Roses forum: Yellow growth on standard rose

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Spiidey
Apr 14, 2018 12:13 PM CST
Hello everyone, this is my first post on these forums!

Got this weird kind of yellow growth on standard rose - any idea what this is?

Pic attached.
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[Last edited by Spiidey - Apr 14, 2018 12:17 PM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Composter Garden Photography Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Region: Alabama
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Seedfork
Apr 14, 2018 12:17 PM CST
@Spiidey,
Welcome!
I have no idea what the yellow fungus looking growth is. Hope someone here can help.
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Apr 14, 2018 12:44 PM CST
I thought it might be a lichen which often grows on the bark of slow growing trees and shrubs.
Porkpal
Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Birds Roses Clematis Lilies Peonies
Region: Canadian Photo Contest Winner: 2017 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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fwmosher
Apr 14, 2018 1:41 PM CST
Welcome to the Rose Forum. I would tend to agree with Porkpal in that it does look like (one of) the common lichen. I am not aware of any being harmful to any plant let alone Roses. Are you anywhere near bodies of water, ocean, lakes, etc. Generally, under the right conditions (moist environment) the "older bushes/shrubs/trees will be subject to lichen. My Japanese plum trees on the front lawn are starting to get over 15 years old, and they have lichen, but still many, many healthy fruit-bearing shoots, coming off the lichen-covered limbs. There was a saying one time, that if you were lost in the woods, the older trees covered with moss or lichen could tell you which way was North. Not convinced yet, and I have been checking. Anyway, cheers, your "standard" looks very healthy. Do you have a picture of it in bloom, or know what rose it is?

Spiidey
Apr 15, 2018 4:21 PM CST
Hi all and thanks for the welcomes. 😁

That's a big relief if its lichen and it doesn't damage the rose. It's not even really that unsightly, although I do wonder is there a way to 'scrub' it off?

We're in eastern Scotland so about 5 miles off the coast. Last year the plant did get heavily hit wth black spot - would that be linked to the lichen in any way?

We've had the standard for 7 years now and it had amazing blooms in years 2-5. Only recently started taking pictures though so don't really have any of it in full show, just these couple which were before and after the black spot hit last year. The standard definitely needed a good prune looking back at those! 😬😬

That kinda brings me to another question, does having all the plants around the standards base cause problems e.g. Lack of airflow to the base/roots? Battle for nutrients from the soil/feed? It just seemed to wilt when the begonia/dahlias went in around it's base last year although the wilt might have been due to the airflow through the branches of the standard being poor (as it hadn't been pruned properly), and I think I might have been over zealous with the watering too. 😡
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I'll double check the variety of standard it is, I've still got the old tag somewhere .
[Last edited by Spiidey - Apr 15, 2018 4:24 PM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Composter Garden Photography Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Region: Alabama
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Seedfork
Apr 15, 2018 4:41 PM CST
Beautiful, so neat looking!
Long Island, NY (Zone 6b)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015
MargieNY
Apr 15, 2018 5:30 PM CST
Cultivating and digging the annuals/perennials around the rose bush each year could be damaging the the feeder roots of the rose bush. Maybe you could place the begonias and dahlias closest to the base of the rose bush in pots - perhaps 8 inches away from the base of the rose. And the flowers on the outside perimeter of the garden bed in the ground.
Sufficient watering could be the other problem to address - some competition could be going on there. I would do deep watering with the rose bush.
Good air circulation is very important to avoid blackspot.
Your garden is absolutely gorgeous - picture perfect.
Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Birds Roses Clematis Lilies Peonies
Region: Canadian Photo Contest Winner: 2017 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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fwmosher
Apr 15, 2018 6:29 PM CST
Pictures are beautiful, standard and landscaping!!! Kinda looks like a "tissue paper D. Austin rose", in that there are many petals all rolled inward toward the centre on each bloom. Just a guess from the pic. With respect to blackspot, if you do not encounter it in Scotland, and less than five miles from the ocean, it would be a miracle! Has to do with the rose cultivar, to begin with, and it's resistance to black spot, then other factors including dampness primarily, fog, rain, mist, and the spores wafting unto your standard, from somewhere. Not totally convinced that the underlying plants are the cause, however not denying for a second, that the base of most roses contain the black spot spores from the previous year or fallen leaves. Certain roses are "black spot" magnets. The very first HT. rose introduced, "Peace" is extremely suspectable to black spot. Black Spot is a fungus, and if you want to control it, you have to spray with the most innocuous but effective fungicidal agent, namely Sulpher. There are tons of products out there to spray safely with, containing sulphur, available in a concentrated form which can be diluted down. Use caution in choosing anything else, because there are some "nasty" products out there, already banned in numerous countries! Cheers! PS. We are all waiting for a closeup when in full bloom!!!
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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RoseBlush1
Apr 15, 2018 10:51 PM CST
@Spiidey ... Welcome! to the Rose Forum.

