Roses forum: New here, need advice re: RRD

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Aymstx
Jun 5, 2013 10:11 AM CST
Hi everyone,
I"m Amy, from Tx, and I hoping you don't mind me starting this new thread, but I couldn't really find an answer to my question on any database, and I figured there might be plenty of people experienced with Rose Rosette here that might be able to offer some advice.

I have two rows of gorgeous Cinco de Mayos maybe 15 feet apart. I found evidence of RRD in about 4 of 8 plants in one row, and only one cane in one plant in another row. I very obviously need to dig and bag the aforementioned 4 cincos, but should I remove the remaining 4 as a precaution, or take a wait-and-see approach?
I removed the cane from the plant in the other row, but I just get sick to my stomach when I think about removing the whole plant on that side, as it they are all doing so beautifully on the other side.
I thought about replacing the ones I take out with more CdM's but I don't know how many yet are infected...I don't want to put in new ones just to have the established guys infecting them. They are very, very close to the neighbor's red knockouts, and so far his have remain unscathed. Of course, it's the Knock outs that survive.

I just got 3 new Julia Childs that I wanted to plant 20 feet away, and now I'm trying to figure out what to do with them...

Thanks for any advice - this is my first (and I wish last) bout with this disease!
Amy
Name: aka GardenQuilts
Pocono Mountains, PA
Andi
Jun 5, 2013 10:43 AM CST
I have never had rosette disease. First, I would make sure that I had the disease from a local expert - either from cooperative extension or from a university.

Did you get all of these roses from the same supplier? At the same time? If so, call the supplier/store and DEMAND a refund. They should know that there may be a problem and not sell any more of these roses. I wouldn't buy anything from that supplier/source again unless they were able to explain the problem and convince me that they ahd solved it.

I saw some hostas that I thought might be virused at a big box store and alerted the manager. He didn't seem to care. No more plants for me from that store. I wrote a letter to the CEO about it as well. (That is my new hobby - complaining in writing to CEOs.) I was sent a gift certificate which I spent on non plant items, but the suspect hostas were still on sale. I could have been wrong about the virus. The complete disregard and ignorance of the manager was what concerned me. He should have either assured me that the hostas were from virus free stock (if so, they were mislabeled) or admitted that he didn't know about hosta virus, but would check with the experts at the main office - assuming there were experts at the main office.

I would dig up the infected plants and remove as much soil from that area as possible. Then, I would wash all of my tools, gloves, clothes, pots, etc. very well. If I had to drag the infected plants to the store and make a scene, I would. Otherwise, I would photograph them, look into having them tested and burn them. If the other ones came from the same source, I would at least put them in pots and keep them far away from my other roses. I would refrain from buying any more roses until the entire mess was cleared up one way or another.

If your Julia Child roses were from another source, I would put them in pots with purchased soil (or soil from somewhere other than your garden) using cleaned tools. I would keep them as far as possible from your diseased roses and the dirt where the diseased roses were growing.

I read that rosette disease could be spread from wild roses. Take a walk around your home and see if there are other apparently infected roses in the wild or in other people's gardens.

You could always grow some hot pink knockouts to clash with the neighbor's red ones.
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jun 5, 2013 10:56 AM CST

Moderator

We don't have RRD here, so I can't give you any advice based on personal experience, but I think the pathogen is airborne, so planting other roses in purchased soil wouldn't eliminate the problem. Also, I think I've heard that burning the infected roses is likely to spread the pathogen, so you should dispose of them in some other way rather than burning them.

Andi's right about the wild roses. Rosa multiflora appears to be the culprit.

Sadly, all of your roses probably are infected by now, so all you can do is dispose of the obviously infected ones and enjoy the others as long as you can.
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
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Skiekitty
Jun 5, 2013 11:17 AM CST
Found this on the American Rose Society on how it's spread & where it's at. Looks like no one is safe.

http://www.ars.org/?page_id=3241
http://www.ars.org/?page_id=3247

Another interesting article on how to deal with it.
http://www.greenhousegrower.com/article/32859/reducing-the-s...

This one suggests burning
http://www.ca.uky.edu/agcollege/plantpathology/ext_files/PPF...

