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Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Aug 22, 2019 7:34 AM CST
At the monthly judging last Saturday, this beautiful plant came to the judging table. It is Rhyncholaeliocattleya George King 'Southern Cross' AM/AOS. Some of you might be familiar with another awarded George King and that one has the clonal name 'Serendipity'.


This happens quite frequently. An awarded clone comes to the judging table but sometimes I am left to wonder why. Let me explain.
This clone "Southern Cross" was granted an AM of 80 points back in 2002 I think. But what can we do with this plant?
It already has an award! Honestly we look at it compared to its previous award. We look at the measurements, the description, the images and compare the entry to that award. (In this case 17 years after the original award)
After the comparison, we must decide if it warrants an upgrade.

This has also happened to me before.
I once had a high AM like 86 points I think it was, come to the table a few years later after the first award. We looked at it fairly and decided that there was significant improvement. It received an FCC. I do not remember the score.

The reverse has happened too. The new candidate with a previous A.M. is actually worse this time around so we pass on it. There is no point to score it lower. Why take an AM of 80 and score it an HCC of 78 pts?

What can also happen is say an 83 point AM comes to the table and gets upgraded to an 85 point AM! The further that award is away from the next level, in this case 7 points to an FCC, the harder it is to move up. The owner might have thought it was better in their estimation and worth an FCC.
It is easier to go from an HCC of 78 points to an AM of 80 then it is to go from 88 to 90 points. An upgrade from an 83 point AM to an FCC of 90 points is practically unheard of.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Aug 23, 2019 7:46 PM (+)]
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Name: Glenn Graham
Memphis (Zone 7b)
Plumerias Dog Lover Birds Growing under artificial light Amaryllis Ferns
Region: Tennessee Foliage Fan Houseplants Tropicals Orchids Butterflies
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BBQNBLUES
Aug 22, 2019 9:20 AM CST
Definitely _Not a CCE yikes
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Aug 22, 2019 9:53 AM CST
It was a pretty flower. Serendipity was something I had seen numerous times but Southern Cross, I didn't think so.
The lip was very unusually colored and it had great petals. Sepals were broad but dorsal slightly reflexed at the tip. And for the best point, if that came to the judging table, 17 years later, it would still get an AM in my opinion. Now that is the mark of a good hybrid! 😃
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: lindsey
wesley chapel, fl
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Orchids
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sugarcane
Aug 22, 2019 12:49 PM CST
I miss mine.. it. Died.
They are such pretty flowers.
lindsey
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Plumerias Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers
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Ursula
Aug 22, 2019 5:03 PM CST

Moderator

They sure are! But in this case this plant looks a bit rough?

I am only familiar with the 'Serendipity'.
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Aug 22, 2019 5:05 PM CST
Those are the older, leafless bulbs. It had five or six bulbs with leaves. They were a bit on the yellow green side.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Aug 23, 2019 7:52 PM CST
I have to apologize to everyone. I just re-read and re-read my post about Rlc. Southern Cross! It made little or no sense! What the heck was I on? I must have been tired or something for me to be so disjointed. But sometimes I am so involved in making a point, my "old brain" wanders too much.
But I tried the best to salvage what I wrote. I think that it makes more sense now. The whole point was " What to do when a previously awarded plant appears on the judging table?" Hopefully it makes more sense.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Plumerias Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers
Greenhouse Ponds Keeper of Koi Forum moderator Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Adeniums
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Ursula
Aug 24, 2019 7:23 AM CST

Moderator

Bill, I just read it and read it a few more times and I figured I must have missed something. Thanks, it is clear now. Smiling
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Sep 21, 2019 1:19 PM CST
Time once again for another Orchids Up North and these are plants that came to the monthly judging table. This first one is Paphiopedilum Rolfei. Rolfei is a hybrid of Paphiopedilum bellatulum X Paphiopedilum rothschildianum. I think that it has 25 awards to date and this one makes 26. I believe this was granted an AM of 80 points.
It got a 79.4 average score and would have been an HCC of 79 but a judge asked to rescore. It went up a point bringing the average to 79.6 points making it an AM of 80!!

Thumb of 2019-09-21/BigBill/795a83


This was just a deep and richly colored flower. The markings were very crisp and clear, dorsal was full and broad with an intensely colored pouch. I did not do any of the research since it did not come before my team. But I thought that the petals were a bit inconsistent. They were not quite alike. Perhaps the pouch was a bit narrow but the size was good and the color was very good, one of the darkest ones I have seen.
There were 2 flowers one a single inflorescence and the plant was in a 4" square plastic pot. Media was charcoal, sponge rock and orchiata. Flowers were approximately 3.8cm. wide by 11.5 cm. tall
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Sep 21, 2019 4:46 PM CST
Now every so often we are just perplexed and somewhat confused as to what we can do with certain plants in difficult situations. This plant came to the table earlier today as an unregistered hybrid of Lueddemanniana striata X Acineta superba.

