Daylilies forum→Stamile White Daylilies

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Name: Wendy
mid-Atlantic (Zone 6b)
robinjoy
Apr 25, 2021 3:47 PM CST
From the mid-1980s until 2008 Patrick Stamile registered about 40 white daylilies (including several described as ivory or cream). I collect whites (both historics and newer intros) and currently have eight of his:
Wedding Band (1987) Stout
Lime Frost (1990) HM
White Crinoline (1992)
Early Snow (1996)
Michael Miller (2000) HM
Boundless Beauty (2005) AM
Last Snowflake (2006) HM
Voila Francois (2008) HM

In 2008, in addition to Voila Francois, he registered four others:
Fancy Lace (2008) HM
Fringy (2008) HM
Lacy All Over (2008)
Snow Crystal (2008) - I believe Jamie Gossard is using this in his program

1st question: for those of you who grow several of these 2008 intros - which seem very similar - which would you particularly recommend?

2nd question: are there other Stamile whites that you find especially distinctive?

3rd question: does anyone know why Pat stopped registering (and presumably breeding) whites after 2008? Did it have anything to do with the sale of Floyd Cove? (There is an excellent earlier thread about the Stamilies that describes the history of their program, including moves from Long Island to Florida and eventually to California, where they are currently, and has pictures of many of their gorgeous registrations.)

Eagleriver
Apr 25, 2021 4:40 PM CST
Wendy have you asked Stuart Kendig?? He both knows at least of Pat and he raises whites
Name: Wendy
mid-Atlantic (Zone 6b)
robinjoy
Apr 25, 2021 5:09 PM CST
Eagleriver - I am working on the white classification program with Stuart and several others - the garden.org forum reaches a different group of daylily enthusiasts around the country with a great cross section of collections, and I value their input. Smiling
Name: Zoia Bologovsky
Stoneham MA (Zone 6a)
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Zoia
Apr 25, 2021 5:41 PM CST
Wendy, I have had Lime Frost the longest. I think I bought it in the late 90s, I remember it was very expensive ($35!) but it was so glittery with the greenish throat, that I had to have it. I'm not sure that I still have it, I had to move it and it might have perished.

I have only had Early Snow for a few seasons, but I like it very much. I even have a seedling off it that will get planted out soon.

I received Voila Francois a few weeks ago and Boundless Beauty is arriving tomorrow. But after seeing all of the photos and accolades for Voila Francois here on this site, I knew I just had to have that plant. It's exactly what I want in a white Daylily.
Dallas TX (Zone 8a)
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JasonT
Apr 25, 2021 8:45 PM CST
Planted Voila Francois and Last Snowflake last week! Boundless Beauty and Fringy look very interesting!

Zoia said:Wendy, I have had Lime Frost the longest. I think I bought it in the late 90s, I remember it was very expensive ($35!) but it was so glittery with the greenish throat, that I had to have it. I'm not sure that I still have it, I had to move it and it might have perished.

I have only had Early Snow for a few seasons, but I like it very much. I even have a seedling off it that will get planted out soon.

I received Voila Francois a few weeks ago and Boundless Beauty is arriving tomorrow. But after seeing all of the photos and accolades for Voila Francois here on this site, I knew I just had to have that plant. It's exactly what I want in a white Daylily.


Name: Justine
Maryville, Tennessee (Zone 7a)
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Hembrain
Apr 25, 2021 9:21 PM CST
I have quite a few white Stamile's. I love Voila Francois for it's consistent creamy ruffles but I have to say that Snow Crystal is really pristine and has to be my favorite tet white. The white is so clean and the form and habits are stellar. Opens early and beautifully. Not the biggest, but the cleanest. I think I remember reading that it was considered a pinnacle in white achievement, and I mentally instantly agreed.

Thumb of 2021-04-26/Hembrain/f1eb89
Snow Crystal
The obstacle IS the path...
Name: Wendy
mid-Atlantic (Zone 6b)
robinjoy
Apr 26, 2021 8:08 AM CST
@Hembrain - Thanks Justine - that's very helpful. I may have the opportunity to purchase several of the later Stamile whites, including White Mountain, Fancy Lace, Fringy, Lacy All Over and Snow Crystal, but with limited space I want to make sure I am selecting only the most distinctive of these. Do you have thoughts about any of the others? Are there any of the earlier ones you particularly like?

