Roses forum: Early September Roses

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(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 5, 2018 4:01 PM CST
Today's haul out back in the "pot ghetto"

Double R. Spithamea with a very "old garden rose" scent.
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R. Stellata mirifica with a musty "chaparral scent".
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Two seedlings from the cross (L56-1 X R. Minutifolia) X Self
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Pretty Lady X (Lynnie X Basye's Amphidiploid 86-1) [Banksiae X Laevigata]
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Mons Tillier
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Bassoues Tea
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Mme Antoine Mari
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Rosette Delizy
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Name: Lyn
Weaverville, California (Zone 8a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Garden Sages Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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RoseBlush1
Sep 5, 2018 4:14 PM CST
Kim ... these photos are just great.

I am so glad you included photos of your seedlings, too.

I would have never anticipated the outcome in the photo of:

Pretty Lady X (Lynnie X Basye's Amphidiploid 86-1) [Banksiae X Laevigata]
I'd rather weed than dust ... the weeds stay gone longer.
Zone 9, Sunset Zone 9 (Zone 9b)
Roses
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Mustbnuts
Sep 5, 2018 4:59 PM CST
Great pictures. Roses are very pretty.

Was out there this morning deadheading and generally cleaning up and I have quite a few hips on my plants. Some are already orange. Should I wait until after the first frost to harvest?
Name: Carol
Alberta, Canada (Zone 3b)
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Canadian_Rose
Sep 5, 2018 11:29 PM CST
So many unique roses!!! Well done in hybridizing roses!!!
Carol
(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 6, 2018 7:32 AM CST
Thank you. Mustbnuts, generally, it's felt that seeds should be harvested before they receive any freezes.
Zone 9, Sunset Zone 9 (Zone 9b)
Roses
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Mustbnuts
Sep 6, 2018 8:33 AM CST
Great! Thanks, Kim!
Name: Arturo Tarak
Bariloche, Rio Negro, Argentin (Zone 8a)
Roses Dahlias
hampartsum
Sep 6, 2018 8:54 AM CST
Thank you Kim for your photos! I'm particularly interested in your first two wild species. I searched a bit at HMF. There doesn't seem much about either. Of R.stellata mirifica, there are some crosses by Louis Lens. Bringing these wild species with crosses with more traditional roses is like opening up a new avenue of breeding. I was wondering what a cross like R.s.m with Kordes Robusta would result in, or the same with R.spithamea. I'm about to set out my first breeding crosses and looking towards very hardy species. Hardy wild species with interesting scent, plus good foliage and late blooming all sound very luring... Smiling Needless to say the other roses also open new avenues too...i.e Mme Antoine Mari. or the Pretty Lady cross.
Arturo
(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 6, 2018 10:23 AM CST
Thank you, Arturo, you're welcome! Good luck with your breeding. I grew Mr. Lens' Pink Mystery for some years, which he sent to me, with ten other roses, as "thank yous" for sending him Stellata mirifica, Minutifolia and many others. A mutual friend could fly anywhere American Airlines flew for the taxes as her father had been a pilot for them for many years. Her son lived in Belgium so she was back and forth visiting frequently and she always visited Mr. Lens when she went. Those were fun days! I could literally send garbage bags full of prepared cuttings without issue!

Species can result in some pretty "unusual" results, particularly when you start generating fertile triploids. This is a double Spithamea X 1-72-1, Ralph Moore's sister seedling to his Rise'n Shine.
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If you can obtain a triploid to use in breeding, you can make some rather remarkable progress in very short time. Fortuitously, Robusta is a fertile triploid....
Name: Arturo Tarak
Bariloche, Rio Negro, Argentin (Zone 8a)
Roses Dahlias
hampartsum
Sep 6, 2018 10:28 AM CST
You've made my day Kim. I have a lovely Kordes robusta growing healthily in my yard...yum yum... Big Grin Arturo
Name: Carol
Alberta, Canada (Zone 3b)
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Canadian_Rose
Sep 6, 2018 11:19 AM CST
Kim - that's a gorgeous cross!!! And so unusual!!! So Robusta is not the parent of that rose? Confused Is there anything special you have to do with hipping a triploid?
Carol
(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 6, 2018 11:32 PM CST
Thank you, Carol. No ma'am, I don't have Robusta. I grew it years ago in the old Newhall garden, but haven't had it in fifteen or so years. The seedling you like is a result of the Double R. Spithamea and 1-72-1, Ralph Moore's climbing mini breeder. That one happens to probably not to be a triploid as both parents are most likely tetraploids. No ma'am, there is nothing special to be done with a triploid. You simply make the pollination as you would with any other cross and hope you get something really odd.

