Daylilies forum: Encouraging Increase in Daylilies

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Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Natalie
Aug 29, 2012 3:37 PM CST
I read somewhere that there is something to can do to encourage increase in daylily fans. It wasn't exactly a fertilizer, but it was something that you put on the plant. I wish I could remember where it was that I read that! Anyone know what it could be?

Thanks!
Natalie
Name: pam
gainesville fl (Zone 8b)
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gardenglory
Aug 29, 2012 3:48 PM CST
I use milorganite for that purpose. Nitrogen really greens them up too after the summer rains. Someone else probably has a better idea, but thats as good as is gets for me.
Name: Adonya Smith
Riceville, TN (Zone 7a)
dixiedumplin
Aug 29, 2012 3:51 PM CST
Natalie, would you be thinking of "Bap"?
dixiedumplin
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Natalie
Aug 29, 2012 4:50 PM CST
gardenglory, it's not greening them up that I want to do. It's trying to get better increase in the number of fans.

dixiedumplin, I have no idea if that's it, but I know I've seen the name Bap before. Is that what it's used for?
Natalie
Name: shirlee
southeast (Zone 6b)
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mistyfog
Aug 29, 2012 5:12 PM CST
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think BAP is used to make the
scapes produce more proliferations.
Name: James
South Bend, IN (Zone 5b)
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JWWC
Aug 29, 2012 5:46 PM CST
You can use BAP for both purposes. If you apply it to the bract in the scape, you can force proliferations to form on the scape. Additionally, if you treat the foliage near the crown you can break apical dominance and increase fans. There are also people who use a lanolin paste containing BAP and apply it to the crown directly when transplanting to accomplish the same thing.
Name: Char
Vermont (Zone 4b)
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Char
Aug 29, 2012 5:57 PM CST

Moderator

I wonder if you are thinking of alfalfa pellets? Alfalfa contains a natural growth hormone, Triacontanol, which acts as a growth promoter. Alfalfa can be used as a natural, organic fertilizer when it does not contain other additives. There are pellets made for horses that are pure alfalfa.
Name: Doris&David Bishop
Cartersville, Ga. (Zone 7b)
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Casshigh
Aug 29, 2012 6:04 PM CST
Not all daylilies respond to BAP. We were told to apply only after the daylily is scaping or has scaped. We do know that some daylilies will abort their buds when BAP is applied. I suppose the energy goes into fan production, and this may cause the buds to fall off in some daylilies. We have only used it by spraying the solution to fans just above the crown. We have not used BAP this summer and very little last summer. We waited until the daylilies we were interested in increasing were down to their last few buds. A good watering and fertilization program goes a long way toward increasing fans, too. BAP is expensive but can be stored (NOT refrigerated) in its tightly sealed container to increase its shelf life.
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Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
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tink3472
Aug 29, 2012 6:45 PM CST
Doris or Dave: I was told to keep BAP in the fridge, why do you say NOT refridgerated? Do you know something I don't Green Grin!

Doris/Dave is right, not all daylilies will respond to BAP and there are the ones that you think didn't respond, but the following season they explode with fans. I use the liquid on the bracts also instead of using the paste and it works fine for me. I didn't have any buds drop or pods abort on the ones I sprayed. I guess as long as you don't spray the buds they will be fine. I have heard others say they've never had bud drop either so I guess it just depends on the daylily, the strength used, how oftern sprayed (since that seems to vary by who you speak to) and where it was sprayed because some people spray the whole plant (all the foliage) not just the bracts or near crowns.

Fertilizer and water are GREAT at getting daylilies to increase and ALFALFA PELLETS is my most used product on my daylilies. I probably overuse it, but the worms love it, the daylilies love it and the worm castings left behind by the worms eating it, and I've seen no ill effects using the amounts I do. Some people say it gets really hot when breaking down and can burn the roots but I haven't found this to be a problem ( I do mix it in the soil ). The milorganite I have used gets a whole lot hotter then the alfalfa pellets seem to.
I mixed in some alfalfa and milorganite in with a few daylilies I potted up and then I had to dump the pots because someone wanted them extra early and you could feel the heat coming off of the milorganite but then I took some of the alfalfa into my hands and no heat. I have decided to wait until it cools down more before I add the milorganite to the pots.

Natalie, you are in UT so how long is your season? And if used on the daylilies after blooming is done would they have enough time to get ready for winter (how cold do you get?) since they will be increasing?

One more thing you may want to consider using, FISH or SEAWEED FERTILIZER. They are great and I have used the fish/seaweed blend from Neptunes. They have natural growth hormones in them as well. There are other brands but some use heating in the process which kills a lot of the good stuff and Neptunes uses a cold process. Seaweed/Kelp is what is used in a lot of the products that the giant pumpkin growers use to get those humongous pumpkins that win those world records.
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Name: James
South Bend, IN (Zone 5b)
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JWWC
Aug 29, 2012 7:32 PM CST
My understanding is that the powdered form of BAP can be stored at room temp but the liquid should be kept refrigerated.
Name: Doris&David Bishop
Cartersville, Ga. (Zone 7b)
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Casshigh
Aug 29, 2012 7:41 PM CST
Michele, the person we bought BAP from about 5 years ago told us to not refrigerate it, and we never have. Obviously, refrigeration must not affect it if the BAP is working for you. Most daylilies that we have treated with BAP did not drop their buds but a few did. I think it depends on the daylily and when it is treated. The strength could also affect that, too. We never sprayed the buds, only the fans just above the crown so the liquid could run down to the crown.