I love the information from MoBOT (Missouri Botanical Gardens)
http://www.missouribotanicalgarden.org/gardens-gardening/you...
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats

Aymstx
Jun 5, 2013 11:34 AM CST
Sigh...thanks so much. That's kind of what I was expecting, but I guess I didn't want to hear it. I just got my blue balloon flowers blooming and they are really striking against the orange of the CdM's. It just kills me to get rid of them. I think I will let the others across the way live until I see more obvious disease.
I am certain it's rose rosette, and yes, they came from the same 'big box' store. I couldn't resist. They were late summer super-clearance guys (like 2 for 5 bucks) with no flowers or buds to speak of. Every time I went by there, they were just baking in the hot texas sun in a corner by themselves, and finally I took pity on them and put them right smack in front of my house. This spring they came back like gangbusters, smelled heavenly, and would really take your breath away.
I do back up to a very large field/wooded area. God only knows what's in there, it's so thick and brushy that nobody ever ventures in there, and we sit up above it, so I don't even have access if I even dared.
I think I will just go ahead with the Julia Childs, and it they eventually go, so be it, and then no more roses. And that's funny about planting to clash with the neighbor's KOs, I was actually trying to HIDE their roses with mine!
Thanks so much!!
Amy
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Jun 5, 2013 12:12 PM CST
Amy - Actually, what I would do in your situation personally is try own-root. If you're afraid that the mites got into your soil, backhoe it out (or shovel..) and replace it with garden soil from a nursery. But I couldn't find anything stating that the mites live in the soil. Then buy own-root roses. They're way more expensive than the the 2/$5, but at least you know that they're gonna make it. Or, I'd order roses from Palatine.. their roses are the best!
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jun 5, 2013 12:14 PM CST

Moderator

I stand corrected on the negative effects of burning. Maybe I was thinking about Poison Oak. Smiling
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jun 5, 2013 12:16 PM CST

Moderator

Toni, why would you imagine that own-root roses would be immune? All of the Rosa multiflora plants are own-root and they're the most susceptible.
Name: Toni
Denver Metro (Zone 5a)
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Charter ATP Member Irises Salvias Xeriscape Birds I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Procrastinator The WITWIT Badge Region: Colorado Enjoys or suffers cold winters Cat Lover
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Skiekitty
Jun 5, 2013 12:27 PM CST
zuzu said:Toni, why would you imagine that own-root roses would be immune? All of the Rosa multiflora plants are own-root and they're the most susceptible.


Just read this part of this article: In Texas,rose rosette was discovered around Tyler in 1990 in fields of multiflora roses being grown for use as rootstocks. I figured that roses grown own-root wouldn't be multiflora... ?
Roses are one of my passions! Just opened, my Etsy shop (to fund my rose hobby)! http://www.etsy.com/shop/TweetsnTreats
Name: Cindi
Wichita, Kansas (Zone 7a)
Charter ATP Member Plant and/or Seed Trader Permaculture Roses Ponds Peonies
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CindiKS
Jun 5, 2013 2:01 PM CST
RRD is rampant in my area. I've removed over 30 roses so far. It has affected every class of rose. Nothing is immune. Buying from one place over another isn't going to make any difference.
I suspect the woods or fields around you harbor multiflora roses. Out here,they were planted years ago as a barrier for livestock. Multiflora is seen as an easy host for the mite and the disease. Once the disease gets into the sap of any of your roses, YOU will spread it with your tools.
We are now carrying tubs of clorox wipes and wiping off the pruners between roses. It's quite a hassle when you have 350 roses!
SEveral years ago, when the disease first appeared here, we thought we could just prune off the affected branch. On some roses, that stopped it. On others, it did nothing to slow it down. I discovered that if i replanted another rose where I had removed a diseased one, the new one would (100% of the time), develop the disease.
I now plant a lilac or some other shrub in that spot so I am not tempted to place another rose there. No one knows for sure how long that area should be quarantined. i think maybe as long as it takes all the leftover roots to die completely.
We don't burn the roses here. We bag them up in a trash bag that won't decompose for 100 years, and send them to the dump.
i wouldn't advise taking out roses that are symptom-free, but I would suggest spacing any new ones several feet away from where the diseased ones were. I had a closely planted group of 6 Julia Childs. Three got RRD, the rest haven't. No clue why.
Don't let it stop you from growing roses. I know of at least one university that is researching a cure.
Oh...another thing. Knock Out roses get unfairly blamed for the spread of this disease. Here, what happened was, commercial areas used Knock Out roses by the thousands because they stay beautiful all year. Crews of "landscapers" came in to prune them, and used shears or string trimmers and just went down the rows, trimming all at the same height. If any one of the many thousands had the disease, all were then exposed. The landlords were reluctant to remove the infected roses, so they stayed at least 2 years before enough gardeners screamed about it. If those mass plantings had all been Julia Childs, that rose would have been blamed. Now our commercial areas are back to ugly green meatball shrubs.
Remember that children, marriages, and flower gardens reflect the kind of care they get.
H. Jackson Brown, Jr.
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
Forum moderator Plant Database Moderator Charter ATP Member Region: California Cat Lover Roses
Clematis Irises Garden Ideas: Level 2 Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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zuzu
Jun 5, 2013 2:02 PM CST

