Daylilies forum: "Lining Out"...Can Someone Explain This Process to Me Please...

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Name: Amber
Missouri (Zone 6a)
Daylilies Region: Missouri Garden Photography
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amberjewel
Jul 15, 2017 1:48 PM CST
I have heard the term "lining out" used on here and by several daylily farms. Can someone please explain this process to me? I have a general idea that it involves digging up a big clump, dividing it into double fans, and then "lining out" the double fans in a row. Is that right? When is the best time of year to do this? After they are lined out, how soon could they be dug again and delivered to customers? My father-in-law has his small, local daylily farm and I am wondering if lining out some of his more popular sellers will make the fall delivery process a little more efficient... Shrug!
Amber
Daylily Novice
Name: Diana
Lincoln, NE (Zone 5b)
Daylilies Region: Nebraska Organic Gardener Dog Lover Bookworm
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ShakespearesGarden
Jul 15, 2017 2:26 PM CST
Amber, I'm glad you asked about lining out. My assumptions are the same and I'd be happy to get educated on the topic...
Scout's motto: Be Prepared...
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Composter Garden Photography Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Region: Alabama
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Seedfork
Jul 15, 2017 2:57 PM CST
That is the general process, but I'll bet there are dozens of different ways of doing it. I feel sure that some growers actually "line out" their plants in pots. That way come spring time they are potted up and ready to sell. I did find out this year that often (it may be the accepted practice, not sure), that if a plant is lined out and produces new fans those fans are often included with the purchase of "two fans". I thought that was nice. So if a grower lines out 10 double fans and each of those fans multiples at a different rate, a buyer might get two, three, or more fans. The good thing about that is that if you order really early and the order is confirmed when it is only two fans, when your order is filled you get what has increased from those two fans also. I doubt all sellers do it that way, but it is nice when it happens.
I think the normal practice is to sell blooming sized plants, so if the plants are lined out by the time they are sold they should be blooming sized, and that I would think could be one to two seasons depending on if the plants are growing indoors, outside, in a warm or cold climate, if they fertilize etc.
[Last edited by Seedfork - Jul 15, 2017 3:00 PM (+)]
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Name: Ken
East S.F. Bay Area (Zone 9a)
Region: California
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CaliFlowers
Jul 15, 2017 3:09 PM CST
You have the general idea.

Lined-out single fans will bloom and develop increase fairly quickly, so growers don't necessarily line out double fans, unless the variety is older and not in so much demand. Newer, more expensive plants are most often lined out as single fans. Also, they're sometimes planted out in blocks instead of single rows, but the main idea is that they're broken up into near-saleable units, both for harvesting & shipping convenience and to encourage increase. Optimally, you'd want the lined out plants to have re-established fairly well before digging and shipping. I think most growers allow between a couple of months to a full growing season before selling.

Lining out seedlings is similar. In order to conserve artificial lighting and space, many growers sow seed thickly, and then when the seedlings have outgrown their seedling pots, they're lined out into the field with wider spacing so that they may grow to first bloom without too much competition. From comments I've read here, growers tend to space seedlings on 6" - 9" centers in rows about a foot apart.

Timing depends on the climate. I knew growers in Northern California who did all their dividing and lining out in the late fall and winter because it was the only time they had available. In colder climates, you'd want the divisions to have enough time to re-establish well before winter. Seedlings sown and grown over winter inside and under lights will usually bloom the next year after lining out if it's done in early spring.
Name: Davi (Judy) Davisson
Sherrills Ford, NC (Zone 7a)
Davi
Jul 16, 2017 5:56 AM CST
I've heard that digging a plant up twice in one season will result in the plant not blooming the following year. So you should be lining out for next year's sales, not this fall's. Plants go thru a rapid growth period about two weeks after they stop blooming so that's when I line out. Timing will vary from plant to plant and is an ongoing process here in zone 7. I've already lined out the early bloomers into single fans that quickly increase into doubles and by the time they are shipped in the spring, they may be triples or more. Lining out makes selling so much easier because you aren't lifting a big ole clump to mail plants to multiple customers and having to ship them all at the same time (or replant for later shipment which is hard on the plants). You are never sure how the clump will come apart or if there might be injury to the crowns in the division process. So lining out well in advance gives the plants plenty of time to recover and increase from dividing before selling them to your customers. And your customer will get a "whole" plant free from crown injuries with a full root system. I cringe when I hear about people just sticking a shovel into a clump to get a division...which always results in injury to the plant being sold.
Name: Amber
Missouri (Zone 6a)
Daylilies Region: Missouri Garden Photography
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amberjewel
Jul 16, 2017 10:19 AM CST
Thank you for the great information everyone.

