Roses forum: Mild winter not always good for normally tough bush roses

Page 1 of 4 • 1 2 3 4
Views: 2764, Replies: 75 » Jump to the end
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Apr 25, 2017 10:32 AM CST
I was down by my south roses garden, I have not uncovered the tea roses yet and checked three years old bush roses growing on the south side of the garage.
This mild winter, lack of snow cover looks to have possibly killed one of the three and the other two are alive but I will be cutting down the bushes too about two feet off of the ground as that is only how high the green canes are green.

Last winter , which was technically harder and colder but with more snow, I did not have to do anything but trim out the few canes that were belly-up.
I hate mild semi-dry winters, always have and always will.
Name: Lilli
Copenhagen, Denmark, EU
Irises Roses Bulbs Hellebores Foliage Fan Cottage Gardener
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Seed Starter Winter Sowing Bee Lover Dog Lover Region: Europe
Image
IrisLilli
Apr 26, 2017 3:59 AM CST
It's always sad to lose a rose.
The same thing happens here. Seems ironic, doesn't it? Glare
You don't know if it will grow until you try!
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses Irises Lilies
Image
Steve812
May 3, 2017 10:46 AM CST
Sorry for your loss.

When you dance with nature, try not to step on her toes.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
May 4, 2017 6:11 PM CST
It ain't dead yet but I cut it down to six inches over the ground where buds were coming out.
On the other two, one is turning into two bushes as I knocked out a large chunk of dead wood and it is sending up new canes six plus inches from the original; the big one I cut down to approx. two feet and thinned out the criss-crossing canes.
All he bush roses took a real hit considering last year I did not trim them at all till June when I removed the few canes that were just taking up space.
I spent two hour trimming and cleaning up that garden yesterday.
I dug out some plant that I was not sure if it was a encroaching weed type flower or some thing I had planted but quack grass was suddenly a growing problem and I was not going to putz around and dug it and anything near it out. This way I now know anything coming up was not supposed to be there.
I had putzed with the quack grass for a couple of years but this spring it was massive.

I have not uncovered my H-Tea roses yet but intend to starting tomorrow.
I have some type of Eczema affecting my one hand and yesterday after doing the roses, on one that had almost cleared up, I had large spots of dried out skin which was splitting open.
I pulled rose thorns out of it, which is normal, the way it ached was not.
I dug dandelions out of the ground which probably did the skin no favours.
I am assuming that the allergic reaction to the roses and some thing I ate did not agree with me as after I took a hot bath my heart was pounding and I was tired to the point I did not dry myself of but just sat in a chair till I felt better.
It was only sixty degrees in the house and I did not cool off for over an hour; after I left the chair and put on some night clothes I just laid on the sofa for long time with out any covers.
I had acid reflux till near sunrise but oddly, and thank God, no gas to push it into my throat as I have had that stuff get into my airway in the past and that is pure HELL.
My esophagus finally let it out and then I fell asleep but did not get up till one PM.
[Last edited by RpR - May 8, 2017 9:30 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1433644 (4)
Name: Amanda
KC metro area, Missouri (Zone 6a)
Roses Zinnias Region: Missouri Cat Lover Dog Lover Bookworm
Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: United States of America Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
Image
pepper23
May 4, 2017 6:55 PM CST
Group hug Group hug
Long Island, NY (Zone 6b)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
MargieNY
May 4, 2017 8:49 PM CST
So sorry to hear about what must have been a frightening experience. Feel better...
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
May 5, 2017 11:59 AM CST
MargieNY said:So sorry to hear about what must have been a frightening experience. Feel better...

All I better now. Thank You!

