Plant ID forum: Identify

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Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Sep 26, 2015 7:31 AM CST
Hi all.
I wonder can any of you green fingered friends out in garden world help identify this plant for me.
I have picked it up from some garden center or other and have lost the tag. I have shown this picture to staff at a few Garden Centers around Hull, UK, but with no success.
Any help would be much appreciated.
The picture is of two plants in separate containers.
Regards Lawrence
Thumb of 2015-09-26/kilnsea68/5760df

Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..
Name: Jean
Prairieville, LA (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Plant Identifier The WITWIT Badge Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Moonhowl
Oct 1, 2015 9:14 PM CST
@JRsbugs any idea what plant Lawrence has?
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
Cat Lover Master Gardener: Florida Tropicals Multi-Region Gardener Vegetable Grower Region: Florida
Herbs Orchids Birds Garden Ideas: Level 2 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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dyzzypyxxy
Oct 1, 2015 9:57 PM CST
How big are the plants, Lawrence? The length of the leaves might give a clue.

Those leaves remind me a bit of although yours have more frilled edges.

Any sign of blooms coming along? They would certainly solve the mystery of this plant's identity.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
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JRsbugs
Oct 2, 2015 7:33 AM CST
I'm stumped! Hilarious!

The only thing it really reminds me of is lettuce seedlings, there are a large number of different varieties of lettuce some of which have serrate or wavy edging. It doesn't quite look like lettuce but could it be something similar?

At this time of year you would expect a pot full of seedlings which can be planted out in the autumn to overwinter. The plants look like several small plants rather than one.

Does it have a distinctive smell at all when a leaf is rubbed?

http://www.hartnursery.co.za/images/leeks%20and%20lettuce.JP...

The leaves appear to be almost serrate, but not quite. I cropped off a part of the photo and enlarged it. There are some lettuce which have very crispy edges, the first leaves might look like these plants. It's an odd time of year for young lettuce plants unless they will be grown on in a greenhouse, there are winter varieties for such growing.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=bush+lobelia+seedlings&biw...

Thumb of 2015-10-02/JRsbugs/e973b2

The only other thing which comes to mind is Lobelia, they die back and make new growth which has this sort of habit.

http://www.chicagobotanic.org/shoreline/species/images/lobel...

Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
Herbs Region: Georgia Region: United States of America Native Plants and Wildflowers Dog Lover Composter
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greene
Oct 2, 2015 7:51 AM CST
Is there any way to lift the foliage and take a photo showing the lower part of the plant? the part nearest to the soil? Thank You!
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Oct 3, 2015 7:42 AM CST
Firstly may I thank you all who have tried to put a name to this plant its very much appreciated.
Now above a few have asked for more pictures, silly me thinking the plant would be recognized from a photo, didn't really think that one out: hearts: now did I.
As to the description, the plant seems to be all from one stalk (picture below). The leaves do look a bit lettuce type, but the size is about the size of a big cabbage and the stalk color look different.
Anyway, here are some more angles and maybe help to put a name to this plant.
Again, thanks to all.
Lawrence


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Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
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JRsbugs
Oct 3, 2015 8:47 AM CST
The base could indicate a perpetual spinach? The individual leaves still look like lettuce!

I wonder if there is a perpetual lettuce which makes such a basal crown? I can't find one but there are drawings of perpetual lettuce which look much like this. The narrow stem end with some leaf attached is typical of lettuce.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=perpetual+lettuce&biw=1440...

Perpetual spinach has a more or less bare stem and the leaf texture is different ..

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=perpetual+lettuce&biw=1440...

Do you dare to try nibbling it?


Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
Image
JRsbugs
Oct 3, 2015 9:11 AM CST
Look at the 'cut and come again lettuce' (which is perpetual), mature lettuce do make quite a strong root and if it's going to be able to grow again after cutting then the root would probably keep expanding in size. Check out the photo lower down showing the base of the leaves ..

http://www.hgtvgardens.com/lettuce/raising-lettuces-on-a-win...






Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
Cat Lover Master Gardener: Florida Tropicals Multi-Region Gardener Vegetable Grower Region: Florida
Herbs Orchids Birds Garden Ideas: Level 2 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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dyzzypyxxy
Oct 3, 2015 10:15 AM CST
I agree with JR, I was going to suggest you taste a little bit of the leaf. Choose a small newer leaf, and of course this late in the season, even lettuce could taste a little bitter.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
Herbs Region: Georgia Region: United States of America Native Plants and Wildflowers Dog Lover Composter
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greene
Oct 3, 2015 12:09 PM CST
Thanks for all the extra photos. Thumbs up

I agree that my eye "sees" lettuce but my logical brain tells me that if a person purchased lettuce plants they would not be likely to forget that they were lettuce. So what else could the plants be?

Lawrence, by any chance have you ever grown Horseradish?
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Oct 4, 2015 4:26 AM CST
Morning all. I think Greene has found the answer. (Well done Greene). After Greenes suggestion I looked at some google images of Horseradish and I really think we have a winner.
Many thanks to all who have taken the time to answer this question, its been bugging me since the plant started to get some growth.
It may well be, that the place I acquired it from did tell me what it was but ive had a sleep since then and like some computer hard drives everything got wiped.
I have put a few photo's of horseradish from google below, I think its a good match
Again, thank you all very much.
Lawrence
Thumb of 2015-10-04/kilnsea68/b93d91


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Thumb of 2015-10-04/kilnsea68/1351c0

Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..
[Last edited by kilnsea68 - Oct 4, 2015 4:27 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #963615 (11)
Name: Elaine
South Sarasota, Florida (Zone 9b)
The one constant in life is change
Cat Lover Master Gardener: Florida Tropicals Multi-Region Gardener Vegetable Grower Region: Florida
Herbs Orchids Birds Garden Ideas: Level 2 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Image
dyzzypyxxy
Oct 4, 2015 7:40 AM CST
That is wonderful, Lawrence. Horseradish is so good. Hurray! Way to go greene.

