Hi everyone.

I'm a really new gardener, and it seems I'm making all the mistakes early on (planting lettuces in the spring, overwatering, etc) -- lucky me :)

Anyways, I started from transplant, about 24 tomato plants back in May. What I DIDN'T know was that they love to be pruned, and that when you do, you give so much energy for your plant to produce. I also didn't know they needed support to grow vertically, and I added fencing later in the game to help them stand.

Right now, 3 months later, my plants are really big and sprawled everywhere. I've had to tie many of the branches with fish string, to my fencing. It's pretty messy, and quite honestly, a bit frustrating because they're unorganized and I don't know how to help them or what to do.

I think this all happened because I didn't prune them early on. I didn't know how.

Can I retroactively prune them and clean them up? And if so, how? I'm scared to cut something that might fruit as I've never done this before.

I would avoid clipping beautiful healthy plants.
Next year, you can select a group of plants as candidates for cutting on and a second group as a control...

If you are like me, you will easily see why cutting is a poor method of growing tomatoes.

Sometimes I put up the fencing late too.

In Chi town, you should be able to get good results just allowing them to sprawl.
Sadly, down here allowing them to sprawl works with cherry tomatoes, but not so well with the larger fruiting types.

Congratulations on the big healthy tomato plants! Gardening has a learning curve, so everyone makes mistakes at first.

There are really two schools of thought on the prune thing. Both methods can result in excellent crops, so it is a matter of preference. Personally, I never prune my tomatoes. Usually I just put a tomato cage around them and then let them crawl out from there.... I am lazy and figure the plants will produce exactly as they like. I just tie the big ones up enough that the tomatoes aren't sitting on the ground.

What are the two schools of thought on pruning?

I just wish I could do it over again....

and do it 'right' -- if there is such a thing.

Once I saw a friend -- in Oregon -- grow tomatoes in such a cool way that I'd never seen before -- Vertically!, with strings attached to a greenhouse frame, pulling them up as they grew. No fences, no cages, nothing -- just a slip knot that you'd adjust as they grew taller. And they pruned before the harvest, quite a bit.

It was so great to see and I'll never look at tomatoes again the same way cumbersome way. Anyways, that's the idealistic best way I've come across. I can't do that because I don't have a frame, but rather just a 16/24 bed.

Even if I shouldn't prune now, I really want to lift them up higher as this seems like it would give them a better opportunity to grow, no?

If you left a tomato plant to its own devices, it would sprawl all over the ground and be about 1 ft tall and 10 ft wide. But, because of space restraints and the tomato fruits sitting on the ground usually rot, we choose to grow tomatoes on some sort of support.

To prune or not to prune is all up to you. The sort of support is all up to you. I have never pruned but have tried all sorts of support and non-support. The more support (your friend's trellis) the more labor intensive. How much time do you want to spend covered in tomato green?

I personally prefer to grow my tomatoes as a sprawling vine. I lay out landscape fabric and give them free reign. Some I prune out of entertainment/ knowledge pursuit, but I mostly leave them be. Granted, I grow far fewer tomatoes with this method than I used to when I grew for market (~ 500 plants).
EDIT- meant to write...I grow far fewer tomato Plants with this method. Yield seems to be more determined by conditions, as opposed to pruning, e.t.c.

I don't prune my tomatoes in the garden, but have done the single string method outdoors in the past, using a top wire, with stings descending to each plant. Then, daily, you twirl the top shoot around the string and 'rub off' all the suckers as they start in the leaf joints.
They sunburned, and I didn't like the reduced yield, plus the extra labor.
I do train them up a string in my greenhouse for early season tomatoes, but then I need to maximize my space use, so everything must grow vertical.

In a cage, in the wild garden, early season, I just keep poking the branches back into the cage. Come mid-season, I let them be. They cascade out the top. My cages are home-made, cut from concrete reinforcing sheets bent into a circle and wired. My dad made them 40 years ago- no lie! They are much bigger than those you buy at the store, and more stable, and have outlasted anything I've store bought.

