Sempervivum and Jovibarba forum: Need ID of the REAL Red Lion

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Name: Cliff Hughes
Front Royal, Va (Zone 6a)
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Cahac
Apr 28, 2014 9:06 PM CST
I have 4 for sure and i think there is another1 i haven't run across yet that i have bought & traded for over the years of Red Lion. and All are different would like to know which is the real 1.
the 1st pics are of 2 that i got last year these 2 have been planted in the very same soil mix and sitting side by side and in mostly all day sun
any help greatly appreciated and i will try to find the other 1 tomorrow and add to the mix
cliff
1 on left came from Ohio and 1 on r is from Chris in Wis

Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/6385c0



this came from Chris.has a more flat color and bigger leaves
Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/e29c7e



this came from Oh. and has a blue-green edging and more of a satin red

Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/155071

This 1 is close to the 1 from Oh but appears to have a more satiny sheen. this 1 has been sitting about 4 ft away from the other 2 but still in the same area and came from Mi



Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/c9ca91

this 1 came from NY and was sitting in front of the house and got more direct sun over the winter had this 1 about 4/5 years now



Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/85e086



Thumb of 2014-04-29/Cahac/469969

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Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Apr 28, 2014 9:11 PM CST
Cliff they're all pretty! @banker07 since it is a Euro semp, maybe Peter can help. Mine looks similar to the one you have from Chris, I got mine from Lynn, so maybe Lynn and Chris got theirs from the same source??
@valleylynn @goldfinch4 Very interesting question though Cliff, now I'm curious! Hilarious!
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Apr 28, 2014 9:31 PM CST

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The last photo does not look like Red Lion. So that narrows the field.
The more mature Red Lion rosettes have wide blunt leaves.
Chris's Red Lion looks correct, and appears to be a more mature rosette.
Let's see what Peter has to say.
Name: Peter Dieckmann
Germany
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banker07
Apr 29, 2014 1:29 AM CST
I agree with Lynn and Greg;

Cliff the Red Lion you got from Chris looks best for being the right one; but the appearance of Red Lion is very different; here are two photos of a Red Lion from the same source:

one rosette growing directly in the soil - 18.04.2010
Thumb of 2014-04-29/banker07/35233a

offsets growing at the stolones and nearly no contact to the soil - 04.05.2011
Thumb of 2014-04-29/banker07/6d33e4

I don't know anything about the different soil or different weather of those two - the photos are not mine; but I know that the photo 2 shows the same variety because it's been an offset from No. 1;

Peter
[url=www.sempervivum-liste.de]www.sempervivum-liste.de[/url]
[url=www.hauswurze.de]www.hauswurze.de[/url]
[Last edited by banker07 - Apr 29, 2014 1:43 AM (+)]
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Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Apr 29, 2014 7:00 AM CST

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Peter I have the same experience with my Red lion. I have seen it go through many changes in shape and color.

This is a progression of photos of the same rosette from 2010 to 2013. Cliff one photo even shows the satin sheen you mentioned. I think age of the rosette plays a big part in how the offset will look. And of course the seasonal change in color.






Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
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webesemps
Apr 29, 2014 9:02 AM CST
Gee, I would never have thought that the 3rd photo belonged in the group at all...These pics do a good job of illustrating the spectrum of changes in form and color that occur. I'm amazed at the differences.
Name: Peter Dieckmann
Germany
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banker07
Apr 29, 2014 10:39 AM CST
Yes Bev - and it shows clear why it is nearly impossible to ID a variety if the label is lost;
[url=www.sempervivum-liste.de]www.sempervivum-liste.de[/url]
[url=www.hauswurze.de]www.hauswurze.de[/url]
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Apr 29, 2014 11:16 AM CST
Thanks Lynn for the wonderful photo display!! I tip my hat to you.
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling
Name: Cliff Hughes
Front Royal, Va (Zone 6a)
Region: Virginia Plant and/or Seed Trader Sempervivums Lilies Hummingbirder Birds
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Cahac
Apr 29, 2014 8:51 PM CST
Lynn,
looking at your pics the first 3 of mine look to be Red Lion. I am going to find a same size or age chick of each 1 and plant in a window box and see how they look like when growing together I also have a odd plant i got from John H (the original owner of Squaw Mt.) supposed to be a hybrid of Red Lion. there is a pic in the data base that says it is a sport of Red Lion, I have had these plants 20 years now. and usually i only get a striped chick from a solid red plant only but this year i am finally getting a striped chick from a striped chick . my striped 1 looks a lot like the Plant sold as New Rhumbea
This is my "John's Suprise

