Cactus and Succulents forum: Could I propagate this succulent?

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LeftLion10
Jun 29, 2020 4:15 AM CST
Hey guys,

Would I be able to propagate this type of succulent and if so what would be the best method? Basically I've acknowledged the fact that I overwatered it and the rot is getting excessively worse so I wanted to try and 'save' part of the plant by propagating it from the healthy leaves.


Thumb of 2020-06-29/LeftLion10/6ba724

Name: Stefan
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skopjecollection
Jun 29, 2020 5:37 AM CST
No. E.agavoides one of those that you just cant, or its too difficult. The plant's leaves are brittle, and dont break off as easily(which is a must have for a successful prop_. You could try to wait for pups but that may take forever...
[Last edited by skopjecollection - Jun 29, 2020 10:19 AM (+)]
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Name: Steve
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ketsui73
Jun 29, 2020 6:16 AM CST
@LeftLion10
LeftLion10 said:Hey guys,

Would I be able to propagate this type of succulent and if so what would be the best method? Basically I've acknowledged the fact that I overwatered it and the rot is getting excessively worse so I wanted to try and 'save' part of the plant by propagating it from the healthy leaves.


Thumb of 2020-06-29/LeftLion10/6ba724


Welcome!
Are you sure you have rot. Have you checked the base of the plant? If you do have rot then there is another option. Whilst you cannot propagate this type of plant easily from leaves , they do re-root themselves readily if you behead it. The top of the plant still looks OK to me. I would unpot the plant and check if you have rot in the roots or stem. If you have rot in the root but not stem you can cut out the dead roots and let it dry completely (a few days) before repotting(you will then need to address what part of your care lead to the rot in the first place)

If the stem is brown and mushy then you have rot. Time to get drastic, get a sharp knife or scissors and remove base leaves and cut up the stem until you get to a clean (green/ firm) section. When you get to this point you then need to sit the plant is a cool /dry place to allow the cut to heal (callous) over. This could be a few days to a week. You them repot the plant and wait a few days to a week again before watering . When you first water there is no need to go crazy . Your plant won't have significant roots to take in the moisture so you are trying really to encourage root growth. I have never failed to re-root these echeverias, it can seem drastic to a beginner but usually it will work . If rot is progressing you need to act quickly though as it can destroy the whole plant very fast

Check the plant and let us know . We can advise in more detail when we know for sure what we are dealing with Smiling
Steve
[Last edited by ketsui73 - Jun 29, 2020 6:39 AM (+)]
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Name: Baja
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Baja_Costero
Jun 29, 2020 10:14 AM CST

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It is possible to remove leaves for propagation, but you can't just tug at them because (as Stefan hinted) they have to be intact all the way to the base for it to work. The new rosette sprouts from the very base of the leaf. So you would have to get a knife and do some surgery (sterilizing the knife if and when it ever comes in contact with rot) to get to the point where the leaves can be removed. You would have to cut across the stem and break away the lower leaves from the rosette, using tweezers or other tools to rip the base away from the stem. That will expose the leaves slightly higher up all the way from the base to the tip, and they can then be removed intact if you do it with care.

In the end I would think Steve's recommendation would be a prudent middle road, with a higher chance of success than rooting leaves. Be very careful to sterilize the knife if it ever cuts through rot, or you will just be spreading that rot to the healthy green cut you're going for at the end.

As always when a succulents collapses or rots or experiences a dramatic decline, it's a good idea to look closely at your care, and see if you can change something to give it a better chance in the future. More light, or less water, or different soil, or a different container, usually.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Jun 29, 2020 10:17 AM (+)]
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Name: Eric
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Hallow
Jun 29, 2020 10:25 AM CST
LeftLion10 said:Hey guys,

Would I be able to propagate this type of succulent and if so what would be the best method? Basically I've acknowledged the fact that I overwatered it and the rot is getting excessively worse so I wanted to try and 'save' part of the plant by propagating it from the healthy leaves.


Thumb of 2020-06-29/LeftLion10/6ba724


At this point, go for it, break a leaf off as clean as you can and lay it on to of the soil. Don't bury the cutting let it do it on it's own. "Leafy succulents" can surprise you. Here are just a few I have laying around. There not the same plant but the idea is the same.

Thumb of 2020-06-29/Hallow/91218c

The trick is NOT to bury it. Lay it on top the soil and let the plant do the rest and have fun. What's 1 or 2 missing leaves.
When they look like the ones in the top pictures. Then it's a good time to plant them if they didn't themselves.
Thumb of 2020-06-29/Hallow/5843b0

[Last edited by Hallow - Jun 29, 2020 10:36 AM (+)]
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Name: Stefan
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skopjecollection
Jun 29, 2020 10:42 AM CST
Hallow said:
At this point, go for it, break a leaf off as clean as you can and lay it on to of the soil. Don't bury the cutting let it do it on it's own. "Leafy succulents" can surprise you. Here are just a few I have laying around. There not the same plant but the idea is the same.