I am an unabashed and unrepentant pincher. I don't like the mess of sprawling tomato vines and I have convinced myself (regardless of the facts, damnit!) that the plants that are pinched and kept within bounds suffer fewer disease issues. Pinching is different than pruning in that you are just removing growth where suckers form where a branch meets the main stem(s). That said, then adding support to keep them upright keeps them more within bounds. How and what...well, that's up to you. But you kind of need to decide what that's going to be about thirty minutes before you plant your plants; not three months later. Or you could be an optimist and say, with conviction, that you have just decided what support you will use n e x t year.
Sprawling plants can (and do) still produce heavy crops, perhaps heavier than manicured ones, but how would you know - you can't get within ten feet of them for all the rampant growth. I think a great deal of it depends on what 'looks right' to you. Three months of cat hair on my stairs doesn't bother me, a weed in the garden path causes me to lose sleep.
As kenisaac implies above, store bought cages really aren't adequate - his (father's) solution is simple, robust and much more practical. And probably cheap.

Regardless, enjoy the bounty (and the controversy you have stirred)!

I guess the biggest reason I'm asking this is because I was under the impression that if you don't prune (or pinch?), the tomatoes yield is hampered.

It sounds like I was incorrect.

Question --

If I DIDN'T prune and DIDN'T support them with anything, and just let them grow uncontrollably, sprawled and all over the ground -- assuming no one ate them -- would they grow just as much, or do they need to grow upward to have a heavy yield?

I'm just trying to get the most with the LEAST amount of work

Your tomatoes will grow just fine sprawled across the ground. (They do get a little hard to harvest if you are wading through them.) BUT, any tomatoes (the fruit themselves) sitting on the damp ground might rot before they get ripe. That and more space/access are the big reasons people tie up tomatoes.

Ok. Thanks so much everyone for the help. I'm going to see if I can snap a picture of my setup and show you visually.

Welcome to gardening School, the more you learn, the more you realize there is to learn!

Some Tomatoes behave more unruly than other tomatoes, because of their growth habits. An 'indeterminate' tomato keeps vining and producing, a determinate plant vines, sets fruit, then kinda takes the rest of the summer off...

Here is a link to get you started on the 'all about tomatoes' journey. This talks of growth habits and staking/caging needs, among other things.
https://bonnieplants.com/garde...

I believe the other school of thought is that pruned, tied up plants have less disease ( better airflow) and better flavor, as less energy is devoted to ever more multiplying growth points. Certainly, this thread shows lots of us happy with unpruned plants.

I prune some. for example, my plants have a few ground level stems (suckers) growing out and laying on the ground with a couple fruits each. Those stems though and shaded and pretty thin and not 'vigorous' looking. Maybe they'd just as well be removed.

One of my hybrids, while it branches and one could maybe call it suckering and prune one of the branches, well, they seem to divide evenly making two strong branches at those points, that seems like a sign of strong growth that I don't want to mess with

Maybe like woody plants, (or any plants?) one could judiciously cut away thin weak looking growth.

we try to buy only Bush, Determinate tomato plants...no more sprawling. Any pieces you break off will root readily when stuck into dirt.

JBarstool said:I am an unabashed and unrepentant pincher. I don't like the mess of sprawling tomato vines and I have convinced myself (regardless of the facts, damnit!) that the plants that are pinched and kept within bounds suffer fewer disease issues. Pinching is different than pruning in that you are just removing growth where suckers form where a branch meets the main stem(s). That said, then adding support to keep them upright keeps them more within bounds. How and what...well, that's up to you. But you kind of need to decide what that's going to be about thirty minutes before you plant your plants; not three months later. Or you could be an optimist and say, with conviction, that you have just decided what support you will use n e x t year.
Sprawling plants can (and do) still produce heavy crops, perhaps heavier than manicured ones, but how would you know - you can't get within ten feet of them for all the rampant growth. I think a great deal of it depends on what 'looks right' to you. Three months of cat hair on my stairs doesn't bother me, a weed in the garden path causes me to lose sleep.
As kenisaac implies above, store bought cages really aren't adequate - his (father's) solution is simple, robust and much more practical. And probably cheap.