I have heard that if you actually get to use the root, you should peel and grate it under water (in the sink, maybe?) so it doesn't make you cry. Fresh and home grown it can be really nuclear.
Elaine

"Success is stumbling from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm." –Winston Churchill
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
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JRsbugs
Oct 4, 2015 8:31 AM CST
Do horseradish leaves have a taste?

I looked at horseradish but the leaf texture, and more particularly the leaf venation doesn't appear to fit. The leaves show veins much closer together, radiating almost horizontally from the mid vein. On Lawrence's plant the veins look to be few and more arching - angulated.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Horseradish+YOUNG+LEAVES&b...

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Horseradish+YOUNG+LEAVES&b...

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Horseradish+YOUNG+LEAVES&b...

Compare .. I have placed arrows on veins which can be seen.

Thumb of 2015-10-04/JRsbugs/d42439

[Last edited by JRsbugs - Oct 4, 2015 8:32 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #963696 (13)
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
Image
JRsbugs
Oct 4, 2015 9:21 AM CST
Compare the photo showing two single leaves with this lettuce seedling ... again, note how the leaf continues narrowly to the base.

http://i0.wp.com/tinyfarmblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03...

http://garden.org/pics/2015-10-03/kilnsea68/2d5726.jpg
Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
Herbs Region: Georgia Region: United States of America Native Plants and Wildflowers Dog Lover Composter
Image
greene
Oct 4, 2015 10:24 AM CST
I didn't say that it was Horseradish; I only asked if Lawrence had ever grown the plants.

Looking for Horseradish in Hull, UK I see it is mentioned about 15 times as Armoracia rusticana P. Gaertn., B. Mey. & Scherb. in this link:

http://www.hullcc.gov.uk/pls/portal/docs/PAGE/HOME/PLANNING/...

Perhaps Lawrence could take a few of the leaves from his NOID plant and compare to those on the plants growing in the allotments? It's just a thought.
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
Image
JRsbugs
Oct 4, 2015 11:11 AM CST
But, Lawrence thought it looked like horseradish which is understandable when you don't know what to look for.

I haven't been able to find any cultivated plant of horseradish which doesn't have bare stems. Armoracia rusticana on the Hull site is mentioned in various locations growing wild.

Bare stems, more like leaf spinach ..

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Armoracia+rusticana&source...

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Armoracia+rusticana&source...

The leaf venation on some wild growing plants appears to be different, but still has bare stems, I'm not sure this next one is correctly named ..

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Armoracia+rusticana&source...

A university site in Italy ..

http://dryades.units.it/euganei/index.php?procedure=taxon_pa...

[Last edited by JRsbugs - Oct 4, 2015 11:13 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #963819 (16)
Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Oct 4, 2015 11:24 AM CST
Maybe this mystery is still on going. Please tune in later this week after I have been to the allotments referred to by Greene.
Also ill visit a few of the people just up the road who have allotments and they may know.
This morning, everything looked rosy thinking we had identified the plant now all I am sure of is don't send me shopping for Horseradish, god only knows what I would bring back. Apparently there's a few different types of horseradish and I still hope what I have is one verity of Armoracia Rusticana. As always' many thanks to you all and if the boss lady lets me out of her sight for an hour or two tomorrow ill try tracking this down.
Cheers Lawrence.
Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..
Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Oct 4, 2015 11:33 AM CST
Just a quick thank you to JRsbugs,
You are oh so correct. I went out and brought a few leaves form the plant in, and mine are more pointed at the top and the vain structure is totally different.
The boss lady thinks Ive loss the plot, here I am looking and waving plant leaves in front of the monitor.
Till later cheers Lawrence
Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..
Name: Janet Super Sleuth
Near Lincoln UK
Charter ATP Member Organic Gardener Garden Photography Bee Lover Dragonflies Cat Lover
Butterflies Birds Plant Identifier I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Spiders!
Image
JRsbugs
Oct 5, 2015 6:00 AM CST
Have you tried nibbling a young piece of it Lawrence? You can spit it out, or maybe if you bruise a leaf you could tell if it smells like lettuce.

Be warned, identification of plants or insects is the beginning of a very long and frustrating road. Hilarious!
Name: Lawrence Casey
Kingston-Apon-Hull UK
Image
kilnsea68
Oct 5, 2015 6:54 AM CST
Hi Janet Super Sleuth.
I have tried the taste test and to be honest, it was practically tasteless but chewy. That seems to be the same for what I think are new and older leaves.
Unable to do any sleuthing work today because the weather up here in East Yorkshire is cold and wet. I passed by the allotments earlier, but nobody about.
Will try another day.
As to your "very long and frustrating road" I get what you mean, but I am quite enjoying our discussions with yourself and others who have joined my hunt for the truth, (beginning to sound a bit like The X-Files) and hopefully learning something about plants along the way.
Regards Lawrence.C,

Please don't get confused between my personality & my attitude.My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are..

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