Roses forum→Does anyone grow the Hyb. Perpetual "Charles Lefebvre", climbing or not?

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Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Sep 12, 2018 8:35 PM CST
So Palatine is offering this HP, and I can't find much about it on HelpMeFind, the other gardening boards, or here. What I can find looks lovely, BUT - I'm not finding much about disease resistance or cold hardiness. What I do find about cold hardiness is encouraging, but I'm in Northern Missouri - a cold z6a.

I'd like to hear from anyone growing this rose - even if you're in a warmer zone than I am.
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses Clematis Irises
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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zuzu
Sep 12, 2018 10:17 PM CST

Moderator

I'm not growing it, but the parents listed in our entry for it are fairly hardy: General Jacqueminot (zone 5b) x Victor Verdier (zone 6b), straddling your zone on both sides.

Rose (Rosa 'Charles Lefebvre')
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Sep 12, 2018 10:46 PM CST
So I could get it to survive, even on my north side. Climbing is another issue, but I think how winter acts in your area plays a role in that.

If I could just find something about disease resistance I could quit dithering. I may just check General Jack and Victor, and decide based on what I find. Thanks @Zuzu !
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Sep 14, 2018 3:22 PM CST
HMF says nothing about disease for Victor, only that the blooms tend to ball. For General Jack they say susceptible to mildew and rust (I've never seen the latter on roses here). For cold-hardiness they're both fine for my zone, so I shouldn't have to worry about that. Oldrosarian on the other site says Charles wanted feeding (like Hyb. Perpetuals usually do) and got some late season blackspot, which I can live with.

I'm going to take a chance on this rose! Now I just have to decide what else to order from Palatine Rolling on the floor laughing
Name: Margie
NY (Zone 7a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Photo Contest Winner 2020
MargieNY
Sep 14, 2018 3:44 PM CST
ac91z6 said:So Palatine is offering this HP, and I can't find much about it on HelpMeFind, the other gardening boards, or here. What I can find looks lovely, BUT - I'm not finding much about disease resistance or cold hardiness. What I do find about cold hardiness is encouraging, but I'm in Northern Missouri - a cold z6a.

I'd like to hear from anyone growing this rose - even if you're in a warmer zone than I am.


I sent this link to you the other day.
https://www.houzz.com/discussi...

" You have scroll down a little more than 1/2 way to a post by " taoseeker"
I thought perhaps you might know this person and you write to them.
Observe, observe, observe
We are fortunate to "see" & appreciate nature in ways others are blind.
Northern MO (Zone 6a)
ac91z6
Sep 14, 2018 5:03 PM CST
I'm just now seeing the message, @MargieNY but that IS a good thread - lots of lovely red OGRs (and Austins) talked about in there. Still getting the hang of a 'new' site. *Blush* Some other pretty options in there too, and an abundance of different zones represented!

Some info on Victor in there! I probably couldn't find much because I've been looking for "Victor Verdier" and it's Madame VV. Looks like Charles likes some afternoon shade - I'll site him accordingly. Looks like Taoseeker hasn't been active for a few years on that site, sadly. I'll hunt through some of their other posts on the Rose forum to try and figure out what zone they're in.

Thank you for that link! Hurray!
Name: Margie
NY (Zone 7a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Photo Contest Winner 2020
MargieNY
Sep 14, 2018 5:33 PM CST
ac91z6 said:I'm just now seeing the message, @MargieNY but that IS a good thread - lots of lovely red OGRs (and Austins) talked about in there. Still getting the hang of a 'new' site. *Blush* Some other pretty options in there too, and an abundance of different zones represented!

Some info on Victor in there! I probably couldn't find much because I've been looking for "Victor Verdier" and it's Madame VV. Looks like Charles likes some afternoon shade - I'll site him accordingly. Looks like Taoseeker hasn't been active for a few years on that site, sadly. I'll hunt through some of their other posts on the Rose forum to try and figure out what zone they're in.

Thank you for that link! Hurray!


ac91z6,
here they are talking about Souvenir du Dr Jamain getting too much sun. " Souvenir du Dr Jamain. Rich fragrance, velvet texture. Bred by Lacharme, France 1865, a seedling from 'Charles Lefebvre'.
https://teddingtongardener.com...
Observe, observe, observe
We are fortunate to "see" & appreciate nature in ways others are blind.
[Last edited by MargieNY - Sep 14, 2018 5:36 PM (+)]
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Name: Margie
NY (Zone 7a)
Garden Ideas: Level 1 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Photo Contest Winner 2020
MargieNY
Sep 14, 2018 5:47 PM CST
ac91z6, if you click on the text underneath the photo of Souvenir du Dr Jamain, the author mentions it gets powdery mildew. I don't know if it necessarily means that C.V. would acquire it but at least you are aware of the possibility.
Observe, observe, observe
We are fortunate to "see" & appreciate nature in ways others are blind.
Name: Shyam
San Francisco, CA (Zone 10b)
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Rose_Guy1127
Sep 14, 2018 11:28 PM CST
Reading this thread led me to Souvenir du Docteur Jamain, and I fell in love with it. Unfortunately, I don't seem to have luck in locating it online. Could anyone help me, please? I would love to grow this beauty in my backyard!
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses Clematis Irises
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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zuzu
Sep 14, 2018 11:42 PM CST

Moderator

HMF lists 5 pages of sources, some of which are in the United States. I'd recommend A Reverence for Roses if it's currently available from that nursery.

http://www.helpmefind.com/gard...