@Davi
How far apart do you plant the SF when you line them out?
Amber
Daylily Novice
Name: Davi (Judy) Davisson
Sherrills Ford, NC (Zone 7a)
Davi
Jul 16, 2017 2:33 PM CST
When I dig up the clump, I wash all the dirt off so you can see what you are doing and carefully jiggle off individual fans using a screwdriver to gently pry apart fans if necessary. The planting hole for each fan must accommodate the entire circular root system so the space needed varies depending on how big the roots are on individual fans. The objective is to not disturb the neighboring plant when you ship to a customer (or dig for a walk in customer) so just allow enough space between plants so that the roots don't become entwined with the neighboring plant while it's increasing. Most single fans are approximately a foot apart, but it varies. Before the internet, people usually bought their plants from walk in sales gardens and it was common practice for a mature clump of a cultivar to be planted next to the path where people could view them as they would look when clumped up....and then double fan divisions were lined out behind the mature clump usually in a straight line to make selling and digging on demand easier. But as mentioned before, lining out can be done in pots, or in squares, or in whatever space you have available.
(Zone 6a)
taylordaylily
Jul 16, 2017 6:30 PM CST
@ Amberjewel Great thread idea. I tip my hat to you.

@Davi Thank You! For your insight, you did a wonderful job explaining the process. I tip my hat to you.
Name: Diana
Lincoln, NE (Zone 5b)
Daylilies Region: Nebraska Organic Gardener Dog Lover Bookworm
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ShakespearesGarden
Jul 16, 2017 7:12 PM CST
More good ideas to think about... Before the thread was started, I planted a bunch new daylilies in a long line, next to the green beans, which will end up as new rows of daylilies.

Now that I know more, I have a better idea of how to use those rows to make lining out a less confusing step on this flower journey...

I saw the front clump, line out behind technique at a garden here in Lincoln, but it didn't occur to me at that time, the reason behind it... Now I know...

The line the will now be worked north to provide the rows for lining out. The green beans have been given notice...
Thumb of 2017-07-17/ShakespearesGarden/15f0cd

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Name: Dana
Canton, OH (Zone 6a)
Project Junkie & One Hit Wonder =P
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bloominholes2fill
Aug 16, 2017 12:55 PM CST
So when they're lined out in pots, are they kept outside in the northern winters?
"The grass is only greener where it's watered and fertilized." - Yours Truly
Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then you should ALWAYS be Batman! - Unknown
Dana
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Name: Diana
Lincoln, NE (Zone 5b)
Daylilies Region: Nebraska Organic Gardener Dog Lover Bookworm
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ShakespearesGarden
Aug 16, 2017 3:12 PM CST
Dana, I'm glad you asked, because it's been on my mind too. I keep looking at all my potted daylilies and going "ummm,...."
Scout's motto: Be Prepared...
Name: Dana
Canton, OH (Zone 6a)
Project Junkie & One Hit Wonder =P
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bloominholes2fill
Aug 16, 2017 6:57 PM CST
....yeah bc I don't have a greenhouse....
"The grass is only greener where it's watered and fertilized." - Yours Truly
Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then you should ALWAYS be Batman! - Unknown
Dana
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Name: Davi (Judy) Davisson
Sherrills Ford, NC (Zone 7a)
Davi
Aug 17, 2017 5:31 AM CST
The best place for your plants in zone 5 is in the ground where the roots can spread out and the plants have room to increase before winter. Lining out in pots is usually done in hot climates (zone 8-9) where the ground does not freeze or in a greenhouse.