Thumb of 2020-06-29/Hallow/91218c

The trick is NOT to bury it. Lay it on top the soil and let the plant do the rest and have fun. What's 1 or 2 missing leaves.


A waste of time and leaves? And hope? E. agavoides leaves are incredibly stiff, and wide, and also, much much more firmly attached to the stem? In theory the user may try to remove some with fancy knife work on the margins...but that would require a lot more effort and collateral damage....and also something like a scalpel......
Several crassullaaceae plants simply cannot be propagated by leaf
-flapjack plants
-airplane crassula and other fancy crassulas(spherical one and Buddha temple)
-what i assume you now call petrosedum
-"phedimus"
-sempervivums
-tylecodons
- cotyledon, at least orbiculata
-aeoniums
-orostachys
-posibly rosularia
So, its not like it works for every plant
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Jun 29, 2020 11:14 AM CST

Moderator

Stefan, I gave instructions which ought to be sufficient to achieve the goal for the plant in the picture. Have you tried to remove leaves from this plant that way?

Leaf propagation definitely doesn't work for every plant in that family, but among the ones you say cannot be propagated from leaves are the following which generally can be propagated from leaves:

Propeller Plant (Crassula perfoliata var. minor)
Aeoniums (Aeonium)
Name: Stefan
SE europe(balkans) (Zone 6b)
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skopjecollection
Jun 29, 2020 11:32 AM CST
Baja_Costero said:Stefan, I gave instructions which ought to be sufficient to achieve the goal for the plant in the picture. Have you tried to remove leaves from this plant that way?

Leaf propagation definitely doesn't work for every plant in that family, but among the ones you say cannot be propagated from leaves are the following which generally can be propagated from leaves:

Propeller Plant (Crassula perfoliata var. minor)
Aeoniums (Aeonium)

Have you tried and succeeded?
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Jun 29, 2020 11:33 AM CST

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Yes.
Name: Stefan
SE europe(balkans) (Zone 6b)
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skopjecollection
Jun 29, 2020 11:34 AM CST
Baja_Costero said:Yes.


Which one?\
Aeoniums might be a 1/100th luck chance, but 1/100 doesnt really count. As for the crassula, aside from copypaste text(which vaguely may refer to the whole genus), i couldnt find any source confirming that is is.
[Last edited by skopjecollection - Jun 29, 2020 11:38 AM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Jun 29, 2020 11:54 AM CST

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No, Aeoniums are not a 1 in 100 chance. Try a bunch of different ones before you announce this type of conclusion. The common ones tend to be easier. Aeonium arboreum and its hybrids are not hard. A. tabuliforme is easy once you get the leaf removed. Aeonium nobile is harder, Aeonium canariense tends to be moderately easy. Several species are difficult. That Crassula propagated itself without me doing anything except water the pot that a leaf fell into.

The best source for these things is experience, which I am happy to share, but I dislike that experience being questioned based on whatever internet source you've been consulting about leaf propagations. Put 10 "Zwartkop" leaves on top of soil in a pot and water it for a few months, then come back and tell me how many plants you have. Failure to succeed with any type of propagation does not necessarily mean that technique doesn't work in general, it just means it failed to work once.

And generalizing about failure is a risky maneuver. For example, Dudleyas cannot be propagated from leaves, and you'll read that in all sorts of places, but it turns out that plants in the former Hasseanthus genus can apparently be propagated from leaves. These plants are really rare in cultivation (esp. compared to regular Dudleyas, which are already moderately rare) so people don't try them much, but this is what an expert grower reported to me.

Second to experience, there are printed sources that I trust. There are 2 books which contain lots of useful detailed information about leaf propagations. One is called Succulents: Propagation (by Kapitany and Schulz) which also describes all sorts of other ways of propagating succulents. The other is called Aeonium In Habitat and Cultivation (by Schulz) which breaks down all the different Aeoniums that can be propagated from leaves, which ones are harder, and what approaches can be used to maximize success.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Jun 29, 2020 11:57 AM (+)]
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Name: Stefan
SE europe(balkans) (Zone 6b)
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skopjecollection
Jun 29, 2020 12:36 PM CST
Aeonium arboreum is definitely incorrect, tried dozens of times...
I could see the thick leaved haworthii and others being easier, but definitely not arboreum.
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Jun 29, 2020 12:44 PM CST

Moderator

Stefan, you are wrong. Please stop questioning my experience. Your failure to make something work does not mean the thing you tried is impossible, or that it would have a 1% probability of success in someone else's hands. It means you failed to make the technique work. Maybe you did something wrong. Maybe the particular plant you tried is harder than average. Whatever, I'm not interested in those details. I'm here to say it does and can work for at least some plants in the genus.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Jun 29, 2020 12:53 PM (+)]
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