Comment concerning : Wrong rose, Paul

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Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
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zuzu
Jun 7, 2012 10:57 PM CST

Plants Admin

You (and BlissfulGarden) have actually posted your images on the wrong page. This 'Beloved' is a white-blend hybrid tea, a sport of 'Memoriam.'

Cesar E. Chavez still has that name, regardless of whatever J&P decided to call it later. It's here:

Rose (Rosa 'Cesar E. Chavez')

I'll move your images to the correct page.
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
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Paul2032
Jun 8, 2012 7:46 AM CST
Good to know.....I can't remember where I got that incorrect information but have always thought it to be true. I bought the rose in 2006 and have the JP paper tag which says "new this year" and calls it "possibly the most outstanding red hybrid tea of the past decade". I'm was curious as to why when I typed Beloved into the data base that it called up both Beloved and Cesar E. Chavez. I'll change my records and refer to it as CC.....As I think about it I've seen it a friends garden and she had it marked Beloved. Thanks
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
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Paul2032
Jun 8, 2012 8:09 AM CST
Here is the tag that was on the rose. I Googled Beloved and there is what must be much wrong info there also. I feel bad when I add incorrect information. Wayside Gardens also sold the incorrect Beloved. There must be 1000's of people growing a rose they think is Beloved but is not.
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Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
[Last edited by Paul2032 - Jun 8, 2012 9:31 AM (+)]
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Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
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zuzu
Jun 8, 2012 11:16 AM CST

Plants Admin

The people at J&P regularly rename their roses, Paul. It's a marketing ploy. You might not buy Cesar A. Chavez twice, but you're likely to buy Beloved if you think it's a new rose. When they do that renaming thing, the name 'Beloved' is added to the possible names of 'Cesar A. Chavez,' and that's why it came up on search for you. You and everyone else are fully entitled to call the rose 'Beloved' because that is one of its names now, but you can't post photos of it on a page for a white hybrid tea. Smiling If the search engine provides you with more than one option, read the description to make sure you're posting the image in the right place.
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
Charter ATP Member Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Annuals Echinacea Vegetable Grower Hybridizer
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Paul2032
Jun 8, 2012 11:57 AM CST
Dave's Garden has one poor quality picture of 'Beloved' and it is of a yellow rose and they call it a yellow rose. Isn't J&P pretty well a thing of the past now? What about Edmonds? Who is introducing the "new" roses?
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
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zuzu
Jun 8, 2012 12:19 PM CST

Plants Admin

Dave's Garden is full of misinformation, unfortunately. The rose is white, not yellow. DG also says the rose was "hybridized by Hill," but it wasn't. It's a sport of 'Memoriam' and it was discovered by Ernest Hill.

J&P and the J&P roses do appear to be nearly defunct now. I don't think there will be any new J&P roses. I'm not sure what's going to happen to Weeks roses and to the new Meillands now that Star Roses appears to be folding. Edmunds' Roses has been selling the new Weeks roses a year ahead of anyone else, but the plants from that nursery are vastly inferior to the plants from other sources, so I doubt that it will gain any kind of official status as an "introducer."

Palatine is doing a great job of introducing the new Kordes roses.
Name: Paul
Utah (Zone 5b)
Grandchildren are my greatest joy.
Charter ATP Member Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Annuals Echinacea Vegetable Grower Hybridizer
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Paul2032
Jun 8, 2012 12:44 PM CST
This, to me, is an interesting conversation. Is anyone introducing the classic high centered HT's anymore or are they becoming a thing of the past? Is there more interest in the development and marketing of other types of roses. Big changes in the plant industry. Over many years I used to order Tuberous begonia tubers from Antonelli's in Capitola. Then I heard they were providing seed to another company and they were producing tubers they called American Hybrids. For a few years I found those tubers locally and they were wonderful ruffly beautifully colored flowers. Now I can't find those any more. I saw some plants in bloom yesterday at a nursery with American Hybrid tags and they were very plain Jane. [Forgive me if your name is Jane]. So I don't think I will see wonderful Tuberous Begonias again. Things change and I am getting older and don't like change much.
Paul Smith Pleasant Grove, Utah
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jun 8, 2012 12:55 PM CST

Plants Admin

The new Weeks, Meilland, and Kordes roses always include high-centered hybrid teas each year.

Antonelli Brothers was a great source, but it suffered a massive fire 4 or 5 years ago and never recovered. It eventually filed for bankruptcy and shut its doors. I think Golden State Direct inherited Antonelli's stock and is still in business. The AmeriHybrid begonias are still available from many online sources.

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