(Edited to say, currently sold out at A Reverence for Roses.)
[Last edited by zuzu - Sep 14, 2018 11:44 PM (+)]
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Name: Shyam
San Francisco, CA (Zone 10b)
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Rose_Guy1127
Sep 15, 2018 12:04 AM CST
Thanks, @zuzu, I just found on it A Reverence for Roses as well, and you're right about it being out of stock. I requested for the back-in-stock email notification. I don't mind waiting for this beauty to be back in stock. The nursery has a good collection of heritage/old garden roses!
Name: Amanda
KC metro area, Missouri (Zone 6a)
Roses Zinnias Region: Missouri Cat Lover Dog Lover Bookworm
Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: United States of America Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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pepper23
Sep 15, 2018 2:25 AM CST
I have Souvenir du Docteur Jamain and I love it!! I do have it in a bad spot though and it's not happy at all so I need to figure out where to move it to where it won't get fried but not get run over by the mower which is what looks like has happened. Sighing!

Now that I think about it I might rip out my grafted Double Delight that is nearby and was planted just to be a filler in that spot this year. I'll have to remember that tomorrow and dig them 2 up and move them. Love DD but rather have Jamain since it's own root.

Shyam, A Reverence for Roses sends nice roses. Can't go wrong with them.
Name: Shyam
San Francisco, CA (Zone 10b)
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Rose_Guy1127
Sep 15, 2018 8:22 AM CST
@pepper23: Sorry about your souvenir's suffering from ample sunlight and the lawn mower. Talking about the wrong spot, I had to move my Princess Alexandra of Kent to a sunny place because, unlike it listed as shade tolerant on the DA website, it thrives well in 5 hours of sunlight. It was sad watching it bud only to be unable to bloom fully when it was in its former location. You're right about moving it to a different location. I did some reading on Souvenir du Dr. Jamain. An article states that the rose will do well in a shady spot (east facing location that gets morning sun and afternoon shade). I think that all dark colored roses will do well in partial shade location that will prevent them from being fried under an excess of sun exposure.

Thanks for the positive recommendation on A Reverence for Roses. Wish I knew the nursery early on. Any idea when they usually restock for Spring planting?
East TN (Zone 7a)
Kesroses
Sep 15, 2018 9:18 AM CST
Thank you, thank you, thank you Margie, for the link to the houzz discussion on red roses! One of the things I lost during the great houzz debacle was the ability to access past threads. If someone else pulled it up, I could read it but my searches wouldn't go anywhere. This was a good one, too.
Name: Amanda
KC metro area, Missouri (Zone 6a)
Roses Zinnias Region: Missouri Cat Lover Dog Lover Bookworm
Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: United States of America Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
Image
pepper23
Sep 15, 2018 1:22 PM CST
Sign up for their newsletter and you will get an email when they restock or have a blowout sale because they have too many roses in the greenhouse. They don't spam you, they only email when they have something to say. Smiling
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses Clematis Irises
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
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zuzu
Sep 15, 2018 2:34 PM CST

Moderator

Shyam, here's a thread that was started two years ago when we discovered this new nursery. It'll give you an idea of the great sales they have. It also has lots of photos of the roses they ship. They really put other own-root nurseries to shame.

The thread "New Rose Nursery" in Roses forum
Name: Shyam
San Francisco, CA (Zone 10b)
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Rose_Guy1127
Sep 15, 2018 11:14 PM CST
After reading the A Reverence For Roses thread on the forum, I checked the nursery website and ordered the following roses:
Dupuy Jamain
Mademoiselle Blanche Lafitte
Rosette Delizy

Looking forward to growing these French beauties!
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses Clematis Irises
Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
Image
zuzu
Sep 16, 2018 12:00 AM CST

Moderator

A nicely varied selection, both in classes (a hybrid perpetual, a bourbon, and a tea) and in colors (red, pale pink, and multicolor red-apricot-yellow).
Name: Amanda
KC metro area, Missouri (Zone 6a)
Roses Zinnias Region: Missouri Cat Lover Dog Lover Bookworm
Native Plants and Wildflowers Region: United States of America Million Pollinator Garden Challenge
Image
pepper23
Sep 16, 2018 8:52 AM CST
Dang it, now I have to go look those up!! D'Oh! D'Oh!
Zone 9, Sunset Zone 9 (Zone 9b)
Roses
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Mustbnuts
Sep 16, 2018 12:16 PM CST
Rogue Valley also carries the Dr. as well. However they state it is out of stock at the moment.
[Last edited by Mustbnuts - Sep 16, 2018 12:17 PM (+)]
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