Moderator

That's illogical, Toni. You say it was discovered "in fields of multiflora roses being grown for use as rootstocks." If they were being grown for use as rootstock, they must have been own-root roses themselves.

Own-root roses are just as susceptible, if not more so in view of the fact that R. multiflora, which is always own-root, and the Knock Out roses, most of which are own-root roses, are the ones that are being affected most.

I wonder why they were growing multiflora for rootstock in Texas. As far as I know, only the Canadian nurseries (Hortico, Pickering, and Palatine) use R. multiflora as rootstock. The rootstock of choice in Texas is Dr. Huey, and possibly R. fortuniana.
[Last edited by zuzu - Jun 5, 2013 2:03 PM (+)]
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Name: Cindi
Wichita, Kansas (Zone 7a)
Charter ATP Member Plant and/or Seed Trader Permaculture Roses Ponds Peonies
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CindiKS
Jun 5, 2013 2:26 PM CST
Just read the links Toni posted. An entomologist who is researching RRd came to talk to our Master Gardener group and to the rose society. There are no chemicals out there yet that you can use that will be effective against the mite or the plasma. i can't believe that MOBOT actually mentioned using Sevin! yikes! There's no worse chemical out there for the bees! Sevin will not prevent, or help any rose fight off, RRD.
Grumbling
Remember that children, marriages, and flower gardens reflect the kind of care they get.
H. Jackson Brown, Jr.
Name: Cindi
Wichita, Kansas (Zone 7a)
Charter ATP Member Plant and/or Seed Trader Permaculture Roses Ponds Peonies
Lilies Irises Daylilies Dog Lover Beekeeper Garden Ideas: Master Level
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CindiKS
Jun 5, 2013 2:28 PM CST
Pretty sure what they mean is, the multiflora in Texas was just wild in the fields around the nurseries. It's all over in the fields around here, too.
Remember that children, marriages, and flower gardens reflect the kind of care they get.
H. Jackson Brown, Jr.

Aymstx
Jun 5, 2013 4:18 PM CST
Thanks, everyone. Now I feel like I have a plan, and I am REALLY glad to know not to put a new rose back in the same spot, even though a couple of articles I read suggested it *might* be okay!
I always have trouble finding just the right plant to fit my needs, and it's going to be especially tough to find a perfect replacement for these Cincos - they set the bar awfully high for me.
I haven't seen a case of RRD on a knockout around here, yet. It will be devastating for this area once it gets here. The builders in this area must think that no new house is complete without a red knockout, Stella d'oros, and petunias in front. We actually had to opt out of the knockout!
Thanks again!
Name: aka GardenQuilts
Pocono Mountains, PA
Andi
Jun 5, 2013 8:32 PM CST
So many plant diseases start when developers plant tons of the same plant in developments. When one plant develops a disease, it spreads to the entire neighborhood. It is sad for this to be happening with roses.

Too bad those meatball shrubs - my friend calls them turd bushes - are immune to most everything except dog pee and hedge clippers.

American developers are too cheap to buy enough shrubs to make a decent planting. I hated hedges and turd bushes until I went to England. If they are planted and maintained properly, they can be beautiful. Unfortunately, in suburbia they dot the landscape like aesthetic tumors.

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