Thumb of 2019-09-21/BigBill/935d07
Thumb of 2019-09-21/BigBill/0b3b27
Thumb of 2019-09-21/BigBill/97a00c

Very little information on the Lueddemanniana parent was available. There was an image in Orchid Wiz showing a fleshy, pendant inflorescence of cupped golden yellow flowers with fine red spots or speckles. No vegetative information was available in either the AOS or Orchid Wiz programs. The best we could do was to count the number of flowers in the ONE reference image shown, 32. No description, no flowers size, no leaf or bulb size. We estimated that maybe these flowers were like a centimeter in size. No one on my team knew it or grew the species but we figured with larger 1" or 2" flowers, it would be more widely grown! So we reasoned that this was a unfamiliar species from Ecuador/Ecuagenera with smallish flowers.
The other parent, the Acineta had a few awards with photographs. These flowers were yellow with darker cherry red at the base of the lip with faint red striping. Their shape could be described as tulip like, wooden shoe like, similar to an Anguloa.
But what we were seeing did not add up. It had bulbs more like a Acineta and inflorescences like a Stanhopea. The flower count was about 17 per on 2 inflorescences. Flower size was around 7.5 centimeters, a little smaller then the Acineta parent.
You can see from my images that the flowers were kind of orange yellow with lots of speckles and spots with darker red/purple on the lip basally. They were of an open, starry shape.

We all were in agreement that we had doubts that this was the correct parentage. ( I was leaning towards a Stanhopea by an Acineta) We didn't see where this times this yielded that. The Lueddemanniana parent seemed completely lost in the background except that there were more flowers then a typical Acineta. We loved the color, the size and presentation but we had no idea what it really was.
We decided to pass on it and recommended that the owner send images and contact the grower/ hybridizer seeking additional information.
NOW we had another option. We could have awarded it as an unregistered hybrid, which it was, but then what. It would be Provisional until it was identified. BUT could an accurate ID be obtained??
This is to say that even as judges, we get stumped every once in a while!!
But those flowers were pretty.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Sep 22, 2019 3:27 AM (+)]
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Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Plumerias Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers
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Ursula
Sep 21, 2019 5:20 PM CST

Moderator

Such a dilemma! I love this, what beautiful garlands of just gorgeous blooms! Wow!!
Interesting Paph too! But the noid is totally drool-worthy! Lovey dubby
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
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BigBill
Sep 21, 2019 5:31 PM CST
I wanted so badly to award it, like maybe a 76 point HCC. It would go in as a Provisional award. They come off Provisional when Identified or when the hybridizer registers the cross.
But my fellow judges did not agree. We went with their solution. Either way, Ecuagenera has to be contacted. Meanwhile it would be "on the record" and we might get a quicker answer. I sure hope that the owner/a fellow judge, follows through and contacts them.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: Joshua
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (Zone 10b)
Köppen Climate Zone Cfb
Region: Australia Bookworm Cat Lover Lilies Orchids Irises
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Australis
Sep 22, 2019 2:32 AM CST

Plants SuperMod

Such a frustrating situation, Bill! I hope the owner is able to get a proper ID for it and that it can eventually be awarded as you would have liked to have done.

The blooms are definitely unusual!
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Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Sep 22, 2019 3:41 AM CST
Good morning everyone! This is the last plant that I wanted to post from yesterday's judging. It is Phragmipedium Christin Quintal which is Phragmipedium Haroldeen Quintal X Phragmipedium longifolium var. hartwiegii. Now that is a mouthful!!



This is just a gorgeous little Phragmipedium, almost 15 cm. wide and of fairly good form. Background color was bright yellow but not intense in the sense that it presented itself kind of like pastel in intensity, not bold but kind of 'softer' if you know what I mean. I think my image captures that. And the flower, the dorsal and petals had this soft peachy-pink blush to them as you see here. Pouch was a darker pink with a rich bright yellow interior and the center of the lip and staminode were slightly darker yellow!
This did not come before the team I was on so I don't know if it was awarded or not. It was on the judging table when I left.
It was suddenly raining cats and dogs, puppies and kittens with a few frogs 🐸 thrown in!! Goodness it poured. Not a word about a shower in the days forecast!!!
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Oct 19, 2019 12:18 PM CST
Bill is back so it must have been Judging today. There were several judges missing today so there were only two plants. I took in my Wonderfully Wood and even though the judges liked it, it was not awarded. They felt that the dorsal was too cupped and the petals were slightly pinched at the end.
Thumb of 2019-10-19/BigBill/7feff6

I was a little disappointed but maybe next time. We did award this however!


