Sempervivum forum: The real Saturn is?

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Name: Julia
Washington State (Zone 7a)
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springcolor
Apr 4, 2016 12:28 AM CST
Will you post you pictures of what your Saturn looks like. I have an imposter. I think it is the one on the left from the frog people.
Thumb of 2016-04-04/springcolor/bef42c

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Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Apr 4, 2016 5:01 PM CST
Hey Julia, based on http://www.sempervivum-liste.d...
I'd say it is on the right, since theirs doesn't look like it has much cilia.
@Jungleshadows Kevin are you able to make a guess or @Valleylynn any ideas!
For some reason whenever someone mentions 'Saturn' I mix it up with 'Sunset' not good!!!
I tip my hat to you.

Name: Tim Stoehr
Canby, Oregon (Zone 8b)
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tcstoehr
Apr 4, 2016 8:14 PM CST
Here's what I got from Chris/Goldfinch4 last summer. It seems like a reasonable facsimile to your right-hand image.
The left-hand image seems clearly wrong to me. I think the frog lies.

Thumb of 2016-04-05/tcstoehr/251fde

However, I don't think any of this matches http://www.sempervivum-liste.d...
Confused
[Last edited by tcstoehr - Apr 4, 2016 8:26 PM (+)]
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Apr 4, 2016 8:57 PM CST

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I think we will need Kevin's help on this one.
I don't think I would trust the Frog people on semps. I was at Al's Garden Center today, and they had 6 or 7 different semps from the Frog people. Some I know were incorrect. Wish I would have take photos. Saturn was not among them.
Name: Patty
Washington State (Zone 8b)
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Patty
Apr 4, 2016 10:34 PM CST
Greg that is funny - I always get Saturn and Sunset mixed up too! It's because I bought them both at the same time I think Blinking same with Grunrand and Goldrand.

Julia - I sure like the one on the left, but doesn't look like Saturn
Patty 🌺
[Last edited by Patty - Apr 4, 2016 11:07 PM (+)]
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 29, 2018 9:36 AM CST

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Okay, back to trying to sort out who the real 'Saturn' is.

This is the written description Kevin sent me:

JungleShadows said:OK here goes.

Alpine Gardens:
Bronzy red and light green incurved velvety leaves with a silvery edge.

Betty Bronow:
Many incurved leaves make an open rosette of cinnamon-red. At times an inner glow of light apple green. Velvet. Large.

Helen:
Fringed and tufted velvety leaves reddish-orange rosettes. Purple-red tips.

Hope that helps!

Helen did introduce it for Ed in 1975.


Well all of these descriptions disqualify my 'Saturn'. Another NOID for me. Rolling my eyes.

We also have to wonder what time of the year each of the people wrote their description.
But the real 'Saturn' is suppose to have a velvet texture, with fringe along the leaf edges. That narrows things down.
I will start cleaning out my photos when I get home from work.
Name: Melissa Hopper
St. Helens, Or (Zone 8a)
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MelissaHopper
Aug 29, 2018 1:24 PM CST
This is what my Saturn looked like back in April.

Thumb of 2018-08-29/MelissaHopper/5fbb27


And this was July when it started to bloom.

Thumb of 2018-08-29/MelissaHopper/c80fd6

Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Aug 29, 2018 2:45 PM CST
Lynn interesting I've never seen a velvet version Sticking tongue out Hi NOID nodding

Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 29, 2018 5:02 PM CST

Moderator

Sighing! You and me both Greg. News to me about the velvet texture.

Melissa, I think you have the same one that Greg and I have. Does yours have a velvety texture?

@ashley3's Ashley, can you get us a close up of the ones you have? I would like to see what the texture of the leaves is like and also see if it has the lashes lining the leaves.
Name: Melissa Hopper
St. Helens, Or (Zone 8a)
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MelissaHopper
Aug 31, 2018 5:54 PM CST
Lynn, mine does not have a fuzzy, velvety type leaf. It is a matte leaf, not shiny at all but not velvety either.

Mine came from Youngs. Where did you get yours?
Name: Melissa Hopper
St. Helens, Or (Zone 8a)
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MelissaHopper
Aug 31, 2018 5:56 PM CST
Saturn is a variety that appears to have just as many rings as the planet. When growing quickly in spring Saturn turns a yellow-green color with dark red leaf ends. When slightly stressed they plant turns deep red with beautiful watermarks.
Ed Skrocki (US), 1974

This is the description of Saturn from Youngs website. I don't see velvet texture mentioned and the plant I have certainly matches their description.
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Sep 4, 2018 9:34 AM CST
Melissa - Young's description is probably based on the plant they have, which isn't a correct plant, based on the older descriptions that were written when the plant was introduced
I tip my hat to you.

Name: Melissa Hopper
St. Helens, Or (Zone 8a)
Semp addict horse junky dog flunky
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MelissaHopper
Sep 4, 2018 12:11 PM CST
I think you are probably right about that Greg. They certainly do describe the plant that I have, which is a very nice plant but...……...virtually all of my NOIDS have come from Youngs.
Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Sep 4, 2018 5:59 PM CST

Moderator

Sorry Melissa. Group hug
I'm in the same boat. Sad
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
JungleShadows
Sep 4, 2018 6:33 PM CST
I think the problem is that nurseries try to keep the name in which they received that plant. Unfortunately, once a mistake is made, it's kept on forever.

I did send Young's pl;ants of most of my older plants that I had verified as correct.

Kevin
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Sep 5, 2018 4:23 PM CST
Melissa yep!! Thumbs down Kevin glad you did that! If nurseries are getting their stock from other than the hybridizer, then yes easy to be wrong (and most are getting from sources other than hybridizers) I think also it is easy for these plants to get mixed in if the nursery isn't careful with separating stock plants. And also when they pull the order it is easy to make errors there too! D'Oh!
I tip my hat to you.

Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Sep 5, 2018 4:41 PM CST

Moderator

Life is one big opportunity to make errors. But we sure try not to make mistakes with our semps.
Name: Melissa Hopper
St. Helens, Or (Zone 8a)
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MelissaHopper
Sep 7, 2018 8:39 AM CST
I now have a total of 10 NOIDS in my semp family. Half of them came from Youngs. I am wondering if I should be letting them know about this? Seems to me like they need to do some work on that.
Name: Christie
43016 (Zone 6b)
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cwhitt
Sep 7, 2018 9:01 AM CST
gg5 said:Melissa yep!! Thumbs down Kevin glad you did that! If nurseries are getting their stock from other than the hybridizer, then yes easy to be wrong (and most are getting from sources other than hybridizers) I think also it is easy for these plants to get mixed in if the nursery isn't careful with separating stock plants. And also when they pull the order it is easy to make errors there too! D'Oh!
I tip my hat to you.

I have a lot of Amaryllis, and we have that same problem - big time. Bulbs go through about 6 different people when shipping, and if any of them make one mistake, then your order will be wrong. They are also shipped in bulb form when dormant, so since there is no actual flower to look at, that is another time when mistakes can be made. I think the same could apply to semps, as many of them turn plain green at certain times in the season. Even if the nursery has the best intentions, mistakes can be made.

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