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Jul 30, 2023 10:31 PM CST
Name: Al F.
5b-6a mid-MI
Knowledge counters trepidation.
Japanese Maples Deer Tropicals Seed Starter Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Region: Michigan
Houseplants Foliage Fan Dog Lover Container Gardener Birds Wild Plant Hunter
@drdawg When it comes to discussions like this, I'd rather be wrong and find out later that I am than to be silent in the face of a hasty conclusion and exit the discussion with someone not getting the help they need. I'll stick by what I said until there is evidence enough to refute it, and I believe I sense some of that same attitude in you.

I've paid my dues as well. I failed at bonsai initially in the early 80s before deciding I needed to hit the books for several years before my second try. I found that learning before doing, then doing as little by trial and error as possible and using practical applications (what many would call experience) to validate what I've already learned is the fastest way to increase proficiency. In large part that's because it takes a certain amount of knowledge to accurately interpret our plants' responses to our ministrations. If we don't have the wherewithal to accurately correlate cause/effect relationships we observe in our phyto-friends, we're pretty much doomed to keep repeating our mistakes.

I travel often to events that offer learning opportunities and have cultivated many friendships with others knowledgeable enough to answer my most complicated and obscure questions, and I read, but I spend much more time doing than I do talking about doing.

Someone bright and enthusiastic recently asked for advice re how to increase their proficiency at growing in containers. I thought long about it. This is my reply and what I believe:
If you have a burning desire to document/enumerate a thousand methods that do not work, your best bet is to reach for and embrace trial and error. If you have little/no interest in documenting failure after failure, learn all you can about the subject at hand, then abandon trial and error and use your practical applications to validate what you already learned. You'll leave the trial and error devotees standing in your slipstream. My thumb, if at all green, came as a result of correcting the mistakes I made along the way while still learning to see things from the plant's point of view.

Don't put too much faith in consensus. It can be useful as long as you chew on it awhile and don't swallow it whole, but don't depend on it to take you to the mountaintop.


Al
* Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others have labored hard for. ~ Socrates
* Change might not always bring growth, but there is no growth without change.
* Mother Nature always sides with the hidden flaw.
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Jul 31, 2023 6:01 AM CST
Name: Ken Ramsey
Vero Beach, FL (Zone 10a)
Bromeliad Vegetable Grower Region: United States of America Tropicals Plumerias Orchids
Region: Mississippi Master Gardener: Mississippi Hummingbirder Cat Lover Composter Seller of Garden Stuff
Al, I try to respect everyone that I come in contact with. In my opinion, we all have something to share when it comes to experiences growing plants. I've owned and operated a tropical plant nursery for 5 years, five years in Mississippi and five years in Vero Beach, Fl. I'm a Master Gardener and Mississippi Master Gardeners made a twice a year pilgrimage to my home and nursery. I was their go-to guy when it came to growing and propagating tropical plants. I've advised people in every state in the Union how to grow and propagate plants], many thousands of folks. My initial interest and then expertise was in orchids, but when I moved to Vero Beach five and one-half years ago, I got very serious growing and propagating plumeria. Orchids and plumeria are still my main interests, and I'm pretty darn knowledgeable about those two genera. When I'm asked for help, just like you, as often as not, I ask for more information. That's always been key to giving advice. But this particular question and accompanying photograph was plenty of information for me to make a "diagnosis". Again, my advice is always based on my own experiences. But because I've grown tropicals in both a temperate as well as a subtropical climate, and done so for many decades, my experiences are pretty broad. In medicine we call this anecdotal data or anecdotal evidence.
drdawg (Dr. Kenneth Ramsey)

The reason it's so hard to lose weight when you get up in age is because your body and your fat have become good friends.
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Jul 31, 2023 9:37 AM CST
Name: Gina
Florida (Zone 9a)
Tropical plant collector 40 years
Aroids Region: Florida Greenhouse Tropicals
tapla said: @drdawg When it comes to discussions like this, I'd rather be wrong and find out later that I am than to be silent in the face of a hasty conclusion and exit the discussion with someone not getting the help they need. I'll stick by what I said until there is evidence enough to refute it, and I believe I sense some of that same attitude in you.

I've paid my dues as well. I failed at bonsai initially in the early 80s before deciding I needed to hit the books for several years before my second try. I found that learning before doing, then doing as little by trial and error as possible and using practical applications (what many would call experience) to validate what I've already learned is the fastest way to increase proficiency. In large part that's because it takes a certain amount of knowledge to accurately interpret our plants' responses to our ministrations. If we don't have the wherewithal to accurately correlate cause/effect relationships we observe in our phyto-friends, we're pretty much doomed to keep repeating our mistakes.

I travel often to events that offer learning opportunities and have cultivated many friendships with others knowledgeable enough to answer my most complicated and obscure questions, and I read, but I spend much more time doing than I do talking about doing.

Someone bright and enthusiastic recently asked for advice re how to increase their proficiency at growing in containers. I thought long about it. This is my reply and what I believe:
If you have a burning desire to document/enumerate a thousand methods that do not work, your best bet is to reach for and embrace trial and error. If you have little/no interest in documenting failure after failure, learn all you can about the subject at hand, then abandon trial and error and use your practical applications to validate what you already learned. You'll leave the trial and error devotees standing in your slipstream. My thumb, if at all green, came as a result of correcting the mistakes I made along the way while still learning to see things from the plant's point of view.

Don't put too much faith in consensus. It can be useful as long as you chew on it awhile and don't swallow it whole, but don't depend on it to take you to the mountaintop.


Al


I don't think the nice lady who asked the original question and received 2 very solid answers from people with many years of hands on practical experience growing plumeria is even probably reading these 'books' you are posting anymore.
The only suggestion I would give the OP besides what I've already said is this:
You can remove the most damaged burnt leaves. They won't recover and might attract pests to your plumeria.
Award winning beaded art at ceinwin.deviantart.com!
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Jul 31, 2023 11:39 AM CST
Name: Ken Ramsey
Vero Beach, FL (Zone 10a)
Bromeliad Vegetable Grower Region: United States of America Tropicals Plumerias Orchids
Region: Mississippi Master Gardener: Mississippi Hummingbirder Cat Lover Composter Seller of Garden Stuff
I agree, Gina, but I would remove badly damaged leaves simply because I'm an esthetic freak, and want my plants looking their best. nodding
drdawg (Dr. Kenneth Ramsey)

The reason it's so hard to lose weight when you get up in age is because your body and your fat have become good friends.
Image
Jul 31, 2023 11:54 AM CST
Name: Gina
Florida (Zone 9a)
Tropical plant collector 40 years
Aroids Region: Florida Greenhouse Tropicals
Me too I am a groomer LOL
Award winning beaded art at ceinwin.deviantart.com!
Image
Jul 31, 2023 1:07 PM CST
Name: Ken Ramsey
Vero Beach, FL (Zone 10a)
Bromeliad Vegetable Grower Region: United States of America Tropicals Plumerias Orchids
Region: Mississippi Master Gardener: Mississippi Hummingbirder Cat Lover Composter Seller of Garden Stuff
Two peas in a pod!
drdawg (Dr. Kenneth Ramsey)

The reason it's so hard to lose weight when you get up in age is because your body and your fat have become good friends.

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