Thumb of 2014-04-30/Cahac/ae98e3




Thumb of 2014-04-30/Cahac/581e9e



there are a couple more striped in this pot
Thumb of 2014-04-30/Cahac/70bbc0
took these pics yesterday but it rained all day today and i didn't go out
cliff

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Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
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gg5
Apr 29, 2014 8:54 PM CST
Cliff that is a nice looking semp! New Rumba is not as large as Red Lion though. Your "John's Surprise" looks larger than New Rumba I tip my hat to you.
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling
Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
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valleylynn
Apr 29, 2014 10:03 PM CST

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I have New Rhumba. It is very different when you see it in person. The texture of the leaves, cilia lining the leaves, and they seem almost frail. I got mine last year, so still not sure what to expect from it. Time will tell.
Red Lion is noted for producing variegated sports. That is another one that is new to me, just got it last year. I have no idea how big it will get at maturity or how well it will reproduce the variegation.
Here is a photo of Patty's 'Red Lion Variegated', yours looks just like hers.
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
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gg5
Apr 29, 2014 10:06 PM CST
I do love this plant!! Thumbs up
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling
Name: Lynn
Dallas, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level Sempervivums
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valleylynn
Apr 29, 2014 10:34 PM CST

Moderator

It is wonderful. Lovey dubby
Name: Cliff Hughes
Front Royal, Va (Zone 6a)
Region: Virginia Plant and/or Seed Trader Sempervivums Lilies Hummingbirder Birds
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Cahac
Apr 30, 2014 8:45 PM CST
gg5 said:Cliff that is a nice looking semp! New Rumba is not as large as Red Lion though. Your "John's Surprise" looks larger than New Rumba I tip my hat to you.


Greg.
My variegated 1 doesn't get that big, Thinner leaves about 3 1/2" across is the largest i have and that 1is a solid color in a 3 gal. nursery pot..The colors are diff depending on how much sun they get 3/4 hrs of morning or evening sun the plants are a bright satin red .All day sun turns a deep burgundy satin red. wasn't able to do anything outside for last 2 days has been rain & more rain. Grumbling Grumbling
Now got a ? for you. Rolling on the floor laughing Rolling on the floor laughing Rolling on the floor laughing What is the name of that group of 3 at top of your Avatar and the yellow 1 to the right of them? like those
cliff I tip my hat to you.
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Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
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gg5
Apr 30, 2014 9:05 PM CST
The 3 grouped together are 'Abba' the yellow is a NOID I tip my hat to you.
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling
Name: Cliff Hughes
Front Royal, Va (Zone 6a)
Region: Virginia Plant and/or Seed Trader Sempervivums Lilies Hummingbirder Birds
Lover of wildlife (Raccoon badge) Sedums Butterflies Container Gardener
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Cahac
Apr 30, 2014 9:28 PM CST
Thanks Greg,
Won't have to look for the Abba tho, nodding nodding I got that 1 from Chris last year. mine is still all green,but starting to form chicks
cliff
SMILE AND HAVE A GREAT DAY
Name: Greg Colucci
Seattle WA (Zone 8b)
Sempervivums Sedums Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Garden Ideas: Level 1
Garden Art Birds Dog Lover Cat Lover Region: Pacific Northwest Hummingbirder
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gg5
Apr 30, 2014 9:30 PM CST
Mine did take all last summer and then until this spring to color up!! I'm loving this current shade! Thumbs up
Plants bring me peace and calm, more of what we all need Smiling
Name: Patty
Washington State (Zone 8b)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Patty
May 2, 2014 9:37 AM CST
Hi Cliff ~ here are some pics of Red Lion and Red Lion Variegated. They took a beating last winter and I recently divided and moved them. They have the bright shiny red leaves right now, and you can see some of the variegated chicks. The variegated chicks never seem to get full size (as big as the regular ones). I'm going to watch this group more closely this year and see what they do.
Thumb of 2014-05-02/Patty/5ce5f8 Thumb of 2014-05-02/Patty/1bb84e

Thumb of 2014-05-02/Patty/0ead54

Patty 🌺
[Last edited by Patty - May 7, 2014 3:01 AM (+)]
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