I knew I had crossed some wires some where as I quit digging out Dandelions an hour sooner than I had to as I felt tired and I had not done any real hard physical work.
Not sure what it was but I had drank a LOT of glass bottle Chocolate milk. I am slightly allergic to milk and that combined with pulling rose thorns out continually, may just been one bad moves too many.
Add to that I let myself get out of shape worse than normal this winter, this month last year I was thirty pound lighter, it all adds up.
N. Ohio (Zone 5b)
Bookworm The WITWIT Badge Moon Gardener Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Native Plants and Wildflowers Roses
Vermiculture Frogs and Toads Birds Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge)
Tisha
May 5, 2017 7:10 PM CST
Could some of the milk have been a little off? With this being the start of the season I want to get out and GO! It`s always hard for me to pace myself; frequent breaks, lots of h2o, etc. Your roses need your TLC so take it at a good pace for you. It`s going to be a great gardening season !
My D.Austins are 36" tall. I was on my way out to remove the sleeves when I heard there`s temps in the upper 20`s on the way for three days Thumbs down . I`ve got tons of buds so I`ll just wait a few more days. Thumbs down
A farmer once told me a general rule of thumb there`s little chance of a killing frost after the last full moon in May. So far it`s been a good rule for me. Because it`s so mild this year and the moon is so late this month I`m going to remove the sleeves as soon as this little cool spell passes.
Tell us when you uncover your HT`s and how the bushes are doing/recovering.
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses Irises Lilies
Image
Steve812
May 6, 2017 8:55 AM CST
I agree that late frosts after stretches of warm, mild weather tend to do the most harm to roses, especially HT and closely related floribundas. Playboy grew without problem for me in zone 6b, NJ but I have killed two or three here in zone 7b mountains of AZ. All died immediately after a late frost in spring after leafing out. Sometimes burying the bud union two or three inches deep when planting will preserve some of the budded wood and the rose will come back, if it is already well established. Where the same problem occurrs year after year just establishing the rose is a challenge.

Good luck, and we do look forward to progress reports.
When you dance with nature, try not to step on her toes.
Name: Michele Miller
Sandusky, Michigan (Zone 5b)
Image
Michelezie
May 7, 2017 9:54 AM CST
My rose struggled this winter. I didn't cover mine because I never did before and it came back just fine. But this year it turned black and I had to cut it down to just a few inches. We had a lot of fluctuating temperatures this winter and I think it got confused. I am starting to see some growth now so I'm hoping with some fertilizer and tlc it will come back. I think I'll be covering my roses this next winter!
Name: Lilli
Copenhagen, Denmark, EU
Irises Roses Bulbs Hellebores Foliage Fan Cottage Gardener
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Seed Starter Winter Sowing Bee Lover Dog Lover Region: Europe
Image
IrisLilli
May 8, 2017 5:10 AM CST
Welcome to the Roses Forum, Michele!

Sorry to hear about the winter damage, but established roses are usually tough so hopefully it will recover! Crossing Fingers!
You don't know if it will grow until you try!
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
May 8, 2017 9:36 AM CST
I uncovered my H-Tea roses up North, and found what I was kinda-sorta expecting, and some I was not.
I pulled three, two I had replanted before I buried them; Now I knew their chances of survival were low in a good year and worse this last winter.
I really did not want them to live and therefore; I am not unhappy.
The third was still green to a point but as it was a duplicate and I do not like Pink roses, I pulled it.
I put in the three Sharon bought, --(the above also means I did not have to enlarge the garden at a time when I have a lot more hard work to do)-- from Sam's Club and after unwrapping them from their brown paper, I am not sure they were such a good price.

One looks a bit iffy but time will tell.
[Last edited by RpR - May 8, 2017 6:34 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1437267 (12)
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
May 18, 2017 2:12 PM CST
Sharon's bush roses are not all dead; I should have pulled them as they are starting from the ground, literally.
Did not really like them but it is too late now.

Burgess has six cold climate roses I have looking at for decades and I think I am finally going to buy the whole set, that way there will be no more --should I ?
I cannot put the new ones I already have in down South as weeds have really gone nuts and I am going to use vegetation killer after I pull the items worth saving -- Iris.

Some thing has gone wild, I thought it was Purple Loose Strife but the leaves do not really match .

One of the few things my brother did was to pull Loose Strife every spring but he did not show up last year till fall so they had a free ride but I do not think that is what it is.
I will let a small area bloom so I have an idea what it really is.
Where I cannot just broadcast vegetation killer I am going to do the eye-dropper type application.
Odd years as the vegetable garden has had quack grass around the edges for decades but it never really got into the garden but this year one three by three area was near solid quack grass.
I think letting the cloth and leaves on the rose area this long may have killed a lot of weeds there though as it looks like only wild violets sprouted.
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Image
RoseBlush1
May 18, 2017 4:55 PM CST
RpR said:I have some type of Eczema affecting my one hand and yesterday after doing the roses, on one that had almost cleared up, I had large spots of dried out skin which was splitting open


Rpr ... I don't know if you have heard of "Rose Thorn Disease". Your problem does not sound like you are dealing with that problem, but this is a good time to put the word out about RTD.

A friend of mine is dealing with it now. At first, her doc did not believe her self diagnosis, but finally went along with her. J is no wimp. He didn't have much choice .. Smiling They found out the only med on the market that specifically treats this fungal infection cost $1,000.00 per dose ... and it's a generic drug !

