Views: 716, Replies: 9 » Jump to the end
Name: Nevada_Mike
Clark County, NV (Zone 9a)
Sempervivums Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Xeriscape Region: Southwest Gardening Cactus and Succulents
Nevada_Mike
Nov 12, 2016 4:48 PM CST
What is the difference between Aloe juvenna and Aloe zanzibarica?
Name: Daisy I
Reno, Nv (Zone 6b)
Not all who wander are lost
Garden Sages Plant Identifier
Image
DaisyI
Nov 12, 2016 7:11 PM CST
Aloe zanzibarica is a synonym for Aloe juvenna. But just to confuse you, Aloe Zanzibarica is also a synonym for Aloe squarrosa. Smiling
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming...."WOW What a Ride!!" -Mark Frost

Webmaster: osnnv.org
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
Image
Baja_Costero
Nov 12, 2016 8:57 PM CST

Moderator

I think this double synonymy is actually a point of confusion among the general public between juvenna and squarrosa, more than anything else. The record in the botanical literature (according to Aloes 2011 book) looks like this.

Aloe squarrosa = Aloe zanzibarica (obsolete) = Aloe concinna (obsolete)

Aloe zanzibarica Milne-Redhead was the replacement name for Aloe concinna (an invalid name) but in 1969 this plant was reduced to synonymy with Aloe squarrosa Baker (from Socotra). The original plant collected by Kirk from Arab traders was apparently not from Zanzibar but from the island of Socotra.

Now juvenna, a different plant from a different place, got into this mess not by any particular relationship to the above species, but because it is a lookalike for squarrosa, a much rarer and slower plant. If you see an aloe and aren't sure which of the two it might be, it's almost certainly juvenna. You kind of have to go out of your way to find squarrosa.

But because it's so common in cultivation, and so unfailingly prolific in the garden, juvenna (from Kenya and Tanzania) seems to have taken over the crown of Aloe zanzibarica in the public eye, at least on the interwebs. There's a page of so-called Zanzibar aloes here for example of which none are from Zanzibar and only 1 maybe is squarrosa. The rest are juvenna.



In the end zanzibarica is nothing but a historical artifact, best set aside in favor of the name Aloe squarrosa. But your plant is probably juvenna.

Hope that's clear!
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Nov 12, 2016 10:24 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1317606 (3)
Name: Nevada_Mike
Clark County, NV (Zone 9a)
Sempervivums Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Xeriscape Region: Southwest Gardening Cactus and Succulents
Nevada_Mike
Nov 12, 2016 10:15 PM CST
Now I am really confused. According to wikipedia, succulent-plant.com, and many other sites, Aloe squarrosa (smooth, spotted leaves that curve backwards) is distinctively different from Aloe zanzibarica (shorter, non-recurved triangular leaves) which I am now led to believe is the same as Aloe juvenna.
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
Image
Baja_Costero
Nov 12, 2016 10:34 PM CST

Moderator

Yeah that's what you'll find out there. I'd believe the book. They do lay out the entire story (as I presented it). Aloe zanzibarica was the one with the recurved leaves, now known as squarrosa.

Aloe juvenna (triangular leaves) was also known from cultivated material before its origin was determined. But it was found growing in a different place, on the west side of the Rift Valley in east Africa. Again not Zanzibar. Not even an island. That plant was named by Brandham and Carter, the same Susan Carter whose name appears on the Aloes book.

The original confusion that led to the naming of zanzibarica back in the day was when its origin was mislabeled in cultivation, very early on. That got corrected when the same plant (squarrosa) was rediscovered growing on limestone cliffs in western Socotra by John Lavranos, another author of the same book. They discuss zanzibarica twice in the history section, once about who collected it and once about the Socotra connection. Like I said, pretty much the whole story.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Nov 12, 2016 11:38 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1317642 (5)
Name: Nevada_Mike
Clark County, NV (Zone 9a)
Sempervivums Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Xeriscape Region: Southwest Gardening Cactus and Succulents
Nevada_Mike
Nov 13, 2016 9:55 AM CST
Based on the book that you cited, my plant was mislabeled as Aloe zanzibarica. It is in fact an Aloe juvenna plant. I am glad that that is settled. Thank you for your clarification.
Name: Nevada_Mike
Clark County, NV (Zone 9a)
Sempervivums Enjoys or suffers hot summers Hummingbirder Xeriscape Region: Southwest Gardening Cactus and Succulents
Nevada_Mike
Nov 13, 2016 10:43 AM CST
Follow up on previous posts. I am now including a photo of my aloe (juvenna?) plant.


Thumb of 2016-11-13/Nevada_Mike/8169b5

Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
Image
Baja_Costero
Nov 13, 2016 12:08 PM CST

Moderator

Very nice! Thumbs up

And now maybe I'll do some cleanup in the plant database. Smiling
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Nov 13, 2016 12:38 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1317847 (8)
Name: 'CareBear'

Sempervivums Hostas Dog Lover Irises Amaryllis Cactus and Succulents
Region: Pennsylvania
Image
Stush2019
Nov 19, 2016 9:26 AM CST
Baja, Now add some more confusion to the mix. How's Aloe Minne Belle come in? Cultivar from Aloe juvenna? Just wanted your thoughts. And thanks for all the info.
Thumb of 2016-11-19/Stush2019/4ccff4

Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
Image
Baja_Costero
Nov 19, 2016 3:24 PM CST

Moderator

I'm guessing that's a juvenna hybrid but have no actual knowledge on the subject. Smiling The leaves are longer and narrower than you would normally see on juvenna but it sure does look related.

« Garden.org Homepage
« Back to the top
« Forums List
« Cactus and Tender Succulents forum
Only the members of the Members group may reply to this thread.

Member Login:

Username:

Password:

[ Join now ]

Today's site banner is by wilmarosebud and is called "Portulaca Rio™ Scarlet"