Steve812 said:RpR,There is no such thing as a truly reliably cold hard Hybrid Tea rose.
Which hybrid tea roses will you plant that are reliably cold hardy to zone 3b? I garden in zone 7b and can count on one hand the Hybrid Tea roses I've found reliably resistant to our freeze-thaw cycling - though I will admit there are tens of thousands I've not tried.
I have very much enjoyed browsing their online catalog, but the one order I placed with Regan arrived in the middle of a blizzard. I tried to keep the roses cool and moist until I could work the ground, but all perished. And it was a big order. Similar problem with Garden Valley Ranch who shipped my roses in January.
RpR said:There is no such thing as a truly reliably cold hard Hybrid Tea rose.
When I was paying three to nine bucks for roses that still had price tags of fifteen to twenty some dollars it was a crap shoot and gave me a reason to go buy a new rose in the spring.
Losing a rose is an opportunity to imagine how the next one will do in the garden. I really understand that! Nearly every rose is better before I buy it than after; better before planting than after; better before blooming than after. Sometimes, though, they surprise in the other direction.
Thanks for all the details on keeping HTs through the winter. I guess I need to give that a little more consideration. It sounds like you prune them in prep for winter insulation with leaves and earth. How short to you prune them? Are your hills of leaves head high?
I'm quite sure that I don't give roses the kind of lavish care that they woud need to go from knee height to full-production height in even a moderately long season. I'm trying to remember whether I've ever seen roses that would warrant the extra work. Maybe.
Being very lazy I was, of course, hoping for a short list of HT roses that were beautiful, fragrant, and would bloom straight through winter in Duluth.
The new growth you are seeing in February is not really because the sap is running from the root zone. The ambient air temps are right and the light is better and this signals the plant to put on new growth, but the soil has not warmed up yet. Plants not being sentient beings, don't take all factors into consideration. The new growth you are seeing is fed by the starches stored in the canes of the HTs and other modern roses, which will soon poop out. It is not being stimulated by activity in the root zone of the plant. ----I will disagree with the ambient temp. part because when I pull my buried roses out of the ground they have sprouted new growth often three or more inches long, when I have left them buried weeks longer than the norm for time reasons.
The ground is cold, and as I stick my hands in it, COLD is the correct term.
When I have done this and a hard frost hits, the is when roses have died. When it gets simply into the twenties, the roses often simply sit and do not grow, nor die for up to a month, regardless of air temp.
Up here the term shock is often used, whether correct or not, that is how they act.
This can happen after they have been up and growing for over a week.
A hard frost is considered 4 consecutive hours of temps of 25F or lower ... which is considered a "killing frost". A light frost is below freezing to 26F. You can find your last hard frost date on the net. I also have light frost through May, but my last hard frost date is mid-March.---- As I said above, I have dealt with roses that have been growing in spring temps. in the seventies that have been hit by freezing temp. from simple freezing to twenties.
Any one who uses a time/cold scale and has to deal with hard frosts, will learn the hard way there IS NO RULE that is accurate.
You cannot tell a killing frost from a shocking frost, till many days later the rose that you hope was shocked starts dying.
Now up here, and this is a crap shoot, on occasion the rose will come back from the union, but more often than not that rose will never be as good as it once was.
As I once had a lot more roses, and time for them, I have left them sit after starting to pull them and find the roots were still viable.
As I said, on occasion God will smile on you and that rose but unless you have time and patience do not bet on it.
In the normal course of events, it takes a rose roots first before they put on their top growth. In my garden, it takes a rose about four years a minimum of three years to begin to reach maturity. It depends on the rose. Roses like to grow their before it is no longer a juvenile rose. ---- I find this interesting as with the exception of potted roses, which die regardless of care it seems, with bare root roses only once have I ever simply lost a rose that was newly planted, and I have had some that were not much more than a twig with a root.
As I said earlier uncovering before the last hard frost was truly past, or simply being a putz, I actually never thought stepping on a rose was the kiss of death, but it is, has been the main reason bare root roses went belly-up.
The only disease I know that actually killed several of my/mom's old roses was a root disease that dealt with for years before I figured enough was enough and pulled them, but they were very old roses and had, had it for quite some time.
Black Spot has never killed any of my roses, as I treat them and I pull the leaves and wash them down as soon as I see it.
New roses infested has been where the majority of my black spot problems have come from.
I've had three days of 20F weather on April 23, 24, and 25 five or six years ago. It killed quite a few roses. There's a strong correlation between roses that have a reputation for being cold hardy through "hard freezes" and those that tolerate the phenomenon I refer to; but the simple condition of the temperature falling below X degrees for Y hours is not what I'm talking about.
We have lots of days where it's 60, 70, or even 80 degrees in February, March, and April. And because of the altitude, thin air, and low humidity, it is very common for the temperature to drop 30 or 40 degrees at night in those same months. For two months straight it might dip to 26 to 30 every night for after being around 75 during the day. Great weather for gardening not so great for the plants in them. There are very few places in the lower 48 states where the temperature crosses the freezing point more often than here. The conditions that make daily frosts common, make it common for long
In a private e-mail one kind reader of this forum living in Toledo suggested I trim a hybrid tea rose to waist height, invert a cheap plastic trash can over it, fill it with a loose, insulating material such as mulch, and pin it to the ground with landscape staples so it does not blow away in the wind. How to fill it? Cut the bottom most of the way off, but not quite. I love the idea. It probably wouldn't happen anywhere else, but I worry about the plant overheating and 'cooking' in the very bright winter AZ sun. Maybe I'll try cutting the bottom clean off the trash can. The light frosts rarely penetrate the mulch by two inches.
Of the following roses which five should I do this with next winter: Secret, New Zealand, Neil Diamond, Stephen's Big Purple, Moonstone, Papa Meilland, Elina, Sedona, Fire Fighter, Ingrid Bergman? I welcome suggestions.