ready to "change" from green, turning to yellow, before it is ever brown.. Breaking open the pod & then removing carefully , then gently air dry, indoors while cool, just enough so the "attached area can just barely get a chance to harden off" & sowing as soon as possible in AC, if needed.. It could be done, in a baggy, with seed starting mix, & plenty of sand & perlite, too. I think, once a seed has completely ripened, & dried in the pod , in sun & heat & then harvested & then "dried" once again..
The natural inhibitors to germinating, become concentrated & are activated & then require time, stratification & & how much time, spent in water ? ? All due to Absicic (sp.?) acid ?

If prevented, by harvesting just a little more sooner, it just may actually be a seed survival technique, not quite fully understood & what had been experimented with, was done so long ago.. In the meantime, we all went back to drying, storing & sowing seeds in autumn or at latest, in spring. But, if done, as soon as possible, may actually decrease germination time, in order to get growing, before winter ever sets in. As in, the start of autumn, so it has some time, to grow, before winter ever sets in !
[Last edited by ShawnSteve - Jul 1, 2019 1:55 PM (+)]
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Name: Evelyn
Sierra foothills, Northern CA (Zone 8a)
Garden Procrastinator Irises Bee Lover Butterflies Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: California
Cat Lover Deer Bulbs Foliage Fan Annuals Seed Starter
Image
evelyninthegarden
Jul 1, 2019 2:15 PM CST
We'll see...
"Luck favors the prepared mind." - Thomas Jefferson
Name: Shawn S.
Hampton, Virginia (Zone 8b)
Butterflies Morning Glories Annuals Irises Dahlias Zinnias
Orchids Region: United States of America Peonies
Image
ShawnSteve
Jul 1, 2019 3:40 PM CST
If any growers & producers of Iris, knows anything about it, do you think they'd "give away" their secrets to germinating them more quickly?
Why do you think, they like to often use an alpha numeric type system, in breeding programs... Think about it, for just a moment..

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