Eagleriver
Apr 26, 2021 9:21 AM CST
Wendy I'm supposed to have fringe coming from lily auction. If you want to leave that one off your purchase list I'll trade a piece of mine to you in a couple seasons
Name: Justine
Maryville, Tennessee (Zone 7a)
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Hembrain
Apr 26, 2021 12:51 PM CST
I'm looking forward to getting Fancy Lace as the genes have played out in gorgeous ways! It's hard to have too many whites, Wendy! I need to check sometime to see which of my whites are Stamile's. Some of these may be hybridized by others.

White Mountain was next to VF and SC and didn't do as well in that beauty pageant. A bit taller and stately, but not that floriferous or impressive for me.

Lacy All Over is delicate and a neat, clean white. Lovely! Prefer it to Michael Miller.

I love Last Snowflake for being so big and flat. Evergreen but hardy and a decent grower, although the big fans take their time to commit to increase in my yard. Opens early and well.

Boundless Beauty gets hung up consistently for me, as does Winter Springs. Fluffy but fragile. I always wish they were whiter.

White Perfection grows well, doesn't seem to rebloom for me, and is "meh" compared to later material.

I know there are others.... In short, the later ones are superior to me.
The obstacle IS the path...
Name: Julie
Roanoke, VA (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Region: Virginia Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Heucheras Cat Lover Hummingbirder
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floota
Apr 26, 2021 1:15 PM CST
Pat ( Stamile) said himself when they sold Floyd Cove in 2009 that he and Grace were both cutting back and narrowing their focus. In addition to leaving behind his development of near whites, Pat no longer does much with tetraploid spiders and UFs and he developed many great ones in that category in the 90s and early 2000s. He also had a program of smaller, " pony sized" (Pats words) plants with good plant habits that he called the butterflies. . I remember being at Floyd Cove in 2009 just before the nursery changed hands. Pat also had a line of promising large reds, some fancy edged ones, and the day I was there, he had been working on a Tet conversion of Rose F. Kennedy to get tets with those big green throats. Guy Pierce has picked up that ball and run with it, Pat I think left that part of his program behind. . Pats focus now seems to be on large flowered patterns. Part of the selling agreement was ( or so I've been told) they had to leave behind most or all plants they had been breeding with and they couldn't sell for a certain number of years. ( 5?)

Oh , PS, I grow or grew most of the whites and near whites you listed. Still grow FRINGY, love the unique tentacles. BOUNDLESS BEAUTY is probably going to be sold out when I finish spring orders this year.
[Last edited by floota - Apr 26, 2021 1:19 PM (+)]
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Name: Arlene
Florida's east coast (Zone 9a)
Tropicals Daylilies Bromeliad Region: Florida Enjoys or suffers hot summers Birds
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florange
Apr 26, 2021 4:48 PM CST
I bought Voila Francois from Pat when he introduced it. I still have it in my garden and I treasure it! One of my very favorites. This picture is among other daylily pictures on my living room wall.

Thumb of 2021-04-26/florange/160754

Name: Wendy
mid-Atlantic (Zone 6b)
robinjoy
Apr 26, 2021 7:56 PM CST
Great information everyone! Thanks so much.

I try to grow whites from a wide variety of hybridizers and showing a diversity of flower types. My collection includes Whistling Swan (Hall-D.F., 1966), the first daylily registered as white, Moment of Truth (MacMillan 1969), the first white to earn the Stout, and White Formal (Lenington-G, 1965), the first white to with the LAA. If you are following Stuart Kendig's white classification project, you know that the whitest daylilies are Gentle Shepherd (Yancey, 1980) and Sagarmatha (Elliot, 1984).

It's interesting that breeding whites seems to go in and out of fashion. A couple years ago I compiled a list of all the daylilies registered as white (including some ivory and cream) through 1990. As you might expect, it is voluminous. If anyone who is interested in white daylilies would like a copy, just send me a tree mail.
Name: Justine
Maryville, Tennessee (Zone 7a)
Hybridizer Cat Lover Birds Daylilies Tropicals Farmer
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Hembrain
Apr 26, 2021 8:56 PM CST
I'm looking forward to getting Fancy Lace as the genes have played out in gorgeous ways! It's hard to have too many whites, Wendy! I need to check sometime to see which of my whites are Stamile's. Some of these may be hybridized by others.

White Mountain was next to VF and SC and didn't do as well in that beauty pageant. A bit taller and stately, but not that floriferous or impressive for me.

Lacy All Over is delicate and a neat, clean white. Lovely! Prefer it to Michael Miller.

I love Last Snowflake for being so big and flat. Evergreen but hardy and a decent grower, although the big fans take their time to commit to increase in my yard. Opens early and well.