This is Phragmipedium QF Leina'ala. It got an award of 82 points making it an AM. It is a hybrid of Phragmipedium Conchiferum X Phragmipedium Incan Treasure. It has kovachii and longifolium in the background. Flower was a beautiful ivory colored blossom overlaid pink with corkscrewed petals overlaid with fine rose pink hairs especially at the petal margins and apical tips. Overall form was nice and the ivory pouch was overlaid blush pink with dark cordovan spots at the rim. It had pink spotting basally as well. Staminode ivory with dark rose pink pubescens along the margin.
It measured 14.3cm wide by 12.8 cm. tall. It was in a 5" round plastic pot with orchiata, charcoal and sponge rock.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Oct 19, 2019 12:21 PM (+)]
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Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Plumerias Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers
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Ursula
Oct 19, 2019 1:21 PM CST

Moderator

As you said, next time! Thumbs up
This pink beauty is adorable with its pretty pattern. Lovey dubby
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Oct 19, 2019 1:34 PM CST
I was going to name it Paphiopedilum Wonderfully Wood 'Ursula's Dream'!
One of the days man, one of these days!
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Oct 19, 2019 1:37 PM (+)]
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Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Nov 16, 2019 1:48 PM CST
This is Paphiopedilum Hilo Green. It is a hybrid of Paphiopedilum Hsinying Citron X Hsinying Majakun.
Thumb of 2019-11-16/BigBill/d60c24


There is one award to date, an AM. This flower is significantly smaller in terms of natural spread. The awarded clone had a natural spread of 13.4 cm. X 11.4 cm. The candidate was a good two centimeters smaller. This flower appeared to be newly opening and was cupped. The awarded one was very flat.
The apple green petals were blushed yellow apically and the pouch was apple green. This plant had broader petals that were rounded at the apex. The awarded one had petals that were more slender and pointed.
If fully open, this plant has potential.
It was in a 4" square plastic pot with orchiata, sponge rock and charcoal.
It was 9.3 cm. Wide X 8.1cm. Tall.
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Nov 16, 2019 1:52 PM (+)]
Give a thumbs up | Quote | Post #2106660 (18)
Name: Big Bill
Livonia, Michigan (Zone 6a)
American Orchid Society Judge
Region: United States of America Critters Allowed Growing under artificial light Echinacea Hostas Region: Michigan
Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Orchids Cat Lover Birds Bee Lover
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BigBill
Nov 16, 2019 2:25 PM CST
Another plant at Judging today was Paphiopedilum Herbert Berkhart. It is a hybrid of Paphiopedilum liemianum X Paphiopedilum gardneri.


I grow a couple of these myself and I just love the color. It is a compact growing hybrid. Paphiopedilum gardneri can get to be a large plant while Paphiopedilum liemianum is a much smaller growing species.
The flowers are basically chartreuse with a burgundy rose pouch. Here you see that the dorsal sepal is off center and rolled back just above the petals. The petals are corkscrewed with either one or two twists. They have rich burgundy bars and spots. Both the bottom and top edges feature coarse dark burgundy hairs.
This was in a 4" square pot with charcoal, sponge rock and orchiata.
We did not award this due to off center dorsal and inconsistent twisting of the petals on both flowers. All four were twisted differently. One flower had a little mechanical damage on a petal margin. Flower size was about 2 1/2" wide by 3 1/4" tall.
Tap on the image and expand it and enlarge it so you can appreciate the hairs. Even the edges of the staminode have hairs
Rodney Wilcox Jones, my idol!
Businessman, Orchid grower, hybridizer, lived to 107!
[Last edited by BigBill - Nov 16, 2019 2:31 PM (+)]
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Name: Ursula
Fair Lawn NJ, zone 6b
Plumerias Orchids Cactus and Succulents Region: New Jersey Region: Pennsylvania Native Plants and Wildflowers
Greenhouse Ponds Keeper of Koi Forum moderator Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Adeniums
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Ursula
Nov 16, 2019 3:05 PM CST

Moderator

I love the Herbert Berkhart! It is a cutie! Lovey dubby

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