Wow, LG! I am envious that you could work in the garden already. Thanks for sharing those pictures with us. Did you amend the soil before planting them?

Knowing that I have a propagation bug I would have probably tried to divide Kamata Nishiki if I have to move it. I am surprised that Silver Waves on a Magenta Ocean after 10 years does not have a good root system, even it is so big.

If you aren't planning to save seeds, don't forget to remove those seed pods, in a timely fashion..
I think they tend to expend quite a bit of energy trying to reproduce, by seeds.

It can be a delicate balance, between sun, & shade in warmer areas.
If you don't already have adequate enough natural afternoon shade, perhaps consider a planted "shade tree" area.

I always liked the idea of a mulched "bed, full" of all sorts of "tree" peonies. Although my back will refuse to cooperate, with my ideas !
I think they just may start to show improved growth, LG.
Just keep in mind, where the late summer sun shines, later on into the day...

(I paid attention to that Hoki comment !)
Edit, to correct the cultivar name, as I had 'Kao', on my mind, from a recent mail order, at the time.

Thanks Alex. Our winters are very mild here. The ground rarely freezes.

I did put Azomite, lime, greensand, bulb food, and biochar in the bottom of the holes. I sprinkled mychorrize on the roots and filled the holes halfway up, soaked with water, let it drain and filled with unamended soil to ground level and watered again.

Silver Waves did have extensive roots, but they broke off. I covered the hole up. It would be awesome if it sent up some growth, but no eyes were left in the ground, so it would have to be adventitious.

I did think about splitting Kamata Nishiki, because I could see two clear divisions. But I decided to leave it in one piece. Maybe it will like its new home so much it will send up new stems.

You did everything right LG give it time. I split koukamon in the fall of 2018, did not see it last spring, butI did clean it up today and from what I see it didn't do much there are a few buds on it so it's alive a few pictures from then

Thanks for your advice, Shawn. I will watch them carefully, remove any blooms quickly, and be prepared to give them shade.

Your Koukamon looks very healthy, Oscar. Did you do anything to the exposed wound where you split it?
Hopefully you will have nice weather so you can get all your beds cleaned up and ready for Spring.

LG the picture in bloom is before I divided it and no I did not do any thing to the wounds you got me thinking now

I have also wondered about what to do with wounds, I saw someone on facebook say cut root ends needed to dry before being replanted, and somewhere else I saw a mention of cinnamon, but I have no clue.

LG, I am sorry silver waves feeder roots broke, but I am sure it has a big enough main root that it will grow more.
Is there a reason you amended the bottom of the hole instead of the entire soil, or the top to leach down with rainwater?

The only animal seen recently have been crows, but I have found damage on 4 woodies =/.
Some buds were just knocked off, but two have split.
Should I cut the ones that are split to have a clean even cut, instead of waiting to see if that section begins to regrow?



This one only this bit of stem was above soil, I did check the root photo I took upon delivery, and it does have a good bit of stem and buds below the surface.


This one had 2 buds knocked off but has a good many more showing, but it also had about 1 and 1/2 inch of tightly formed new growth that is now split, in the left of the photo.


2 above ground buds knocked off, but root photos show there is at least 1 more below the soil.


Now have them covered with milk crates!

Thanks for your encouragement with Silver Waves, David. It is a vigorous variety in my opinion.

I read somewhere that you shouldn't have the roots in contact with the fertilizer, so I plant all my peonies this way. The new roots will grow into the amended area. I do dig very large holes, so they have several inches of loosened soil around them. My natural soil is quite full of organic matter and is not hard clay.

I am so sorry about the crow damage. I would make a clean cut on those damaged stems. And pick up the knocked off buds. You don't want some other animal to eat them and like the taste.

Look around for one of those large plastic owls and put it in your garden to try to keep the crows away.

David, I've had bird problems with my woody peonies here on CO as well but my offenders are turkeys! Love them because they keep the insects under control—we had a huge problem with grasshoppers before the turkeys moved in, but they scratch in the mulch at the bottom of the plant for food. I had to cover most of my woodies with tomato cages to keep them from damaging newly emerged foliage.
Oscar, I've never done anything to coat or close the wound after dividing either. A lot of people say to wait 24 hours before replanting to allow the edges to dry out, I have done that at times, can't say if it helps any at all.

I'm sorry about that damage, David. As I'd never experienced any problem like that, in the past.
I had no idea Crows, could do something such as that. I guess anything is possible.

I thought the flower buds, for the next year, are formed in tiny dark red "bud shoots" , which appeared during the previous year.