Frank, I hope you don't mind if I step in with a couple of corrections to the post above ... Smiling

I have a "thing" about rose history ... Smiling

'Peace' was and is certainly a break through rose which was introduced by three different nurseries after World War II, but it was not the first hybrid tea. 'La France', which was introduced in 1867 is often designated as the first hybrid tea, although some experts cite 'Victor Verdier' which is generally classified as a hybrid perpetual as the first HT. 'Victor Verdier' was introduced in 1859.

Rose (Rosa 'La France')



When conditions are right, 'Peace' can be very susceptible to black spot, but it can also be disease free in other climates.

@Spiidey

That kinda brings me to another question, does having all the plants around the standards base cause problems e.g. Lack of airflow to the base/roots? Battle for nutrients from the soil/feed?

You are on the right track asking this question. (btw your rose and under plantings are beautiful.)

When you take the anatomy of the root system into consideration, under plantings do impact the health of a rose. The feeder roots of a rose are very near the surface of the soil. As the rose grows, they are constantly growing outward from the crown of the rose seeking more nutrients and moisture.

Margie was correct when she wrote "Cultivating and digging the annuals/perennials around the rose bush each year could be damaging the the feeder roots of the rose bush." except that she used "could be" ... Hilarious!

There is no doubt that any digging / cultivating in the root zone of a rose will damage the feeder roots. If the rose has to put energy into growing new roots, it will sacrifice putting energy into the top growth and your plant will not be as healthy as a plant where the roots are not regularly disturbed.

The competition for moisture and nutrients does have a real impact on the rose. Not only because the other plants are grabbing the moisture and nutrients, but also because the rose's root system has been damaged.

Some roses can deal with this more effectively than others. It depends on the rose. Also, in your case, they use a different root stock in Europe which may not be as strong as the one that is common in the United States.

As for black spot, yes, those plants can harbor bs spores. Actually, even if they do, bs spores are in the air and if a rose is susceptible to bs, it doesn't matter if you have under plantings. The spores are there and if the rose is prone to getting bs, it will get bs.

Healthy roses are more disease resistant than stressed roses. My preference is to always protect the root system of the plant as much as possible because that is the foundation of the rose.

There are a lot of right ways to grow roses and a lot of people will disagree with me on that one ... Hilarious!

In your garden, where you know you have bs the common practice of changing out the old mulch for new mulch will go a long way to help manage bs. It will not prevent bs, but it will make a difference.

As for the fungicides you might use to control black spot, I know we have different products available to us here in the United States than you have across the pond. I think it is best to contact a reliable rose nursery for that kind of information.

As for the lichen, I can't begin to address whether or not it will harm the rose in the long term. I don't know enough about your growing conditions. I don't know what type of lichen is on your rose or how to treat it.

I do hope this helps. Please let us know how the rose is doing this season.