How much alfalfa pellets do you put in a hole in the ground when you plant a new daylily? I have been using a cup (8 oz.) when planting and then the same amount around the plant each spring. I have wondered about using more when planting but don't want to overdo it and be sorry.

Edited to say that we used the liquid that we diluted with water. We were also told that we should use any that we had diluted with water within 24 hours. We used a 32 oz. spray bottle filled (water & BAP) to the 27-28 oz. line.

Doris
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[Last edited by Casshigh - Aug 29, 2012 7:47 PM (+)]
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Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
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tink3472
Aug 29, 2012 8:20 PM CST
Doris I put a good handful or two in the hole and mix in with the soil. Then I backfill the hole halfway and then add more alfalfa, I just pick up a handful and spread around. Once I fill in the hole I top dress with even more alfalfa, again a handful or so spread around. Also, there is alfalfa tilled into the bed before planting.
Let's say this is done in Sept or Oct, then I will top dress again in Jan or Feb and then again in Apr or May. Since the foliage is pretty grown up and it would take too long trying to get it around each daylily (the way I have them) I just pour it in a line in between the daylily rows; the roots are spread out so it doesn't have to be right around the daylily anyway. So basically I do it every 4 months.

I think I got the BAP from the same person as you and he didn't say not to put it in the fridge and others that I know use it keep it in the fridge so I just put mine in the fridge, when I order some more I will ask him about this.
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[Last edited by tink3472 - Aug 29, 2012 8:39 PM (+)]
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Name: Doris&David Bishop
Cartersville, Ga. (Zone 7b)
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Casshigh
Aug 30, 2012 5:52 AM CST
Thanks for this information. I believe I will use more alfalfa pellets than I have been. I will be planting today and have a good number coming in September.
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Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Natalie
Aug 30, 2012 9:04 AM CST
Wow! Thanks everyone for all the great information!

Apparently it was Bap that I was thinking of. I knew it was familiar when I saw it, but couldn't remember why it was familiar. I'm thinking that maybe I'll skip the Bap for now, and try the Neptune's fertilizer, or something similar, since I've already ordered some for next year for my veggie garden. I usually don't fertilize my daylilies, but I did this year because of the conditions. I can't tell that it helped, but maybe I didn't do it often enough. I really want to see if I can get Wild Horses to increase. It's the only one I have that has never increased, and I'd love to have much more of it. So, I want to try something - anything - that may help! If the kelp doesn't work, I'll try Bap.

I don't care how it increases, and if it's by prolifs, that would be fine, but I think I'd prefer better fan production, since I don't have to worry about those as much. I didn't know about using alfalfa pellets when planting, either, so that was fantastic information!
Natalie
Name: Sandi
Franklin, WI (Zone 5a)
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Seedsower
Aug 30, 2012 1:10 PM CST
I have an article someone wrote about alfalfa that you can acquire 3 yrs of growth in one year using alfalfa tea if I remember correctly.
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Natalie
Aug 30, 2012 1:14 PM CST
Sandy, that sure would be perfect for me, if it actually works! I would expect kelp tea and alfalfa tea to work about the same, but who knows. Maybe I'll do a test. I've got to go to the feed store tomorrow, so I'll check on pellets.
Natalie
Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
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tink3472
Aug 30, 2012 1:28 PM CST
Yep, I read the same article. I don't do the tea though, too much trouble. I tried making a tea last year in a 55 gallon feed storage barrel with the alfalfa and the chicken litter and it was more of a hassle than if was worth to me anyway. I just assume put the alfalfa down for the worms to eat. In small batches it may be ok and on small amounts of daylilies, but trying to pour it on all these daylilies would be a pain.

Someone I know swears by the tea and they use it once a week on all their daylilies. I actually see no growth difference between mine and theirs and I do less work.
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[Last edited by tink3472 - Aug 30, 2012 4:22 PM (+)]
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Name: Ann
TN
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farmerbell
Aug 30, 2012 1:45 PM CST
I use the ground alfalfa, not pellets. Does it have the same effect?
Ann (farmerbell); TN
Name: Natalie
North Central Idaho (Zone 7a)
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Natalie
Aug 30, 2012 1:46 PM CST
Thanks Michele. I forgot that you had mentioned the worms eating the alfalfa, which is a plus. My flower beds are full of worms, and I can't figure out why they don't starve to death in some spots! I think I'm going to put the alfalfa in the ground, instead of making tea with it. I'm a flip-flopper today! I'm all for anything that is less work!

It's crazy how one thing works for one person, and it doesn't work for another! My neighbor uses tea all the time, made out of who-knows-what, so I'll ask her about it. I've given her daylilies, and I know she has used it on them. I haven't noticed anything spectacular at her house, so maybe what she is using isn't really doing what she thinks it is doing. nodding I'm more curious about increase though, so I'll have to check to see how many fans she has now.
Natalie
Name: Mary
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fiwit
Aug 30, 2012 2:56 PM CST
Sounds like I need to increase my alfalfa pellet usage Thumbs up
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