Daylilies forum: Pardon Me - Diurnal or Nocturnal

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Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Jun 28, 2017 3:24 AM CST
Hi everyone,
as @sooby and @Dnd may remember the past summer I was gifted with a couple of fans of Pardon Me from the italian hybridizer I buy from.

The question was, is Pardon Me nocturnal or diurnal? Is registered as a nocturnal, the hybridizer always said it's diurnal. Now it's blooming for the first time in my garden, and it's clearly a diurnal.
Blooms at midnight are close and I find them open in the morning, they stay so all the day long.

Could a plant change its habit in a such way due to environmental conditions, or it's not what it's supposed to be? I'm going to add a picture.

Thumb of 2017-06-28/cybersix/5ad390

Thanks in advance!


Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallis.info
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jun 28, 2017 4:12 AM CST
I don't know what triggers the time the flowers start to open. Presumably it could vary depending on what tells them it is time. Perhaps @admmad can answer the question. I guess the other question is whether it is part of the original 'Pardon Me' and not a seedling or lookalike, but it does look like 'Pardon Me' allowing for camera differences in colour.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jun 28, 2017 5:07 AM CST
I did find this in a scientific journal, not specifically for daylilies:

".......Opening and closure in several other species is regulated by changes in light intensity and, in some species with nocturnal opening, by an increase in relative humidity. A minimum duration of darkness and light are usually required for opening and closure, respectively, in flowers that open during the day. Both phytochrome and a blue light receptor seem involved in light perception. In some species, opening and closure are regulated by an endogenous rhythm, which, in all cases investigated, can be reset by changes from dark to light and/or light to dark........ complex control by endogenous and exogenous factors sets flower opening and closure apart from most other growth processes."

From: van Doorn, Wouter G., and Uulke van Meeteren. "Flower opening and closure: a review." Journal of experimental botany 54.389 (2003): 1801-1812.

https://academic.oup.com/jxb/a...

So maybe we need to look at differences in relative humidity and daylength, edited to add latitude for light intensity. There looks to be a significant difference in latitude between Brescia and New Jersey where the plant was presumably hybridized.

'Pardon Me' is not even close to flowering here yet.

[Last edited by sooby - Jun 28, 2017 5:10 AM (+)]
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Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Jun 28, 2017 5:27 AM CST
Thanks Sue, yes there's difference in latitude I never knew this could change behaviour so much. The hybrider always said it's diurnal, and he's more south than me.
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallis.info
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jun 28, 2017 5:40 AM CST
I seem to remember when I checked it last year it was open before it got light but I don't know when it started to open (I don't have access to the plant in the evening, it's at another location). My latitude would be somewhat north of New Jersey so a small amount closer to you. You will have a longer length of day in summer because of your latitude so perhaps it is triggered by lowering light intensity and it takes longer to lower there because of the longer days? Maurice may have some ideas on this, it's an interesting question.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jun 28, 2017 5:53 AM CST
I looked at some UK web sites that offer 'Pardon Me' because their latitude is even more northerly than yours, Sabrina. I didn't find anything about flower opening time so far but I did find at least one site that listed it as evergreen. Was it evergreen for you last winter, Sabrina?
Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Jun 28, 2017 7:15 AM CST
Yes, it was evergreen.
I found some italian sites not mentioning a nocturnal behaviour
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallis.info
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Jun 28, 2017 7:22 AM CST
Interesting, thank you. There seem to be quite a number of daylilies that switch from evergreen to deciduous/dormant or vice versa depending on where they are grown. Since Dr. Apps registered it as "dormant" it presumably was not because the foliage froze off.
Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Jun 28, 2017 7:45 AM CST
As I said in another post many deciduos/dormants are at least SEV here. Nowadays we don't have much days of freeze in winters, and we have very hot and dry summers. Maybe we are transforming in another climate zone with less cold, so plants don't go dormant. Everything anticipated this year, blooming at least one week before than the past year.
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallis.info
Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
Image
cybersix
Jun 28, 2017 9:27 AM CST
It seems it's already going to rebloom too
Thumb of 2017-06-28/cybersix/15c4eb

Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallis.info
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
Image
sooby
Jun 28, 2017 11:13 AM CST
cybersix said:As I said in another post many deciduos/dormants are at least SEV here. Nowadays we don't have much days of freeze in winters, and we have very hot and dry summers. Maybe we are transforming in another climate zone with less cold, so plants don't go dormant. Everything anticipated this year, blooming at least one week before than the past year.


What was interesting about this is that in another thread we were talking about evergreens from warm climates setting dormant buds for winter in colder climates. So it appears they switch behaviour. We would therefore expect the reverse to happen, a cultivar registered as dormant in a cold climate would behave as an evergreen in a warmer climate. What this implies is that foliage type is not necessarily "fixed". There are other plants where this has actually be shown to happen, they change behaviour depending on where they are grown.


annpots
Jul 21, 2017 2:41 PM CST
Hi everyone,
Nocturnals are an interesting subject. They do not all start blooming at the same time. It sounds like Pardon Me is an extended bloom, early morning opener(emo). Emo's start anytime after 4a.m. Rosemary Whitacre wrote an interesting article on nocturnals some time ago.
Name: Dnd
SE Michigan (Zone 6a)
Dog Lover Daylilies Organic Gardener Houseplants Celebrating Gardening: 2015 I helped beta test the first seed swap
Garden Ideas: Level 2
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DogsNDaylilies
Jul 21, 2017 7:21 PM CST
Sabrina, I am sorry, I am just now seeing this! I think you might have tagged my nickname instead of my user name Big Grin

Pardon Me is in bloom here and the first bloom seemed to be nocturnal, for sure, but I have only had 3 blooms so far and I didn't pay attention to the last two. I will say this, though, there is one that is looking like it ought to be open tomorrow, but hasn't started to open yet (and it is 9pm here)... So maybe it is only occasionally nocturnal?... Hilarious!

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