Sempervivum and Jovibarba forum: Semp types discussion

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Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
JungleShadows
Aug 30, 2013 11:10 PM CST
Betty Bronow had a classification of semp types that I've always liked:

SATINS: Absolutely smooth leaves


VELVETS: Surface velvety all over leaf but not with prominent hairs


TUFTED: Hybrids of cobwebs with only the cobweb at the tip


COBWEBS: Only those withe hairs that connect from one leaf tip to another in a consistent manner



Think that is a good start at grouping them.

Kevin

[Last edited by valleylynn - Aug 31, 2013 9:33 AM (+)]
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Name: Julia
Washington State (Zone 7a)
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springcolor
Aug 30, 2013 11:42 PM CST
That's a good classification and somewhat easy to remember. Thumbs up I'm going on a fuzzy semp hunt around my yard in the morning.
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 30, 2013 11:47 PM CST

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What about the ones with heavy cilia all along the leaves, not just the tip tufting?

Hmm, may have to ask Dave to change the categories in the database.
Name: Janice
Cape Cod, MA, USA (Zone 7a)
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sandnsea2
Aug 31, 2013 8:49 AM CST
Thank you, Kevin!!!
What wonderful classifications! Thumbs up Thumbs up

I think with the camera power we now have we can see the tiny cilia alot better and most all semps seem to have them along the leaf edge I think?

Lynn, Kevin what do you think?
[Last edited by sandnsea2 - Aug 31, 2013 9:13 AM (+)]
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Name: Janice
Cape Cod, MA, USA (Zone 7a)
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sandnsea2
Aug 31, 2013 9:21 AM CST
Red Pluche is very furry but does have some faint webbing.

How would it be classified?

[Last edited by sandnsea2 - Aug 31, 2013 9:22 AM (+)]
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 31, 2013 11:40 AM CST

Moderator

Great point Janice.
I know some of the arach. type semps can have heavy webbing certain times of the year, and minimal webbing during the wet season.
Summer is when my webbed ones have heavy webbing. Winter/early spring many have very light webbing, and some have none.

Is your Red Pluche grown in full sun? How much water does it get? Those things can determine how much webbing it will show in the summer.

I have a question. How would this semp of Bev's be classified? I would think this one would be a velvet type one. The cilia is uniformly heavy all over the leaves.
webesemps said: Thumb of 2013-08-31/webesemps/2fefdc

Name: Janice
Cape Cod, MA, USA (Zone 7a)
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sandnsea2
Aug 31, 2013 12:24 PM CST
Red Pluche is in full sun and has only been watered weekly weakly.
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
JungleShadows
Aug 31, 2013 1:22 PM CST
And yes you are right that there are some of them that also have parts of both classifications, for example velvety types with a bit of tufting. They would be in BOTH.

The ones with edged cilia could be another, although in many cases the leaves are still satin except for the edges. Am not sure where I would put the ciliosums. They aren't really cobwebs but they certainly have hair. Last year I did a cross of ciliosum from Ali Botusch X arachnoideum and the one surviving seedling is a total FUZZ BALL.

I would add one more category for "oddly formed" rosettes that would include things like 'Oddity', 'Weirdo', and 'Fuzzy Wuzzy' that are distinctive for rosette form.

Like any classification system, the plants don't know they have to sit in the neat little pigeonholes that we have made for them! However, I do think it is a useful buying guide for gardeners as they might prefer one type or another. Also the velvety ones tend to rot more easily in warmer, wetter climates so you might avoid them entirely if you lived in those climates.

Kevin
Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 31, 2013 1:27 PM CST

Moderator

How would you describe the one in the post above, of Bev's 'hairy' semp?
Name: Janice
Cape Cod, MA, USA (Zone 7a)
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sandnsea2
Aug 31, 2013 2:07 PM CST
Thanks so much, Kevin!! I tip my hat to you. I tip my hat to you.
This is so so helpful!!! I'm all ears!

JungleShadows said:And yes you are right that there are some of them that also have parts of both classifications, for example velvety types with a bit of tufting. They would be in BOTH.

The ones with edged cilia could be another, although in many cases the leaves are still satin except for the edges. Am not sure where I would put the ciliosums. They aren't really cobwebs but they certainly have hair. Last year I did a cross of ciliosum from Ali Botusch X arachnoideum and the one surviving seedling is a total FUZZ BALL.

I would add one more category for "oddly formed" rosettes that would include things like 'Oddity', 'Weirdo', and 'Fuzzy Wuzzy' that are distinctive for rosette form.

Like any classification system, the plants don't know they have to sit in the neat little pigeonholes that we have made for them! However, I do think it is a useful buying guide for gardeners as they might prefer one type or another. Also the velvety ones tend to rot more easily in warmer, wetter climates so you might avoid them entirely if you lived in those climates.

Kevin


Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Aug 31, 2013 8:48 PM CST
Since ciliosum is a different semp all together, I think its fitting that it have its own "corner" Semps with ciliosum parents do have a unique look (in my opinion) nodding
Lynn I would say Bev's is velvety since the hair is all over. I have seen the velvety ones get tufts in summer... Thumbs up
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
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valleylynn
Aug 31, 2013 9:32 PM CST

Moderator

The Pacific Mauve photo in an above post never has tufting or longer cilia. Always just that lovely soft velvet to it's leaves.

Maybe what Kevin is saying is that Bev's above semp should be classified as Velvet and heavy cilia?
Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
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webesemps
Aug 31, 2013 9:41 PM CST
Hey, if what Kevin says about Velvets rotting easier then maybe the heavy cilia could help it survive better? I hope so for the sake of my Velvet and Heavy Cilia Semp offsets that I just planted into my semp bed?... Crying
Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Aug 31, 2013 9:43 PM CST

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So far I've not had any problems with them in my beds. As long as the soil drains quickly. I found that out the hard way. Had to raise my beds higher because of the water table during winter and spring.
All is well now.
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Aug 31, 2013 10:33 PM CST
Bev maybe you have to send a couple offsets north for the winter...just in case! hint hint! Lovey dubby Rolling on the floor laughing Rolling on the floor laughing
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling

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