Trees and Shrubs forum: New guy need advice

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bigbosky
Mar 17, 2018 1:03 PM CST
Hey all.
Me and my friend go on an anual hunting trip every year. In the spirit of always leaving the woods as good or better than when we found them we want to start a tradition of planting something every year. Any advice on what to plant? It has to be something that can grow on its own as it is a long ways away for us and dojng maintenence on it will be nearly impossible. If possible I want it to be something unique for these woods. It is is Ohio btw. I was think something simple like an apple tree or maybe even a redwood that would tower above everything else. Would either of these work if not what would?
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Mar 20, 2018 12:52 PM CST
LIriodendron -- they should do well in your area and will stand out long before you die.

You could try Dawn Redwood, also fast growing and will stand out over time.

Try finding some old full size variety apple or pear trees and feed the wild life at the same time.
My one Grandfather had a farm where the house was next to a woods that was once part apple and fruit orchard.
Apple trees got large and really very old but he always though the pears were from a relative that was playing a trick on him till dad showed him there were fruit up , way up, in the tree.
[Last edited by RpR - Mar 20, 2018 12:54 PM (+)]
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Name: Deb
Pacific NW (Zone 8b)
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Bonehead
Mar 20, 2018 12:55 PM CST
I would encourage you to stick with trees or shrubs native to your area. You can likely get a good list and possibly source of seedlings from your local native plant society or county extension service. Great idea!
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.
Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
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fwmosher
Mar 20, 2018 1:56 PM CST
Bigbosky: Someday when this house is sold, someone is going to get a bargain, because of the unique trees and vines I have introduced. There is nothing natural in this area but spruce, maple and birch. However, I have introduced 3 Buhr Oak from acorns, now one is 25' tall, transplanted 4 Scotch pine to the property, (all 20' tall), dozens and dozens of grape vines, 11 Japanese plums, 4 European plums, 5 pear, 3 apple, 1 nectarine and 3 peach trees, not to mention the many shrubs. Just do it!! But make it unique to the area, and something that will stand right out when you go in hunting! Birds and animals spread most of the tree seeds, but why not start something unique in your hunting area?? Just do it!! Cheers!
Name: Deb
Pacific NW (Zone 8b)
Region: Pacific Northwest Organic Gardener Deer Ferns Herbs Dragonflies
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Bonehead
Mar 20, 2018 2:41 PM CST
Frank, I respectfully disagree. What one plants on their own property is a personal choice. I don't, however, think it is helpful or wise to introduce non-native plants into our forests. Some can become highly invasive, clog waterways, out-compete natives, and any number of other problems. Plus, Bigbosky's plan is to just plant and let whatever it is make do on its own -- natives would have a much better survival chance. With a small amount of research, one can find beautiful plants indigenous to any region, and some are vulnerable or endangered. Makes more sense to me from a stewardship point to stick with natives.
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Mar 20, 2018 2:55 PM CST
None of the plants Frank listed are going to take over or out do anything.
Native grape vines can become a weed comparatively quickly.
Too many people get Buckthornphobia when thinking of non-regional plants.

I was going to plant a European Oak at home eighteen years ago but lack of large young ones and cost convinced me not to.
Had I planted any of the ones I looked at, and they survived, they would still be scrub tree which I found out when the city planted a Burr Oak on the boulevard across the street five years later.
It was approx. ten feet high then with bowed trunk, which they said would straighten out.
Well now it is sixteen feet high with a bowed trunk.
When it gets large, I will LOOOOOOONG be worm food, and they will probably cut it down as a threat to traffic when it gets large..
I wrote this mainly to say, what ever slow growing tree he would plant, regional or foreign, he will be long dead before it is large, much less intrusive but the other plants Frank suggested, he would enjoy and maybe out live.

Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Birds Roses Clematis Lilies Peonies
Region: Canadian Photo Contest Winner: 2017 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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fwmosher
Mar 20, 2018 4:22 PM CST
Bonehead: C'mon!! We are talking about trees, not non-native fish to lakes, not invasive weed plants, not new bird introductions, nor bug/insect intros! Ever walked through the woods and saw a different tree and wonder: "How did that get there"? I have. Many times! It's us or the birds and creatures that "plant" those! What is the point of planting "native" trees in a secluded deer hunting woodland, that is full of "native trees" way back in lower east ......? I can assure you, that "native" trees are simply taking over here! I can't believe that the Scouts give out free spruce tree seedlings, and I love the Scouts and was one! My neighbour has 60 acres, all "natives" and yet there is a green gage plum tree, three apple trees, two cherries, two peaches, a couple other plums, and grape vines, and a slew of black walnut from seed, which we both introduced. "Clog waterways, out-compete natives"? That's quite a stretch from reality! As you know, the most aggressive plant with invasive roots, is the Willow, stretching out as far as 30' and even lifting foundations. We are not talking about Willows! Give us a little breathing room here. Cheers!
Name: Deb
Pacific NW (Zone 8b)
Region: Pacific Northwest Organic Gardener Deer Ferns Herbs Dragonflies
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Bonehead
Mar 20, 2018 8:24 PM CST
I stand by my opinion, and respect others. I think it is simplistic to presume a non-native tree planted here and there is somehow less intrusive than introducing a fish or weed. Here in the Pacific NW, we have a large influx of English hawthorn trees, which I believe have had a negative impact on our native hawthorns. No scientific data, but I have tons of English hawthorns and have yet to find a native hawthorn (the leaves are significantly different). So, yeah, I do think trees can impact the natural flora. I am unclear what your point is re willows, as I have many native willows in my region. In a stream restoration project, my local conservation agency recently planted several hundred willows along our salmon-bearing creek. All natives. It's not a tree I would choose for my front yard, but will hopefully restore some of the riparian habitat that has been lost to beaver damage. We shall see.