The neat part of fertile triploids is you can obtain seedlings containing a third of one parent and two-thirds the other. That can yield some really remarkable results. Take a look at some of the offspring from Golden Angel on Help Me Find-Roses and you will see what I mean.
Name: Carol
Alberta, Canada (Zone 3b)
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Canadian_Rose
Sep 7, 2018 3:32 PM CST
Kim - what a cool thought about the triploids!!! I'll take a look. Thank You!
Carol
(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 7, 2018 6:15 PM CST
Carol, look at my hybrids using L56-1. That mini breeds like a triploid. The Hugonis hybrids mostly came from my 1-72-1Hugonis, which should be triploid as 1-72-1 is tetra and Hugonis is diploid. It's rather remarkable to me it has led to such a wide variety of Hugonis, Minutifolia and Puzzlement seedlings. http://www.helpmefind.com/gard...
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Sep 7, 2018 6:21 PM CST
I have two Robustas, but they never seem to form hips. The spent blooms just drop off cleanly. Does that mean the they are never fertilized?
Porkpal
(Zone 9b)
roseseek
Sep 7, 2018 9:45 PM CST
If you look on Help Me Find, you will see all of the first generation offspring of Robusta are from its pollen, not its seed. Perhaps it is seed sterile? Yours never sets hips and the three distinct first generation offspring are all from its pollen. I would say there is a good possibility it isn't a good seed setter and you should be using its pollen instead.
Name: Carol
Alberta, Canada (Zone 3b)
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Canadian_Rose
Sep 8, 2018 1:03 AM CST
Kim - Those are wonderful seedlings!! There are two that I think are exceptional...well I guess they all are! Well done! I did a cutting of Hugonis (my friend moved and couldn't take the plant with her...so I went and took a cutting)...and it's such a pretty rose! Are your seedlings once bloomers?

I'm going to show my friend your crosses. Smiling

Carol
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Sep 8, 2018 6:53 AM CST
Thanks, Kim, that makes sense.
Porkpal
Name: Arturo Tarak
Bariloche, Rio Negro, Argentin (Zone 8a)
Roses Dahlias
hampartsum
Sep 8, 2018 7:19 AM CST
@porkpal, I just went out to check my Robusta and I found something very interesting. One of the flower clusters that weren't deadheaded had a cluster by now, dry, hips! I collected two and both are empty only hairs. Would that mean that it does set hips but the fruits were empty because it didn't find compatible pollen?. I'm going to try pollinating my Robusta this next upcoming season. As more of a general comment, I'm keeping a log book of hip setting in my garden, I have a suspicion that it doesn't follow what's written in the rose literature...both ways in some places it does and in some others it doesn't. It may also change according to the years. There might be fruity years and others just blind. I would love to understand this and find correlation with climate variation. My notes will expand and include seed formation and later seed viability. I'm sure this data when completed could help incumbent breeders like myself.
Arturo
Name: Porkpal
Richmond, TX
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Keeper of Poultry Farmer Roses Raises cows
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier
porkpal
Sep 8, 2018 7:54 AM CST
A couple of others that I have never seen set hips are Lady Banks and Iceberg. How do they reproduce?
Porkpal
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
Charter ATP Member Annuals Echinacea Vegetable Grower Hybridizer Tomato Heads
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Paul2032
Sep 8, 2018 8:03 AM CST
A couple of September roses......
Sunset Celebration


Sunstruck



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Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah

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