I think I would have been rather reluctant to divide that Kamata Nishiki, myself.
(Though if it were mine) LG, I'd probably give it another year or two, at least.
I would imagine loosening up the soil, by having replanted, may just help to move it along.
Making it easier to divide, if you chose to do so.

I suppose it mainly all depends on one's own preference, if you like one way it looks now, or the other, if you did so.
Similar to having sited it, given more full sun, or a slightly more open appearance, by having sited with somewhat more shade ?

I had wondered about division, of the "woody" type, as to if it gets cut apart with a particular kind of saw?
Then, at a point where the least amount of the root would be exposed, to reduce amount of newly cut, areas.


It never seemed to be an issue, or concern when dividing roots of herbaceous/lactiflora kind.
Only that they tended to be rather brittle, & some easily "split" , or broke apart, in the older areas near the center.
(Where very little of the crown, held them together.)

Meanwhile, I'm already thinking about any newly grafted ones, & eventually having to remove all of those unwanted, quickly growing shoots that appear, just beneath the soil surface !
(I can't count the number of times, that had to be done.)

Looking forward to how well your 'Kamata Fuji' does, this coming Spring, along with how well your others do.
Including, was it I think, your 'Hana Kisoi', now that it has been freed from nearby tree roots.

Shawn, I think all of the big growers in the states graft woody scions onto lactiflora roots which typically don't produce any new herbaceous growth, especially if planted at proper depth. There probably are some exceptions and unique circumstances but lactis aren't known to have adventitious roots. Every single new growth that I've had from the ground on every roots I've purchased from the big growers has been woody growth.

I know Nate uses his Edulis Superba as a nurse root for grafts and it works very well if the peony is planted deep enough so no shoots from the nurse root reach the surface.

Liz, I'm not really certain why it was three particular grafted ones. They were at my parent's house, & after I'd "garden" for them, often times my dad would go right behind me, & "change it up". (I planted them, & he moved them, & I moved them - again!)
I guess because he'd notice what was different, & was retired, & wanted something or other, to do.

Perhaps by then, I ought to have dug them up, & simply tried to remove the lactiflora roots. They somehow kept on trying to grow, once left behind.
Someone eventually dug out those lactiflora.

I recall a friend's neighbor had one, (I suppose "gansu" type ? ) As that one was dug up before my eyes.
There was barely anything that remained, of the original root, whichever had been used.
It didn't appear to have ever had anything else grow from that root.
That one had started to grow a very long, deep tap root. Broke her own pick axe, while digging it up.

She then later decided to throw it away, as she had expected it to bloom more often. I wished I'd known ! (As I had helped her to replant it, after all that.)

Thanks, for that detail Anya.

I may have allowed just one "eye" to flower, out of plain curiosity & it appeared to be a single white lactiflora from what I recall.

I used to have to sort of dig down with my hands, deep enough to wrestle with every "eye" to snap them off. I have no other way to describe it !

They were tough rubbery like buggers, & not easily snapped off. No idea why.
If I'd compared it to any of some of the older lactiflora cultivars I grew, they'd have easily broken off, even if it were by accident. .

One of the peony collectors (or prior collector, think their collection was given away) posted on FB about how it used to be common to dig up grafted tree peonies after 10 years or so and cut off the nurse root and that the practice has pretty much stopped. Maybe using lactis not known to be adventitious was more recently adopted.

I wasn't always so certain, about which kind of root was being used until allowing some to grow.
I think some, may have just so happened to be P. ostii roots, & then I'd have to figure out which, was what.

To see if growth that came from below the soil level, matched the cultivar foliage, or not.

Liz, I started way back in the late 1980's. I'm on way to starting all over again. While the drainage here, isn't very good, except in just one area.

Back then, I think they were only about seven, or $8. apiece.
Others, by mail order, may have been $12.99, not including shipping.
I think I had paid about $12.50 plus tax, for a Japanese variety at a local Garden Center.
I simply gave it away !
It's all good though, & I'm going to enjoy myself in the process.

It certainly has changed! Just in the last 3-5 years we've watched new intros go from $150-250 to over $500...guess they're worth what the market will allow. Good for them, hopefully some profits will keep today's growers and hybridizers growing and hybridizing!

Liz...my husband and I often wonder, who buys the $500...but I'm with you...hope it keeps growers in business!

Shawn...love all the things you have tried and am learning lots.

Shawn, I remember when they first introduced tree peonies to mass market stores. My first ones came from Kmart in little boxes with a color photo on it. They were cheap.

I do believe that most of the ones buying the high priced peonies are folks in the peony business. They can grow them on and then offer them to their customers in a few years.

And they're often advertised as good seed or pollen parents for hybridizing, guess it could be written off as a business expense!