Enough of that ..

Gardeners can get the infection from other plants, but it is quite common for rose gardeners to have this problem. That's why the common name is Rose Thorn Disease.

Here's a link just to provide information:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
May 23, 2017 8:59 AM CST
RoseBlush1 said:

Rpr ... I don't know if you have heard of "Rose Thorn Disease". Your problem does not sound like you are dealing with that problem, but this is a good time to put the word out about RTD.

A friend of mine is dealing with it now. At first, her doc did not believe her self diagnosis, but finally went along with her. J is no wimp. He didn't have much choice .. Smiling They found out the only med on the market that specifically treats this fungal infection cost $1,000.00 per dose ... and it's a generic drug !

Enough of that ..

Gardeners can get the infection from other plants, but it is quite common for rose gardeners to have this problem. That's why the common name is Rose Thorn Disease.

Here's a link just to provide information:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...


Well thanks, Blinking .
Knowing that I will put on my anti-radiation tin hat, find a dark corner, go into the fetal position while going "Ohhhmmmmmmmmmm..." Shrug! I tip my hat to you.

When I am done typing this I am going to send in my order to Burgess for their supposed Sub-zero rose collection.
The ones we bought from Sam's Club, are really disappointing, at least the ones I planted.
One is still green but no buds and the ones with leaves look like they are not sure if they want to die or not.
Five I took down South, I did not get in the ground yet as I have to clear, weeds, the area they will go in but they look better than the planted ones.
I may spend the big bucks that a bag of Eucalyptus mulch costs now, as I found that if you put roses in that mulch , you can let them there for a quite a long time before planting and they actually do very well.

I have had a bad roses before. One goes belly up while the others do well but never the whole lot of them so mediocre.
Crap like this is why I loath and rarely waste time on potted roses now.
I replanted them in new super-duper soil, and two of the three are lat least are at least in a not getting worse mode but just looking at the roots on the really bad one, I think I am wasting time not pulling it out.
Could be the weather but the ones I uncovered , while not going gang busters, are putting out new buds.

When the Burgess arrive, without a miracle, the one will become grilling wood.

Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses Irises Lilies
Image
Steve812
May 23, 2017 7:37 PM CST
The high-centered hybrid tea form is what hooked me on roses. And I fall for that idealized version of the rose over and over. That said, sometimes there are other roses that are worthy of consideration.

Northland Rosarium has a number of Canadian Explorer roses http://www.northlandrosarium.c... And some of the roses they list have some fragrance.

They also have a good collection of Griffith Buck roses. They might not all be completely cold hardy to zone 3, but they should tolerate hard freezes better than most hybrid tea roses. Northland has a Buck collection.

High Country Roses has a lot of species and old roses that are reliably hardy to zone 5 or better. Again, they really ought to do better. You might check out their rugosa collection if you are looking for fragrance or hips http://www.highcountryroses.co...

Antique Roses has some old roses worthy of consideration. Of special interest would be the albas http://www.antiqueroses.com/ne... Celestial, Queen of Denmark, Hippolyte, Complicata. I grew Queen of Denmark in NJ and was very pleased with it. I grew Complicata and it grew quickly to 10 feet in every direction in full shade. And it bloomed there, too.

I know this is not what you've been aiming at, but if you are interested in roses with less hassle, I would hope you'd find these ideas worth considering.
When you dance with nature, try not to step on her toes.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Jun 2, 2017 10:40 PM CST
It might, probably is, the cold weather we had but after I uncovered my roses most looked green and healthy, with new sprouts etc.
Now I will have to cut back the canes on about half, as they partially went black and on some the sprouts died and they are acting like they are not sure if they want to keep on living.
They have all been treated the same but some are going gang busters and some are just sitting there.
The ones we bought from Sam's are pathetic.
Now they were not impressive when I took them out of the tube but the same ones I took down south, they are sitting in a bucket waiting to planted yet, are doing just fine, actually growing. Those planted up north look like a failed suicide.
All I give the ones down south is Schultz root building liquid and water on occasion.
Same thing I give the planted ones.
I put some Just Natural Raised Bed Soil with Worm Castings in hole when I planted and maybe that was not a good idea but before that I just put them in with good soil and they they started to wilt. After the Just Natural they at least have kept the few leaves on green but not much else.
As I said the cold weather, especially near freezing probably did not help but as some old roses also are just sitting there while some are taking off, it makes me wonder.
[Last edited by RpR - Jun 6, 2017 10:51 AM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1463246 (17)
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Jun 6, 2017 11:22 AM CST
We have a now city garden called Munsinger's, it used to be owned by the late Mr. Munsinger who created it so his ill wife could look out the window and view the roses she loved so much after she was wheel-chair bound.
I spoke with a gentleman who was doing weeding and I found out is one of the employees, used to be volunteer help, who cares for the garden.
He told me they are not allowed to used any treatments for the roses, period, so all they can do is pick off bad leaves and weed.
As I was there he showed me the sawfly problem they had and squished a larva with his fingers.
They suffer massive loses every year. He told me all they can do is plant new plants.---- This answered a question I had wondered about as I noticed that in the past few years that roses with large diameter canes, showing age, were getting to be fewer and fewer. Most roses had the scrubby look of younger roses.
They have a second rose bed with roses with numbers as they have a connection to a rose society for growing new rose types.
It was clean, weed free five years ago now it looks like they are also growing new type of weeds.

