Cactus and Tender Succulents forum: Aeonium Haworthii Variegata Cut

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France
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quenta
Feb 7, 2017 3:28 PM CST
Hi all :)

I've got last week an Aeonium Haworthii Variegata, and there are several trunks and heads. Some heads are a little hidden by others, and I wonder if I should cut some to propagate them ?

I'm not asking that for the appearance, I like the little jungle Smiling But I wonder if it may cause the plant to die if too much heads stay "out of breath", maybe it would get too big in pot ? Or should I let the nature do ?

When I got it last week, one little branch with a rosette was broken, so in despair I took it and i'm trying to propagate it... I'm not really good with plants usually, but let's hope Smiling

So now, I wonder about the trapped heads ? I know it's not the propagation recommanded period...

Thanx for any advices :)


Thumb of 2017-02-07/quenta/33c307

Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 3:47 PM CST
You can cut off the heads, just callus it a bit before you plant it back in a well draining media. I usually do that now with my Aeoniums, but I do it in mid Fall, so that we are entering the cool down weather. It grows more actively here during our cooler months, late Fall to mid Spring.

The remaining part of the cut-off stem can still grow new rosettes.

These are my Aeonium arboreum, similar growth habits as your A. kiwi:

Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/904ae3

Have grown quite leggy, so when there is quite strong winds and lots of rainfall as we do now, it bends or breaks, so I end up cutting them down to smaller segments, callus the new cuttings and I end up with more. Just try to keep it cool and dry as much as possible, so it will not have undue rotting, since cuttings have no roots yet to drink water.

Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/7302cb Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/cde75f

Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/c36d45

[Last edited by tarev - Feb 7, 2017 3:50 PM (+)]
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Name: Baja
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Baja_Costero
Feb 7, 2017 3:49 PM CST

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Actually winter is a great season for propagating Aeoniums (now, in the northern hemisphere), if you can provide a warm, bright place. They slow way down in summer (the worst propagation season) and wake back up in the fall (my preferred time).

Given time and space, your plant will grow many, many heads. You can experiment now or wait until it's bigger. My usual Aeonium propagation starts with a rosette attached to maybe 1cm of naked stem. More stem is not better. Less may be worse. Make a clean cut. The fastest rooting and best results will take place with bigger (full size) rosettes. Put the stem into the soil and water like you normally would, and eventually (weeks usually) it will sprout roots and take off. These plants are among the easiest succulents to propagate, especially if they branch a lot (like your plant) and you do it at the right time of year.

You can expect your plant to have dramatically different behavior depending on the size of the pot. When Aeoniums are in small pots, they slow to a crawl and basically stop getting much bigger. That may be desirable in some cases. When you let one stretch out, which I try to do in a stepwise, controlled way, the plant will reach a different size, and tend to branch more. You could try a bigger pot, if you didn't already up the size when you got the plant. The best time here to repot these plants is when they are in active growth in fall and winter.

I have had bad experiences with Aeoniums in unglazed clay pots, and the book I mentioned in the other thread confirms I'm not alone. For whatever reason, maybe because the soil inside dries out so much faster than a regular plastic pot, they don't tend to do so well in that type of container. You may want to consider this when you next repot.
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Feb 7, 2017 4:26 PM (+)]
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France
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quenta
Feb 7, 2017 4:19 PM CST
Ooh they're beautiful Tarev :D They seem tp have a great life conditions :)

I'm in apartement, so it will remain inside... I put it next a window (not too much next tho) to give the more light I can.
It's about 20 or 21°C, a little dry. Do you think guys in those conditions seasons still matter ?

If I decide to let it like that, will the hidden heads die because getting less space and less light ?

Maybe the wisest decision is to see if my first propagation works ... If it doesn't, I may hesitate to destroy the plant Sad If it works, I'll use plastic pots, I prefer to put every chances on my side Rolling my eyes.

I forgot to ask, I read I need to wait 3 or 5 weeks before giving water to the propagation ?
[Last edited by quenta - Feb 7, 2017 4:22 PM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Feb 7, 2017 4:38 PM CST

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Even inside, I would think that both day length and the relative strength of sunlight are sufficient to let the plant know what season it is.

Here is a branchy Aeonium which occupies a pair of 8-inch (20cm) pots in there and has now taken over its wooden stand with very little effort on my part (once a year I remove the dead flower stalks). Those tiles are 1 foot (30cm) wide, so you have some idea of the scale.

