Roses forum: Roses for Zone 4 ?

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Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 7, 2015 5:12 PM CST
I have had roses on my wish list for several years, but have been nervous about my cold winters and my lack of time in the fall for any special care needed.

I finally ordered some this past week, but am now wondering if I made the right choices.

I am fairly confident about the shrub roses I ordered, Morden Blush , Blanc Double De Coubert, and Party Hardy.

But I am wary that the "climbers" will make it for me. Above All, Show Garden, and Westerland Climbing. The Above All is on its own roots, but the other two are grafted. I ordered them from Jung Seed

Do any of you zone 4 rose growers have any experience with these?
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jan 7, 2015 6:02 PM CST

Moderator

I'm far from zone 4, but I gather from published literature that the first three on your list and Show Garden should be hardy in your zone.

I'm not sure about Westerland, which is said to be hardy to zone 5, and about Above All. Its parents are Westerland and Sweet Magic, which is said to be hardy only to zone 6.
Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 7, 2015 7:25 PM CST
Thanks Zuzu,
I was wondering about Westerland - The site where I bought them lists them all as zone 4 hardy, but I then saw Westerland listed as only zone 5/6 hardy on other sites.

Above All is at least on its own roots, so if mulched It should come back for me.
Name: Patty W
La Salle Illinois (Zone 5a)
Avid Green Pages Reviewer
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Pattyw5
Jan 8, 2015 3:08 PM CST
Ideas for future roses = Sam Kedem Nursury in Minnesota has a good list of roses that are hardy for them. Many easy elegance roses on list. He has them listed by hybridizer. So those are listed as Ping Lim roses. Has some very hardy climbers listed and a few I didn't know where that hardy. He doesn't sell them mail order but nice list to check out. Westerland in not on their list for Minnesota. I'd like to grow Party Hardy.

Then there's Ole, Lena and Sven developed by Kathy Zusek in Minnesota. I think Ole is very disease resistant. Northland Rosarium also carries many zone 4 roses. Some hardy to zone 3.

Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 8, 2015 4:48 PM CST
Thanks so much Patty - I'll check those out.
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Jan 8, 2015 4:51 PM CST
Almost any of the "Canadian" roses should be fine. Buck's roses should be OK too if you mulch them. I understand about not wanting to do a lot of maintenance in the fall.. just pile on the mulch when you plant them half way to China & be done with it. Sure, you'll have to replace the mulch every 3-4 years, depending on how fast it breaks down, but that's a single chore once every few years, so that's not that big of a deal.

But honestly, don't let zones bother you. Almost 100% of my roses are zone 6 and I have a few zone 7 roses that come back for me year after year. The key is to mulch & mulch & mulch!!!
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 8, 2015 5:07 PM CST
That is a much longer list of cold hardy roses than I have seen anywhere else. Hastings MN is only a little over an hour from here, so I will definitely go visit in the spring. Thanks again!
Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 8, 2015 5:10 PM CST
I am not afraid to mulch Thank You!
Name: Patty W
La Salle Illinois (Zone 5a)
Avid Green Pages Reviewer
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Pattyw5
Jan 9, 2015 8:11 AM CST
Some of those roses are also very disease resistant so you need not spray in order to have beautiful foliage. Come back in spring with your choices. Happy rose gardening!
Name: Dirt
(Zone 5b)
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Garden Photography Bee Lover Region: Utah Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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dirtdorphins
Jan 9, 2015 10:03 AM CST
Favorite rose of all time--got it at the MN Landscape Arboretum plant sale--just a few more hrs drive

Sorry, I have no idea what it was called--
but it has beautiful, red, thornless canes that look great all winter--never a smidgeon of winter damage, absolutely no fuss/no muss--required no mulch, no pruning--shiny, dark green foliage resistant to everydangthing that all the other roses had trouble with--once bloomer in the spring but the whole thing, literally covered with semi-double, dark pink, amazingly fragrant blooms for about a month--
Outstanding, carefree performance (and I really should have brought a piece of her with me when I moved)!
Name: Geof
NW Wisconsin (Zone 4b)
Region: Wisconsin Dahlias Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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mandolls
Jan 9, 2015 2:33 PM CST
Thats a bit of a tease !
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Jan 9, 2015 2:47 PM CST
Do you perhaps have a picture @dirtdorphins?
Porkpal
Name: Dirt
(Zone 5b)
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Garden Photography Bee Lover Region: Utah Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Photo Contest Winner: 2016
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dirtdorphins
Jan 9, 2015 6:06 PM CST
I'm sorry, I did not mean to tease!
I mean to suggest that you consider checking locally --you might find something incredible at a similar type plant sale in your area, or drive a little further and see what they have next door.
I believe that rose I got was a start donated by someone local rather than grown by the arboretum but I really don't know. It had a hand written tag and the human who sold it to me was exuberant about its greatness and told me to give it a lot of room. (I had a lot of room on the farm so that was no problem Smiling it got about 6'x10')
You can contact them and find out when the annual plant sale is (always in the spring sometime)
http://www.arboretum.umn.edu/contact.aspx