If you are still with us, Bigbosky, this is a rather typical reparte on this web site. Differing opinions, but cordial. And cheers back to you, Frank! Carry on.
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.

bigbosky
Mar 21, 2018 9:32 PM CST
Thanks for all the replys. I really like the idea of apple trees. If I was to transplant a tree how big of a tree would I need for it to survive? It cant be to big as it is a long hike to where I am going. It has to be a managable size for me to carry or drag out there.
I also like the idea of a redwood but my only concern is plant a giant non native tree like that effecting all the other trees around it.
Name: Deb
Pacific NW (Zone 8b)
Region: Pacific Northwest Organic Gardener Deer Ferns Herbs Dragonflies
Spiders! Dog Lover Keeper of Poultry Birds Fruit Growers Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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Bonehead
Mar 21, 2018 9:36 PM CST
Aha, Johnny Appleseed it is! I'd go with a bare root sapling (easy to transport) and try to site it in a riparian area so it will get adequate water. The deer will thank you if it grows and produces fruit.
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.

bigbosky
Mar 21, 2018 9:43 PM CST
I probably find the biggest managable size apple tree I can find.
I should also point out that we are both big strong guys and could even put the tree on a dolly if need be.
Ill have to read up on the tecnical aspect of planting but if I do this to I bring a bunch of bagged soil out with me or simply dig a hold and fill it back in with the native soil.
Name: Deb
Pacific NW (Zone 8b)
Region: Pacific Northwest Organic Gardener Deer Ferns Herbs Dragonflies
Spiders! Dog Lover Keeper of Poultry Birds Fruit Growers Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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Bonehead
Mar 21, 2018 10:14 PM CST
One problem I can see with an apple tree is how to protect it from deer until it gets to a manageable size. Most folks I know who live in deer country keep their fruit trees in jail (wire enclosures) until they are taller than the deer's reach.
I want to live in a world where the chicken can cross the road without its motives being questioned.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Mar 21, 2018 11:20 PM CST
bigbosky said:I probably find the biggest managable size apple tree I can find.
I should also point out that we are both big strong guys and could even put the tree on a dolly if need be.
Ill have to read up on the tecnical aspect of planting but if I do this to I bring a bunch of bagged soil out with me or simply dig a hold and fill it back in with the native soil.


Depends on your soil.
What ever you do, it is best to make the hole at least one foot in diameter, all the way around the root ball , than you need.
Trying to manhandle a tree in a hole is a LOT harder than it looks and you can break even a fairly large tree easier than you think.
I would find some of those fertilizer spikes, you are supposed to hammer them into the ground and smash them into small chunks , dust and mix that in, well, with the back fill.
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
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porkpal
Mar 25, 2018 4:38 PM CST
As a general rule small trees transplant more successfully than big trees, but they would need some sort of protection. Skip the fertilizer the first year.
Porkpal
Name: Rick Moses
Derwood, MD (Zone 7b)
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RickM
Mar 25, 2018 4:57 PM CST
Welcome! bigbosky What a wonderful idea! Around here, when they are reforesting an area, they put plastic tubes around the trees to protect them. The tubes are a semi-thin plastic with vent holes to allow air circulation. The idea is to protect the sapling until it sprouts out of the top on it's own. Eventually, the tube will break down naturally from the ultraviolet and weather exposure.

If you can't find a tube, you can make one yourself using corrugated sign board, the same stuff that small yard signs are printed on that slide on to a wire frame. It should roll fairly easily, and you can secure it with nylon tie wraps. You can also use it to protect your sapling during transport. I'm sure someone will chime in about using the nylon tie wraps and the environment. However, if you use twine, the critters are sure to nibble on it. Polypropylene twine would be even worse. With the nylon tie wraps, the critters should leave them alone, and you can always remove/replace on your annual trek.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
RpR
Mar 25, 2018 5:09 PM CST
Bigbosky, Porkpal is correct about small trees vs larger trees for shock.
This one reason to check root ball size on the tree you buy; if you buy a tree that has a 2" trunk with a small root ball, walk away.
It has been root trimmed far too small.

If you are going to put in an Apple Tree/s, the smaller you go the longer before you get fruit and the more susceptible it is to disease.
I have seen far too many young apple trees put in up here that last three years and die because the owners did not want to deal with the hassle involved in treating small trees.
Larger ones have to be treated but seem to have more stamina than saplings.
Check variety of tree for stamina, they are not all alike.
With young trees it will be three to five or more years before you get a real apple yield.

Again , check root ball size. That will make a difference in the quality of the tree.

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