I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Birds Roses Clematis Lilies Peonies
Region: Canadian Photo Contest Winner: 2017 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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fwmosher
Apr 16, 2018 9:46 AM CST
RoseBlush: I stand corrected on my statement of "Peace" being the first HT rose! You are absolutely correct, in your reference in that it was not the not the first HT, however, would you agree that "La France" was a "discovered" HT, not hybridized by man, but found as such? (Your claim is still correct!) Your second reference is arguably a hybrid perpetual. So you are absolutely correct in your first two statements!! It is with your statement to the effect, that HT "Peace" was introduced after WW2 by three different nurseries, while correct also, makes an omission (probably due to time limitations) that I am respectfully not prepared to compromise on: The hybridizing was, as you know, done by Francis Meilland in 1935. It was their nursery who chose to send out "cuttings" to other international growers, to make certain that the cultivar was not lost due to the impending invasion by Germany. At the armistice in 1945, each delegate was presented with a "Peace" rose, hybridized and grown out by Meilland. You, of course, are most aware of all of this, and my intention is only to make certain, that Meilland in this case, gets due credit. They hybridized and grew the rose alone, then sent out cuttings, to other growers. Cheers! Smiling
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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RoseBlush1
Apr 16, 2018 10:12 AM CST
Frank .. we could talk rose history forever ... I love it ... Big Grin

'Peace' is certainly an important rose because it is in the lineage of thousands of roses ...

Yes, 'La France' was a chance seedling, and, it too, was, and is, a break through rose.

Have a happy day ... Smiling
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: Christie
43016 (Zone 6b)
Plays in the water.
Amaryllis Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals Composter
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cwhitt
Apr 16, 2018 10:24 AM CST
I think at this point I would not try to remove the lichen - you might damage something. I would agree with allowing a little more space and airflow around the rose and suspect that last years' heavy rains could have caused this. If the weather is drier this summer it may go away by itself.
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
Name: Steve
Prescott, AZ (Zone 7b)
Region: Southwest Gardening Roses Irises Lilies
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Steve812
Apr 23, 2018 7:06 PM CST
FWIW, I agree with cwhitt. Lichens should not pose much of a threat to the plant.

I know that there are purists who insist that roses be grown by themselves. But my own personal opinion is that they look much better when they share a bed with some other plants. I have heard that alliums will help roses resist fungal diseases by fixing sulfur. I think there are a lot of thrifty perennials that complement roses without stealing much from them. I'm sure that the annuals you have planted there are fine, too.

How hungry your roses are will depend to some degree how much you prune them. Pruning encourages new growth and roses generally bloom more vigorously from young wood. But it also increases the need for nutrients, especially nitrogen and phosphorous.
When you dance with nature, try not to step on her toes.
Name: Christie
43016 (Zone 6b)
Plays in the water.
Amaryllis Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals Composter
Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
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cwhitt
Apr 24, 2018 7:29 AM CST
Steve812 said:FWIW, I agree with cwhitt. Lichens should not pose much of a threat to the plant.

I know that there are purists who insist that roses be grown by themselves. But my own personal opinion is that they look much better when they share a bed with some other plants. I have heard that alliums will help roses resist fungal diseases by fixing sulfur. I think there are a lot of thrifty perennials that complement roses without stealing much from them. I'm sure that the annuals you have planted there are fine, too.
How hungry your roses are will depend to some degree how much you prune them. Pruning encourages new growth and roses generally bloom more vigorously from young wood. But it also increases the need for nutrients, especially nitrogen and phosphorous.


I have some Hens and Chicks planted around my roses, and I occasionally plant onions behind them. Never thought of Alliums. Might need to try that. Thank You!

Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
Name: David Tillyer
New York City
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BigAppleRoseGuy
Apr 24, 2018 9:30 AM CST
I've just planted two Peace roses. It's the first time I've planted Peace and I'm very excited about them. The thoughts about black spot worry me.

On the planting of smaller plants around roses, I think that they could be robbing water and nutrients from the roses. I've had areas of my garden that got overcrowded with weeds in years past and I've always been amazed at how the primary plants respond when the weeds are beaten back. Ah, the glories of a clean garden!
Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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RoseBlush1
Apr 24, 2018 10:38 AM CST
It's the continued asault to the the feeder roots by planting annuals that causes the greates problem to the roses.

