Avatar for keithp2012
May 12, 2015 7:14 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
sooby said:Keith, when you say the spots get worse and worse every year do you mean that individual ones get bigger? That wouldn't likely be animals in that case. How big are the spots and are they circular or irregular?

Meaning they start with grass dying, slowly less grass is in the area, and eventually no grass is left just bare soil. The spots are irregular and I dug and saw no grubs or anything, the rest of the lawn is lush and green.
Avatar for porkpal
May 12, 2015 8:42 PM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
That is what the grass looks like over out septic tank which has a round lid a few inches under the turf. The shallow soil can't hold enough water to keep the grass alive and green. Do you have a septic system?
Porkpal
Avatar for keithp2012
May 12, 2015 11:36 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
porkpal said:That is what the grass looks like over out septic tank which has a round lid a few inches under the turf. The shallow soil can't hold enough water to keep the grass alive and green. Do you have a septic system?


Nope, we have sewers.
Image
May 14, 2015 9:20 AM CST
Name: greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
I have no use for internet bullies!
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Rabbit Keeper Frugal Gardener Garden Ideas: Master Level
Plant Identifier Region: Georgia Native Plants and Wildflowers Composter Garden Sages Bookworm
Just jumping in for a minute. Keith, I realize you have sewers, but has the property every had a septic system in the past? I lived in a house that originally had a septic system; after the city installed sewer lines we hooked up to the new system but the old septic tank was still in place with the lid (as @porkpal mentioned) was just a few inches under the soil.

Use a piece of re-bar and jab it into the soil where the bare spot is and see if you contact anything hard like metal or concrete.

Okay, I'll go back to lurking now. Rolling on the floor laughing
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~"Leaf of Faith"
Image
May 14, 2015 9:41 AM CST
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4b)
Annuals Native Plants and Wildflowers Keeps Horses Dog Lover Daylilies Region: Canadian
Butterflies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Sages Plant Identifier
keithp2012 said:
Meaning they start with grass dying, slowly less grass is in the area, and eventually no grass is left just bare soil. The spots are irregular and I dug and saw no grubs or anything, the rest of the lawn is lush and green.


Keith, did you also do the check for chinch bugs? If you could post a picture showing the spots and the surrounding area it may help. I think this thread has got a little confused with the OP's pictures of large round patches and your zoysia problem. Maybe it would be a good idea to start a separate thread?
Avatar for keithp2012
May 14, 2015 1:28 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
greene said:Just jumping in for a minute. Keith, I realize you have sewers, but has the property every had a septic system in the past? I lived in a house that originally had a septic system; after the city installed sewer lines we hooked up to the new system but the old septic tank was still in place with the lid (as @porkpal mentioned) was just a few inches under the soil.

Use a piece of re-bar and jab it into the soil where the bare spot is and see if you contact anything hard like metal or concrete.

Okay, I'll go back to lurking now. Rolling on the floor laughing


Good idea, however I hit nothing. So that isn't the issue.
Avatar for keithp2012
May 14, 2015 1:33 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
sooby said:

Keith, did you also do the check for chinch bugs? If you could post a picture showing the spots and the surrounding area it may help. I think this thread has got a little confused with the OP's pictures of large round patches and your zoysia problem. Maybe it would be a good idea to start a separate thread?



They are the same symptoms. Here are photos of mine, a semi damaged spot and a very bad one.

Thumb of 2015-05-14/keithp2012/25102e
Thumb of 2015-05-14/keithp2012/313e98
Avatar for porkpal
May 14, 2015 2:35 PM CST
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX (Zone 9a)
Cat Lover Charter ATP Member Keeper of Poultry I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Dog Lover Keeps Horses
Roses Plant Identifier Farmer Raises cows Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Garden Ideas: Level 2
Do the spots recover and new ones appear or are they chronic?
Porkpal
Image
May 14, 2015 3:32 PM CST
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4b)
Annuals Native Plants and Wildflowers Keeps Horses Dog Lover Daylilies Region: Canadian
Butterflies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Sages Plant Identifier
keithp2012 said:

They are the same symptoms. Here are photos of mine, a semi damaged spot and a very bad one.


The symptoms don't look the same to me. Gotsqueeze's patches are circular, which makes them less likely to be caused by an insect pest whereas your patches are irregular which could be a number of things. We need to see more of the larger environment but if you'd rather not post a picture that may be identifying of your location then can you tell us if this grass is walked on (the second picture patch is somewhat elongated and looks compacted but can't see how long the elongation is - rather looks like foot traffic), if it is near a road (salt injury), whether irrigated, fertilized, any tree roots etc. etc.

