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Avatar for kdobler1900
Nov 28, 2024 12:27 PM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
I have three areas on my property where my trees have failed to grow. (My tree choices may be a reason.) I decided I had better test the soil. I have looked at a few soil test options. Does anyone have any preferences / recommendations?
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Nov 28, 2024 2:44 PM CST
Name: PotterK
Seattle, WA
I'd look around you, in the immediate vicinity, where soil history and type are likely similar to your place. What species of tree thrive there? What tends to grow as native (not cultivated by humans). Use that info as clues to making your choices.
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Nov 29, 2024 7:14 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
I'd like to know the trees planted that failed... and... How new the house is.
Could be a ton of things that a soil test may be useless in answering.

Down here, I did a soil test once... useless!

Maybe you'll have better luck...
Personally, I'd be interested to learn whether the soil is so incredibly compacted in those locations that weeds won't even grow...

Down here, the heavy equipment compresses the land and the soil is added in layers, where the rain can't drain, and nothing can penetrate the clay.

Sometimes, we can achieve small gains by drilling holes that we fill with coarse rock to promote drainage...

Something else we see down here...
Piles of building materials and the tree tops and other woody debris are burned on site, creating highly alkaline conditions in some spots of the yard... this dissipates over time, but finding something that tolerates the location may be challenging.

There are home tests sold that test the ph, and might be of use...
Personally I'd go out with a shovel and try to dig hole...

Many of those nurseries send out a crew with augers to plant trees and shrubs which often fail... Due to their failure to do any soil prep.
Avatar for kdobler1900
Nov 29, 2024 9:58 AM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
@stone - The house is 60 years old and was part of a farm in operation less than 70 years ago. It now 'sits next to wetlands'. Our neighbors, whose grandfather ran the farm, told us that the land was 'pretty wet'. Sometimes they had to wait until June to plow the land, even with the ditches they dug (and later dredged) to help remove the water.

The town declared much of the farm under wetland protection, so we essentially have an intermittent stream on the back of the property.

Tree #1 is an Oak. The tree is right next to a natural water run-off, so after rainfalls, it can take a day or two for all the water to run off. It's about 10 yards from the stream, and the land not too much higher than the 'top of the stream' I know this a bit vague. I am just trying to impress upon you that ground there might be considered the edge of the wetlands.

Tree #2 is an Eastern Red Cedar. During rainfalls, water pools close to the tree until it drains. The three is about 6 feet from the stream.

Tree #3 is a Hickory tree. While it is also about 6 feet from the stream, it is also about 6 feet above. I don't know why, but I have to imagine that the farmer piled dirt there for one reason or another.

Generally speaking, plants grow in all three areas.

Let me know if you need more descriptions.
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Nov 29, 2024 10:06 AM CST
Name: stone
near Macon Georgia (USA) (Zone 8a)
Garden Sages Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier
Ok...
Growing trees in wetland is different than growing dryland trees.
The selections that you've mentioned may not be appropriate to the site...
You may need to reconsider...
I'm thinking tupelo and bald cypress...
Willows and birch & alder... And even American hornbeams.
Plenty of trees will grow in the poorly draining areas.. Just maybe not the ones that you're planting...

There are swamp oaks... try one of those...
And Water Hickorys...

Red cedar? better forget... Like I said... try cypress.... If suitable to your zone... many of these are southern trees...
Last edited by stone Nov 29, 2024 10:17 AM Icon for preview
Avatar for CalPolygardener
Nov 29, 2024 11:42 PM CST
California (Zone 9b)
Try:
Silver and Red Maple
Pin Oak
Alder
Willows