All plants compete for water an nutrients in Nature. I think roses have the ability to compete quite well, especially if they are healthy plants.

I am not a purist, but I don't plant things on purposed under the crowns of my roses or even very close, but that is because I am a klutz and step on them ... Hilarious!

Once temps cool down again at the end of the week, I am going to transplant some correopsis, thyme and daffodil bulbs that have grown too close to the roses so that I can move around the roses easier.

@BigAppleRoseGuy, I, too, love that clean look in the garden. I don't have many weeds in the rose beds because I mulch heavily due to my high summer temps. I have found I don't even like planting the roses close together because it gives a kind of "cluttered" look to the garden.

I used to have river rock borders around all of my beds, but I have relocated a lot of those rocks to another part of the garden, because they stopped my eye as I viewed the garden and created a much less intrustive border in their place.

We all have our own gardening style.

I think the small alliums might work, but I haven't tried that so I don't know.
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Name: David Tillyer
New York City
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BigAppleRoseGuy
Apr 24, 2018 2:50 PM CST
I've just returned to my garden after about 6 years away. In the intervening years (while someone else was tending things) some ornamental grasses appeared. They have taken over and the poor roses are swamped. I'm reclaiming the territory slowly but surely. It's a slow process, but like all gardening, it's fun!
David
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses Clematis Irises
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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zuzu
Apr 24, 2018 3:05 PM CST

Moderator

I wish the grass in my rose beds were ornamental grass. The abundance of rain this year has led to a bumper crop of grassy weeds everywhere in my garden. I'm pulling them, but not quickly enough to avoid letting them go to seed, so this could be a process that literally takes forever.
Name: Frank Mosher
Nova Scotia, Canada (Zone 6a)
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Birds Roses Clematis Lilies Peonies
Region: Canadian Photo Contest Winner: 2017 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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fwmosher
Apr 25, 2018 10:50 AM CST
BigAppleRoseGuy: "Peace" is one of my favourite HT's because of it's beauty, and of course the symbolization of the "supposed end of War(s)." Well not quite, but can't take that out on the rose. LOL. It is indeed a beautiful rose, and has some beautiful offspring as well, i.e. "Chicago Peace", "Glowing Peace" , "Red Peace" and there are others which elude me at this moment. Yes, it is a Black Spot magnet, but in your area, and here in mine, we should both be spraying weekly with an "anti-black spot" spray, amongst others-at the very least, a spray of: " Baking Soda Solution: The simplest solution is to add 1 rounded tablespoon of baking soda to a gallon of water, then add 2 tablespoons of horticultural or vegetable oil and 3 drops of Dawn dishwashing soap to 1 gallon of water. The oil acts as a thin barrier, making it more difficult for fungal spores to establish. The detergent helps the mixture stick to the rose, which is especially important when fighting powdery mildew since it tends not to wet very well – especially in advanced stages. The solution works best if applied once or twice per week. " Note: I do not add the detergent, because a good "detergent" fights oils, grime and dirt" etc. (just reminiscing fom some old soap commercial. Also, just as a thought, I never plant this rose out in any of my beds, but rather keep it on the back deck, potted, so I can watch it carefully and enjoy the beautiful blooms when they come, and they will! Get your camera ready (morning pics the best, I think)! Envious! Going to get at least two this weekend if I can find them! I tip my hat to you.
Name: David Tillyer
New York City
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BigAppleRoseGuy
Apr 25, 2018 3:26 PM CST
Frank. Never had luck with fighting black spot. I will try your solution.
Should I add the Dawn or should I leave it out because "detergent fights oils"?

It's too late to put them on a back deck...I just have the one rose garden in a park
across the street.

Thanks for the tip. These are two nice specimens from Palatine. I want to nurture them.
David

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