One thing you could do if you don't think the problem is somehow environmental is take a watering can with two or three tablespoons of dishwashing liquid in a couple of gallons of water and pour some of it on the turf around the bare spots. You don't need to pour all of it on but just enough to soak in to a couple of square feet or so. Wait about five minutes and then see if any insects come out. This is a hands and knees job! If you don't know what the insects are (they aren't necessarily all bad) then try and get a picture of them so we can check them out. You'll need to flush the area you tested with plain water afterwards to dilute the soap so that it doesn't add to the damage.
Avatar for keithp2012
May 14, 2015 3:37 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
porkpal said:Do the spots recover and new ones appear or are they chronic?


Chronic with new spots. Spots are bare also in winter.
Avatar for keithp2012
May 14, 2015 3:38 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
sooby said:

The symptoms don't look the same to me. Gotsqueeze's patches are circular, which makes them less likely to be caused by an insect pest whereas your patches are irregular which could be a number of things. We need to see more of the larger environment but if you'd rather not post a picture that may be identifying of your location then can you tell us if this grass is walked on (the second picture patch is somewhat elongated and looks compacted but can't see how long the elongation is - rather looks like foot traffic), if it is near a road (salt injury), whether irrigated, fertilized, any tree roots etc. etc.

One thing you could do if you don't think the problem is somehow environmental is take a watering can with two or three tablespoons of dishwashing liquid in a couple of gallons of water and pour some of it on the turf around the bare spots. You don't need to pour all of it on but just enough to soak in to a couple of square feet or so. Wait about five minutes and then see if any insects come out. This is a hands and knees job! If you don't know what the insects are (they aren't necessarily all bad) then try and get a picture of them so we can check them out. You'll need to flush the area you tested with plain water afterwards to dilute the soap so that it doesn't add to the damage.



When I'm not busy I'll try this and to get clearer photos.
Avatar for keithp2012
May 15, 2015 2:43 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
keithp2012 said:

When I'm not busy I'll try this and to get clearer photos.


I tried flushing the grass and all I saw were spiders, earthworms, and some aphids that are falling off the nearby maple trees.

I took a better photo of the lawn.
Thumb of 2015-05-15/keithp2012/f0e84a
Image
May 15, 2015 3:15 PM CST
Name: greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
I have no use for internet bullies!
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Rabbit Keeper Frugal Gardener Garden Ideas: Master Level
Plant Identifier Region: Georgia Native Plants and Wildflowers Composter Garden Sages Bookworm
.
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~"Leaf of Faith"
Last edited by greene May 16, 2015 7:19 PM Icon for preview
Avatar for keithp2012
May 15, 2015 7:25 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
greene said:We seem to have two threads here. This is confusing my brain.
Can we split this into two; one for the original poster gotsqueeze and a separate thread for Keith?


Just send me a pm on it with your answer.
Image
May 15, 2015 7:32 PM CST
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4b)
Annuals Native Plants and Wildflowers Keeps Horses Dog Lover Daylilies Region: Canadian
Butterflies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Sages Plant Identifier
Keith, what is the bowl for?
Avatar for keithp2012
May 15, 2015 10:00 PM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
sooby said:Keith, what is the bowl for?


Food and water for my cats
Image
May 16, 2015 4:27 AM CST
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4b)
Annuals Native Plants and Wildflowers Keeps Horses Dog Lover Daylilies Region: Canadian
Butterflies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Sages Plant Identifier
keithp2012 said:

Food and water for my cats


Are the bowls always in the same place?
Image
May 16, 2015 8:13 AM CST
Name: greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
I have no use for internet bullies!
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Keeper of Poultry Vegetable Grower Rabbit Keeper Frugal Gardener Garden Ideas: Master Level
Plant Identifier Region: Georgia Native Plants and Wildflowers Composter Garden Sages Bookworm
Sighing!
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~"Leaf of Faith"
Last edited by greene May 16, 2015 7:20 PM Icon for preview
Avatar for keithp2012
May 16, 2015 9:10 AM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
greene said: Sighing! gotsqueeze started this thread to ask about spots on his lawn.
Somehow we are now talking about Keith and his cat's water bowls. Whistling

Can we get back on topic please? Thumbs up


Greene please stop, the op isn't complaining and you need to stop nitpicking on things like this it doesn't make anyone feel like they can post without being afraid of getting in trouble or something. You could of sent me a pm if you wanted to help but didn't, so please don't interrupt others helping me, you wouldn't want it done to you.
Avatar for keithp2012
May 16, 2015 9:11 AM CST
Name: Keith
Long Island, NY (Zone 7a)
Zinnias Plays in the sandbox Roses Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Organic Gardener
Region: New York Native Plants and Wildflowers Lilies Seed Starter Spiders! Enjoys or suffers hot summers
sooby said:

Are the bowls always in the same place?



Yes. Are you thinking its foot traffic perhaps that's causing this? If it is what can I do to fix it?

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