The gardens have more than just roses. I have been going there for decades and it seems that after Mr. Munsinger died a few years ago, even though it was volunteer help that grumbled about being under manned then, it has gone to hell .
Mr. Munsinger would gladly spend money to take care of the roses, except paid employees, but they had good winter care being covered with rice hulls.
This year I saw no rice hulls on the ground as I have in the past. A worker there some years back said they were expensive and I doubt the city would put the money out.
It is now the combined Munsinger - Clemens garden. -- (Clemens , city run for decades,) --- Clemens garden is down on the river tech. across the street, but now they are both cared for by the same entity.

Fifteen years ago I spoke to a worker at each, then separate garden, and the city owned one spoke of being undermanned.
The weeds I saw this year, if they had fifty people working there instead of five , weeding by hand would take month to do a fair job.
I cannot really give any idea of what this garden is like as it has old sections and new ones but he old one with hostas and trees a hundred years old was weed free ten years ago, now what was brown mulch is green weeds with dandelions flower stems two feet long along the edge.

I told a girl staff member who was planting in an annual area, they keep weeds down by roto-tilling, that the fellow over in the roses said they should all come over and help him.
She laughed and said "I believe you."
Of the five staff working the garden, three were planting annuals, one was mowing lawn and one was working the large rose garden.
I probably should have put this in the grumpy section but after seeing what that poor fellow working in that hot rose garden has to deal with, my problems are teeny-tiny little whines.
The area the rose gent was working was, hot clay paving stones that made up the path ways, and black dirt the roses were planted in. I could feel the heat radiating off of the bricks and black ground.
I told the gent that what atmosphere in that area reminded me of when I was laying paver stones on a hot day surrounded by hot bricks and crushed granite; he said that when the temps. hit the nineties it was pure hell working that garden.
The worst thing I saw was THISTLES were infesting many areas of the garden. Roto-tilling them under makes it worse and pulling them out is a waste of time.
[Last edited by RpR - Jun 6, 2017 12:01 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #1466695 (18)
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Jun 6, 2017 12:46 PM CST
Sharon took the one rose, so far, that went belly-up which she bought at Sam's club and they gave her , her money back.
When she was there, there was a woman ahead of her , doing the same thing.
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses Irises Lilies
Image
Steve812
Jun 6, 2017 2:40 PM CST
The power of mulch - organic material laid down two inches at a time 'round about the last frost - cannot be overstated. And the power of planting roses that are well suited to an area. Most of the weeding in my garden is achieved in a twenty-hour-a-year stretch when the mulch goes down. I even have it done at the wrong time of year, late summer just before the weeds go to seed. But over the course of seven years the number of volunteer plants in the garden has plummeted by probably 95 to 98 percent. When I water, I will occasionally spot a weed and pull it up. Thistles, unless they are very young are always a problem because they generally break rather than allowing the roots to come up. Break out the paintbrushes and glysophate.

When I lived in zone 6b I tried to bury the root union two or three inches below ground level. I try to remember to do this here; but sometimes it does not work. If one is piling mulch to six or twelve inches deep in order to preserve a Zone 5a hardy HT in zone 4, that extra three inches can sometimes make a huge difference. A rose with a huge and robust root system can freeze to the ground and come back the next year much more vigorously than a newly planted rose.
When you dance with nature, try not to step on her toes.

Page 1 of 4 • 1 2 3 4

« Garden.org Homepage
« Back to the top
« Forums List
« Roses forum
Only the members of the Members group may reply to this thread.

Member Login:

Username:

Password:

[ Join now ]

Today's site banner is by Marilyn and is called "Crocosmia 'Lucifer'"