Boundless Beauty gets hung up consistently for me, as does Winter Springs. Fluffy but fragile. I always wish they were whiter.

White Perfection grows well, doesn't seem to rebloom for me, and is "meh" compared to later material.

I know there are others.... In short, the later ones are superior to me.
The obstacle IS the path...
Name: Wendy
mid-Atlantic (Zone 6b)
robinjoy
Apr 29, 2021 12:27 PM CST
Looks like my source may only have Lacy All Over available, although the site lists all of the later Stamiles. Think I will go ahead and get that one at least and keep my eye open for the others.

I suspect some of the Florida-bred Stamile evergreens are less reliable further north. I am 6b, but people up this way have said some southern- bred EVs do well here and others are balky.

Any thoughts on northern performance for the Stamile whites?

Thanks for your offer of a trade down the road, Eagleriver - let me know how Fringy turns out for you.

And thanks for the historical update, Julie - I did notice that one of the child plants in 2009 was a joint Pierce-Stamile registration.
Name: Debra
Nashville, TN (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Cat Lover Butterflies Region: Tennessee Seed Starter
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shive1
Apr 29, 2021 1:08 PM CST
I grow Boundless Beauty and Last Snowflake, and really love their blooms. but neither will set pods for me. Arctic Lace is my favorite Stamile near-white. I just added Fancy Lace because it has thrown so many great kids of various colors in Floyd Cove hybridizing. A white that I added last year and really love is Believe in Angels by J.D. Stadler. I am hybridizing for whites after getting some near whites from pink breeding.

Boundless Beauty has the most vigorous plant habit of the near white Stamiles I grow.
Thumb of 2021-04-29/shive1/670ce3

Last Snowflake has great foliage but is a slow multiplier in many areas.


Arctic Lace has good bud count and is pod fertile.
Thumb of 2021-04-29/shive1/8ec7d9

Believe in Angels is pod and pollen fertile. I like that it's a dormant and multiplies well.
Thumb of 2021-04-29/shive1/1ab046

[Last edited by shive1 - Apr 29, 2021 1:17 PM (+)]
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Name: Debra
Nashville, TN (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Cat Lover Butterflies Region: Tennessee Seed Starter
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shive1
Apr 30, 2021 11:27 AM CST
Justine - Thanks for your input on Snow Crystal - the cleanest color is a high recommendation!
Name: Justine
Maryville, Tennessee (Zone 7a)
Hybridizer Cat Lover Birds Daylilies Tropicals Farmer
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Hembrain
Apr 30, 2021 1:27 PM CST
Debra, I also got Believe in Angels from JD last year, but it didn't bloom yet. Looking forward to seeing it do it's thing.

I'm interested to see how the graceful Tet Lillian's Thin Ice, which shows up as such a clear white, combines with other whites, including the Stamiles. I got it and the dip version from Fred a few years ago, and love it. The dip version is fertile but I have had less luck with the converted genes.
Thumb of 2021-04-30/Hembrain/361cfeTet Lillian's Thin Ice

I, too, have been frustrated by Last Snowflake's pod reluctance. It blooms late and maybe the weather is just a bit too hot at that point, although I have had it in afternoon shade. Pollen is productive, though!

It seems like I have crossed just about every round or ruffled tet I have with Snow Crystal or Voila Francois, including one another. Hoping they would clarify whatever they were crossed with, in the great rolling of the genetic dice. I was delighted to see the branching statistics for both and hope they convey.

Speaking of branching, the near-white light pink She Talks to Angels shows nice bloom placement in it's first year in a pot:



But I digress from the thread...


The obstacle IS the path...
Name: Debra
Nashville, TN (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Cat Lover Butterflies Region: Tennessee Seed Starter
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shive1
May 1, 2021 9:52 AM CST
Justine - How exiciting to have tet Lillian's Thin Ice! I've done some hybridizing with the beloved dip version and am planting some of those seedlings this year. The dip version has not produced pods for me, but I have it as pollen parent on a couple of crosses. I think tet LTI crossed with some Stamile whites would be fantastic. I hope you will post some of white seedlings on the seedling threads here in the future. I'd love to see what you get!
Name: Betty
Bakersfield, CA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Birds The WITWIT Badge Region: United States of America Roses
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Betja
May 1, 2021 11:36 AM CST
Speaking of white dips, I think LILLIAN'S IVORY TOWER is just about the whitest daylily I've found to date...





Needless to say, it's my very favorite... Lovey dubby

Betty

Eagleriver
May 1, 2021 2:35 PM CST
Wendy Fringy arrived today😁

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