Regardless, enjoy the bounty (and the controversy you have stirred)!

Thats the idea I'm familiar with and saw -- "pinching." Basically you pinch off the branches that are below the central growth point(s) and fruiting branches.

Hmm...so many varying opinions here.

I don't mind pinching my plants and trying it, but which ones? I guess late in the game you can see which branches have baby tomatoes and you can pinch the rest?

Here's my experience. My garden is only 9x15 feet so it's pretty little. It's got 12 indeterminate tomatoes, 10 pepper plants, 2 zucchini, 3 short rows of beans, and a few pots of herbs. I'm using panels of concrete reinforcing wire as supports. I was going to make individual cages but ran out of time (and money) and just made a giant cage for a row. And then I strung thick string back and forth between for extra support. My plants are already reaching 5-6 feet now.
About once a week or so I go and prune out some excess leaves. Basically I wasn't too be able to somewhat see through the jungle so I can see tomatoes inside and so air moves through. I've trimmed off any leaves that touch the ground. I've started cutting some tops off since my plants are getting taller than me already. I'm cutting suckers that are starting over 4 feet up but leaving lower ones to produce.
While none of my tomatoes are ripe yet, I've got more and bigger ones than ever before. You didn't mention if yours are determinate or indeterminate, but if they are indeterminate you can easily prune and they'll be fine. I'd do a little one day and go back a few days more and see if more needs pruned. This is my first year pruning like this and I'm finding it works well for me. I'll go take some pictures to post.

Here's pictures:

4 plants sandwiched between the concrete reinforcing wire and the fence around the yard.


8 plants between 2 panels of wire

All the tomatoes (less than a 6x9 area holds 12 plants)



This is about what I prune to, you can just see bits of light if you look through.


I need to prune this area a bit more, can't really see through it


This sucker was about 2.5 feet above the ground so I left it to grow


This sucker got cut since it was almost at the top of the fence


Here you can see a portion of my tomatoes. It's like this on all the plants. So many just waiting to turn red.


Trimmed lower leaves to avoid water splashing onto them

Hopefully that helps. Tomatoes are pretty hardy I feel (at least mine always have been). I even took a few top parts I cut off and stuck in a pot and they're still alive somehow. I just wanted to see if it would work and so far it is.

How do I know if my tomatoes are indeterminate or determinate?

ale4529 said:I guess the biggest reason I'm asking this is because I was under the impression that if you don't prune (or pinch?), the tomatoes yield is hampered.

It sounds like I was incorrect.

Question --

If I DIDN'T prune and DIDN'T support them with anything, and just let them grow uncontrollably, sprawled and all over the ground -- assuming no one ate them -- would they grow just as much, or do they need to grow upward to have a heavy yield?

I'm just trying to get the most with the LEAST amount of work

,

When allowed to sprawl, It may be wiser to space them farther apart.

Down in the sunbelt, every bit of tomato greenery is needed to prevent sunscald.





Here's a caged plant...



Here's a patch of caged cherry tomatoes... they were planted too close together...

Whether one method produces more or not is why it is important to grow some left to their own devices as control group when you plant a patch to pinch... and then you make up your own mind.

My own feeling has always been that when I have to spend less time on each individual plant, I can grow more food. The less time spent on useless tasks in the garden, the more food ends up in the kitchen...

And... I dislike the look of those tortured plants!

Edit:
Indeterminate plants keep growing.
Determinate plants die after a single flush of fruit.

Usually if you google the tomato variety you have you can find out if they are determinate or indeterminate. I'm growing in Nebraska, zone 5 and my garden gets morning and some afternoon sun but our deck blocks the late afternoon and evening sun. I'm growing 1 Cherokee purple, 4 romas (I think there's 4) and the rest are black krim. I think mine are all heirloom varieties which tend to be indeterminate (though I could be wrong). I just grow what I like to make sauce from and most have the darker skin. I've never really noticed sunscald in my tomatoes before (though I've seen it on some peppers. But I might just be lucky.