Porkpal--I did not have a camera back then. Trust me, if I had anything decent in the way of photos I would have included them!
My mother has an actual 3x5 print of it in full bloom next to her motorhome, but I don't.
I have garbage pics, but here is what I dug up:
Cropped out of the edge of a pic of the house in late winter--can see the red canes of part of it in lower left
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And in early spring
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it is the shrub behind the blue car
the other circle in the pic at the windmill in front of the Quonset is William Baffin--just leafing out--and also a nice, hardy rose for the frozen north
(you can see the elms there just making their vile seed packets and that little splash of orange by the car is tulips--so this was early spring and you can see what a champ that rose was about to be anyway. Sorry I don't have anything better)
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Jan 9, 2015 8:27 PM CST
Thanks, that is definitely a vigorous rose - and what dense foliage! I was thinking that if you had pictures of the bloom, some of our experts might be able to give it a name.
Porkpal
Name: Dirt
(Zone 5b)
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Garden Photography Bee Lover Region: Utah Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Photo Contest Winner: 2016
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dirtdorphins
Jan 9, 2015 9:00 PM CST
I wish that I did!
Blooms were semi-double, small, and pink--and like I said, thornless! red canes, once blooming, fragrant (I'd say strongly).
I have looked, but I am no expert.
I would very much like to find this rose again!
Name: Vicky Thompson
Michigan (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member Sempervivums Roses Peonies Region: Michigan Rabbit Keeper
Lilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Farmer Cottage Gardener Enjoys or suffers cold winters Annuals
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Cottage_Rose
Jan 12, 2015 11:16 AM CST
Most large flowering climbers simply will not do well in Z4.
You could try Louise Odier in a sheltered area next to your house.
I'm a no fuss rose gardener in a low laying rural setting that might
as well be Z4 at times. Most large flowering climbers failed to thrive
even here in rural Z5.
I have played around with A LOT of roses since 2000.
Literally buying 100's of them and now 15 years later
what left is once blooming ramblers, some OGR, Rugosas,
several Albas and a handful of Austins. You might want to
try to learn to appreciate once bloomers for their cane hardiness and Rugosas
for their dependability of bloom and disease hardiness.
Also look into Canadian Explorer and Morden roses.
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"I'd rather have roses on my table than diamonds on my neck"
Cottage Rose Birds n' Blossoms

[Last edited by Cottage_Rose - Jan 12, 2015 11:37 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #763880 (16)
Name: Vicky Thompson
Michigan (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member Sempervivums Roses Peonies Region: Michigan Rabbit Keeper
Lilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Farmer Cottage Gardener Enjoys or suffers cold winters Annuals
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Cottage_Rose
Jan 12, 2015 11:28 AM CST
Apple Jack is the only Buck rose that survived here. Its huge shrub and dependable repeater.
As for Austin's Constance Spry is outstanding.
Huge cabbage blossoms with a most enchanting, strong scent
but once blooming. Heritage and her white sport Mary Rose
are quite hardy and repeat bloomers and Mary Rose sends
up some pretty tall canes but not cane hardy.
As for once blooming roses I consider then just as worthy as other
once bloomer I would never live without like lilacs, peonies etc.
plus many are intensely fragrant.
So I don't get the prejudice against once blooming roses. Thumbs down
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"I'd rather have roses on my table than diamonds on my neck"
Cottage Rose Birds n' Blossoms

Name: Vicky Thompson
Michigan (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member Sempervivums Roses Peonies Region: Michigan Rabbit Keeper
Lilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Farmer Cottage Gardener Enjoys or suffers cold winters Annuals
Image
Cottage_Rose
Jan 12, 2015 11:35 AM CST
If I were you I would go to Pickerings website and do a search for Z4 hardy roses.
Since they're Canadian based, they will have more of the roses you need for Z4.
Plus their roses are on virus free understock and they have some own root roses as well
now but I've never had any issues with their grafted roses which I prefer to fall plant even well into November.
I would not buy roses (bareroot or potted) from seed catalog type vendors.

Here's an article I wrote on Hardy Roses.
Hope this helps. Good luck!
http://garden.org/ideas/view/Cottage_Rose/1192/No-Fuss-Roses...
"I'd rather have roses on my table than diamonds on my neck"
Cottage Rose Birds n' Blossoms

[Last edited by Cottage_Rose - Jan 12, 2015 11:41 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #763894 (18)
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jan 12, 2015 11:42 AM CST

Moderator

Hi, Vicky. Good to hear from you and to see all of those great photos of your recommendations. Pickering is closed this year, however, so it won't be of any help to Geof.
Name: Vicky Thompson
Michigan (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member Sempervivums Roses Peonies Region: Michigan Rabbit Keeper
Lilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Farmer Cottage Gardener Enjoys or suffers cold winters Annuals
Image
Cottage_Rose
Jan 12, 2015 11:51 AM CST
Great to be back!
Is Pickerings closed for good?!! Sad
"I'd rather have roses on my table than diamonds on my neck"
Cottage Rose Birds n' Blossoms

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