Thumb of 2017-02-07/Baja_Costero/a262af Thumb of 2017-02-07/Baja_Costero/f39eda
Thumb of 2017-02-07/Baja_Costero/37030e Thumb of 2017-02-07/Baja_Costero/1d037d

As for the heads underneath, shaded by the rest of the plant, they may die off or they may continue and grow longer in an attempt to squeeze through. Eventually the longest stems flower (second set of pictures) and end there. The plant is very good at figuring out how to keep a full set of rosettes, given the balance between generation and decay.

I would wait a couple of days to a week to water an Aeonium cutting, depending on the width of the stem. Yours are pretty skinny so I wouldn't see any benefit in waiting longer than a week.
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 4:41 PM CST
Quenta, just experiment first with one or two. That way you have back-up remaining. Your temps are okay actually, and dry is good for now.

We have varying micro climates, and in our area this Aeoniums really go semi-dormant during the hot and dry summer months. You will see the Aeonium, slowly dropping its long winter leaves and remains with a tighter rosette. When it starts to show like that, it has gone dormant. But you may have better conditions than we do, since we really go very hot here in the triple digit and higher and so dry, very dismal humidity levels.

I have no problems with glazed or clay containers here. I guess it just varies due to our varying growing conditions. I only grow them in containers here but all outdoors, so far they are okay. I don't know if it rains more in your area, if it does, do make sure you are using very well draining media, add lots of pumice or perlite, so the stems and roots will not rot.

Just a sample how they look like when seasons change from cold to hot:
Taken on 09Feb2016, leaves of the rosettes are longer, and this type of Aeonium goes on a nice color change during the cold season:
Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/44fdd5

Photo taken May 2016, temps are starting to warm up much longer, light duration getting longer too, plant changes colors to all green, and leaves are starting to grow tighter..it is heading to semi-dormancy:
Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/255069 Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/7a378b

Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Always count your blessings in life
Cat Lover Houseplants Plays in the sandbox Region: California Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all!
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 4:55 PM CST
Baja, what is the name of your branchy Aeonium?? I think that is one that I have too, and have never really known its correct name.
France
Cat Lover
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quenta
Feb 7, 2017 4:57 PM CST
Thanks to you two, your Aeoniums are very beautiful Smiling And verfy big :)

I like the fact how even same spacies, they can have very different look depending on conditions , the colors, more or less flat , etc ...

Ok, I note for about 1 week before giving normal water !

I think i'll wait to see if the little one works first, i just wonder how to see if it's working ? I guess I can wait to see if it grows, or if it dry Hilarious!

First I have to see if my Kiwiegata (I don't really know what is it, so I choose a name :drool:) is happy here, because since september, I managed to have my sedum rubrotinctum to die, tho my sedum nussbaunerianum is still good ... Let's say the score is 1-1, i'd like my Kiwiegata to be fully happy Smiling

Talking about that, is it normal some of biggest leaves at bottom are a little droopy, even in winter ?
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 4:58 PM CST
quenta, I have this other noid succulent..all this time, I just assume it may be a variegated Aeonium too, since it manifests very similar Aeonium growing habits, grown outdoors year round.
Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/777877

Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Always count your blessings in life
Cat Lover Houseplants Plays in the sandbox Region: California Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all!
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 5:00 PM CST
Yes, bottom leaves are always the first to go usually. As the leaves go, it gets a longer neck. So you see why my Aeoniums are so leggy looking too, growing leaves, dropping leaves, exposing neck as it goes.
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Always count your blessings in life
Cat Lover Houseplants Plays in the sandbox Region: California Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all!
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 5:05 PM CST
quenta, try to make your media grittier. If you got access to chicken grit (insoluble crushed granite) that will be a good top dressing as well, to keep the base part well draining and not too wet when watered. It works well across my various succulents here.

Sedum rubrotinctum and haworthia with chicken grit top dressing:
Thumb of 2017-02-07/tarev/c54296


Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Feb 7, 2017 6:39 PM CST

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Tarev, I think it may be A. decorum or a hybrid, but I really don't know.
Name: tarev
San Joaquin County, CA (Zone 9b)
Always count your blessings in life
Cat Lover Houseplants Plays in the sandbox Region: California Orchids Plant Lover: Loves 'em all!
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tarev
Feb 7, 2017 7:22 PM CST
Thanks Baja, at least I saw your plant..a distant cousin! Big Grin
France
Cat Lover
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quenta
Feb 10, 2017 9:57 AM CST
The A.decorum is nice too Smiling So much great species, makes me want to have a garden Rolling my eyes.