Also, look around other areas that are soggy and see what's growing there.
A soil test is still a good idea to find out if there are any nutrient deficiencies or excesses. They can surprise you sometimes.
Avatar for kdobler1900
Nov 30, 2024 7:45 AM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
@CalPolygardener - So which soil test kit do you recommend? I've look around some, but I prefer personal recommendations.
Avatar for porkpal
Nov 30, 2024 8:15 AM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
Soil tests with which I am familiar look for the mineral content. Your issue seems to be more about moisture and texture. I would suggest the same trees mentioned and the "look around you" technique.
Avatar for CalPolygardener
Nov 30, 2024 9:55 AM CST
California (Zone 9b)
I haven't used any kits. We have a Soils Lab on campus that I have been able to use. University Co-operative Extension can usually do testing for you or recommend a lab.
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Nov 30, 2024 2:52 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland (Zone 7b)
See you in the funny papers!
Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Garden Procrastinator Charter ATP Member Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Houseplants
Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Region: Maryland Composter Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener
How much area? Wild/natural, or landscaped?

I see sweetgum often near wetted sites. Gorgeous fall color, but annoying spiny balls- great for natural sites, not lawn. I think there are sterile culivars.
I see Sycamore near all the rivers and ditches- volunteering. Can grow huge given a century or more. Large leaves mean raking can be a chore on lawn.
Maples of course. Pawpaw if you're adventurous and as an understory.
Plant it and they will come.
Avatar for kdobler1900
Dec 2, 2024 4:01 PM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
@porkpal - Thank you.

@CalPolygardener - Thank you.

@sallyg - I am not sure I understand your question, but I'll attempt to answer. I lined up the trees to run along the stream. Some locations are 1' - 2' higher than the stream when full (that is subjective) and in other areas 6' - 8'. The length from one end to the other is somewhere between 30 and 50 yards.
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Dec 2, 2024 4:57 PM CST
Name: Sally
central Maryland (Zone 7b)
See you in the funny papers!
Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Garden Procrastinator Charter ATP Member Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Houseplants
Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Region: Maryland Composter Native Plants and Wildflowers Organic Gardener
Running along a stream makes me think it's more of a natural area. All trees I mentioned are ok. IMHO.
Plant it and they will come.
Avatar for RpR
Dec 3, 2024 12:55 PM CST
Name: Dr. Demento Jr.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
You need trees that can with stand getting wet feet, I.E. trees that can with stand flooding.
When I landscaped we replaced/replanted a lot of trees who people put in areas with a high water line.

Dig a hole , or get a powered auger and drill a hole and see where your water line is.
No tree will survive being planted below the water line.
How large were the trees you planted?

Minnesota Native Trees for Flood-Prone Areas

American elm – Dutch elm disease resistant.
American basswood.
Bitternut hickory.
Black walnut.
Black Willow.
Box elder.
Bur oak.
Cottonwood.

Of these on the Cottonwood, Basswood, Boxelder and Black Willow get large quickly and have the best chance of survival.
Avatar for kdobler1900
Dec 8, 2024 7:46 PM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
@sallyg - Thank you
Avatar for kdobler1900
Dec 8, 2024 7:50 PM CST
Thread OP
Boston, MA
@RpR - than you for the insights. The Black Walnut I planted is doing very well. It is located close to the intermittent stream and is probably a 1' - 2' above the top of stream when the stream peaks.

The trees I planted were 2'-3' tall. Let me reiterate that the high of the land above the stream varies as you move up and down the stream.
Avatar for Rubi
Dec 12, 2024 5:38 PM CST
West Central Minnesota (Zone 4a)
Hummingbirder
kdobler1900 said: @RpR - than you for the insights. The Black Walnut I planted is doing very well. It is located close to the intermittent stream and is probably a 1' - 2' above the top of stream when the stream peaks.


The water level is the issue here and a soil test will not help. You must choose trees that grow right next to water. Some do not.
Avatar for RpR
Dec 12, 2024 6:51 PM CST
Name: Dr. Demento Jr.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
Red Cedar and most Oaks do not like flooding or wet lands.
They are subject to root rot.

They can with stand wet, but Well Drained soil, i.e. water does not stand for days.
It sounds like a bad location for those species.
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