The problem with trying to winter in pots in cold climates is that once the soil in the pot freezes, it can no longer drain. The top of the pot then acts as the edge of a swimming pool where during a winter rain or during a January snow melt, water puddles around the crowns. Once that water refreezes, ice shards will penetrate the crown creating an injury that may lead to rot. Some people get around this by putting pots in a protected spot like under the eaves of the house or on a porch, turning the pots on their side after the soil is frozen, or covering them....but again....the best place for survival is in the ground.
Name: Diana
Lincoln, NE (Zone 5b)
Daylilies Region: Nebraska Organic Gardener Dog Lover Bookworm
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ShakespearesGarden
Aug 17, 2017 4:09 PM CST
Looks like I'll be busy with more planting this weekend... Only the potted ones and, uh, four more orders to plant ... I think... Whistling
Scout's motto: Be Prepared...
Name: Dana
Canton, OH (Zone 6a)
Project Junkie & One Hit Wonder =P
Daylilies Butterflies Hummingbirder Cat Lover Dog Lover Roses
Region: Ohio Winter Sowing Composter Birds Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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bloominholes2fill
Aug 18, 2017 1:10 PM CST
ShakespearesGarden said:Looks like I'll be busy with more planting this weekend... Only the potted ones and, uh, four more orders to plant ... I think... Whistling


Yep, sounds like a busy weekend, Diana! Whistling Smiling
"The grass is only greener where it's watered and fertilized." - Yours Truly
Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then you should ALWAYS be Batman! - Unknown
Dana
https://garden.org/blogs/view/...
https://www.youtube.com/channe...
Name: Dana
Canton, OH (Zone 6a)
Project Junkie & One Hit Wonder =P
Daylilies Butterflies Hummingbirder Cat Lover Dog Lover Roses
Region: Ohio Winter Sowing Composter Birds Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
Image
bloominholes2fill
Aug 18, 2017 1:16 PM CST
Davi said:The best place for your plants in zone 5 is in the ground where the roots can spread out and the plants have room to increase before winter. Lining out in pots is usually done in hot climates (zone 8-9) where the ground does not freeze or in a greenhouse.

The problem with trying to winter in pots in cold climates is that once the soil in the pot freezes, it can no longer drain. The top of the pot then acts as the edge of a swimming pool where during a winter rain or during a January snow melt, water puddles around the crowns. Once that water refreezes, ice shards will penetrate the crown creating an injury that may lead to rot. Some people get around this by putting pots in a protected spot like under the eaves of the house or on a porch, turning the pots on their side after the soil is frozen, or covering them....but again....the best place for survival is in the ground.


I kind of figured that planting in the ground would be best, but I was holding on to hope! Glare Glare
What about "protecting" them in an unheated, drafty old separate garage? A li'l tongue in cheek, there, but is it a possibility, under those circumstances?
"The grass is only greener where it's watered and fertilized." - Yours Truly
Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then you should ALWAYS be Batman! - Unknown
Dana
https://garden.org/blogs/view/...
https://www.youtube.com/channe...
Name: Dana
Canton, OH (Zone 6a)
Project Junkie & One Hit Wonder =P
Daylilies Butterflies Hummingbirder Cat Lover Dog Lover Roses
Region: Ohio Winter Sowing Composter Birds Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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bloominholes2fill
Aug 19, 2017 9:22 PM CST
bloominholes2fill said:

I kind of figured that planting in the ground would be best, but I was holding on to hope! Glare Glare
What about "protecting" them in an unheated, drafty old separate garage? A li'l tongue in cheek, there, but is it a possibility, under those circumstances?


Since I have a small city lot, lining out in the ground is not ideal bc "real estate" is at a premium here, but I'll have some small clumps to put up for sale this Fall.
"The grass is only greener where it's watered and fertilized." - Yours Truly
Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then you should ALWAYS be Batman! - Unknown
Dana
https://garden.org/blogs/view/...
https://www.youtube.com/channe...
[Last edited by bloominholes2fill - Aug 19, 2017 9:23 PM (+)]
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