I'm wondering something about aeonium, what is the difference between overwatering symptoms and underwatering symptoms ? I want to stay vigilant on this plant, and any dry or falling leaf makes me panicking Grumbling
Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Feb 10, 2017 8:44 PM CST

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Then summer might be rough on you then. Smiling The differences from winter to summer are not terribly unlike what you would see from underwatering: lower leaves fall, rosettes become smaller and tend to close up on themselves. If you didn't know in advance the annual cycle of the plant, you might think summer shriveling was a sign the plant needed more water. The same kind of look can also be characteristic of chronic underpotting (when the plant really wants a bigger pot). So it's not all that specific in the end.

As long as you exercise restraint with the water (wait until the soil is going dry, more or less) then you don't need to worry too much about the details... these plants are pretty forgiving of neglect. Try to be regular about it (given moderate temperatures and good light) and you'll develop a better sense of what's happening over time, so you can make little adjustments as necessary.
France
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quenta
Feb 11, 2017 4:19 AM CST
ouch it's gonna be rough you're right Grumbling

Indeed, I had one kiwi last september that came with brown spots... The guy who sent it to me (by internet, didn't find one at that time) told me it was due to transport, and that the leaves with the spots would fall, and new one will come. Was true, except the new ones came with spots too :/ The plant ended to die, but I wonder now If i didn't underwater her too ... I did it once per week, but as it's warm and kinda dry in my flat, it may need to water more ...

Now as my new plant is loosing some bottom leaves (droppy then drying), i'm very vigilant (and worrid Sad )

Maybe once every 4 days could be a better rythm, if the soil is dry ... I water my sedum nussbaumerianum once a week with few water and it's ok so far since september. As I read thinner leaves means more water than thicker, and seeing my kiwiegata is bigger, could be logical ... don't you think ?

Of course, you noticed I don't know anything about plants Green Grin!
[Last edited by quenta - Feb 11, 2017 4:44 AM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
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Baja_Costero
Feb 11, 2017 3:46 PM CST

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Your curiosity means the knowledge is inevitable. Thumbs up If you want to see how much your plants are drinking, one way to find out is to use a squirt bottle (like for cycling or sports) and because the flow rate is so even, you can actually measure the water needed to saturate the soil just by counting off the seconds. The Aeoniums are pretty heavy drinkers here this time of year.

Compare these two pictures of the same plant and you have some idea of the effects of season and drought on Aeoniums. First was taken the first day of fall (maximum dormancy), second was taken a few days ago (maximum awakeness).

Thumb of 2017-02-11/Baja_Costero/3e6c1d
[Last edited by Baja_Costero - Feb 11, 2017 3:55 PM (+)]
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France
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quenta
Feb 12, 2017 4:53 PM CST
Yes, I will finish by know those plants more, i'm just trying not to loose it for that Crossing Fingers!

I'm just wondering, how can I make difference between leaves falling naturally from leaves falling because underwatered ? On the photo below, I understand those falling leaves as underwatering, do you think i'm good ?

And do you say all soil must be soaked entirely ? So I can put water until the plate under the pot ramains with water (not drinked anymore) and empty it ?


Thumb of 2017-02-12/quenta/f990ce

[Last edited by quenta - Feb 12, 2017 5:02 PM (+)]
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Name: Baja
Baja California (Zone 11b)
Cactus and Succulents Seed Starter Foliage Fan Xeriscape Container Gardener Hummingbirder
Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Region: Mexico Plant Identifier Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator
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Baja_Costero
Feb 12, 2017 7:53 PM CST

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That looks pretty normal to me, or at least within a safe range of normal. My point earlier was that watching the leaves fall like that is often not so informative about the watering situation.

Yes, if you are putting water in the top and it comes out the bottom, perfect, and then empty the plate so the pot does not sit in a lake afterwards. You may find it helpful to water twice. The first time (maybe about half the total water) you give the dry soil a chance to become moist. Wait 5-10 minutes and then it can absorb the rest of the water more effectively.
France
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quenta
Feb 13, 2017 1:45 AM CST
Thanks for all your information Smiling I'll stay vigilant, but it helps a lot to have feedback and advice :)

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