Hostas forum: Hosta vein count

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Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
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PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 8:08 AM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

I would like to see a discussion on hosta vein count. Over on DG, they were discussing how to identify a hosta, and part of it was vein count. It was not determined if the vein count stays the same or changes with the age of the plant, so can anyone comment on this?

By the way, being on a thread on DG makes me looooove Cubits. What a kinder, gentler group we have here.

Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
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woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 1:25 PM CST
Quoting from the George Schmid book, The Genus Hosta
"Variability in Veining Count. As with other diagnostic features, a given cultivar displays some variability in the number of veins, and so the count given in the description is the average maximum number of principal veins normally seen
in that cultivar. Occasionally, this number may be exceeded by one or two, while the younger summer leaves may produce fewer veins. It is best to make a count on several mature vernal leaves and then take the average.
Abbreviated Veins. One significant point must be made. The outermost vein or veins are often abbreviated and do not extend to the leaf tip but usually terminate at the leaf margin between a third and halfway from the petiole intersection. Although these veins end at the margin and thus incomplete, they must be counted.
In some cases they are hard to detect on the upper side of the leaf so it is helpful to search for them on the underside, where they are typically more prominent."
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
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woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 1:48 PM CST
Ok, I happen to have Stained Glass in three ages.
A nice liner - the largest leaf has 4 pairs of veins
A nice 4" pot with a plant about 15 inches high - probably 3-4 yrs old 7 pairs of veins
A plant that's been in my garden about 4 years, TC when I bought it - still 7 pairs of veins.
Anyone have an older Stained Glass?
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: Christine
Southeastern MN (Zone 4a)
Charter ATP Member Heucheras I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Level 2 I sent a postcard to Randy! Keeps Horses
Region: Minnesota Birds Raises cows Cat Lover Hostas Farmer
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Christine27360
Aug 7, 2010 2:00 PM CST
I have a Stained Glass that I bought in a 2 qt pot and it has been in the ground here for 5 years -- looks to be 7 veins on mine as well! Sticking tongue out
"Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."
2 Corinthians 9:6
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
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PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 2:42 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

Gee, how did you pick up on Stained Glass?

Thanks so much Pam!That absolutely answers my question.

Thanks so much also, Christine!

When I asked at Shady Oaks, since it seems you know what I'm talking about Pam, I was told, "of course someone would compare it to a hosta they already had, rather than rely on a picture, what's up with that" LOL.

But I must say your explanation of the veining was the best I got.

Again, thanks, Ladies!
Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
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woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 2:51 PM CST
I can understand not relying on a photo after the explanation of abbreviated veins and possibly not seeing them from top side. And it depends on who you are talking to at Shady Oaks. Remember the gal in the office may take orders, do invoicing, etc, but she may not know anything about growing hosta.

The one thing that I don't see on that plant photo at daves is the shine that Stain Glass leaves have.
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
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PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 3:09 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

Well Pam! Of course I'm not relying on the lady in the office. But she is nice, isn't she?

I don't think mine is super shiny, either. I've had mine about five years. When I sent it to the DGer 3 years ago, she said she divided it into four, so I assume she had one of the four pieces in similar conditions. Mine came directly from Shady Oaks, when I was buying from them directly and not through your co-ops. But between the one I sent her that she divided into four, and the one a 'friend' sent her she divided into four, she had eight divisions to compare it to.

What we do in irises to determine if they are the same is purchase one of the cultivar we think it is and grow it next to the one in question. I would think we could do the same with hostas? But with hostas I guess you would have to have the same age division. But divide the existing one, and put it right next to the one you think it is? Maybe identifying hostas is harder than irises, but it seems it would work.
Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
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woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 3:24 PM CST
Yes, the lady is the office is great and always so friendly. No, it's not super shiny, but all my Stained Glass have a sheen to them. Maybe it loses it as it mature, but that was the first thing that jumped out at me when I saw that thread. And didn't she set that plant back each time she divided it?
Personally, I hate seeing those guess the identity of my hosta threads. If you don't know the name, leave it. If it's guessed wrong and you trade it as, say, Stained Glass, then yet another person has the wrong plant. You post a photo of your 'stained glass' and someone else will think they have the wrong plant. It just muddies the waters.
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
Image
PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 3:33 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

I think the way she talked she divided it when she got it. I know she said she did mine, so that would have been three years ago. I don't know when she divided her 'friends' hosta, if there even was one. Funny how she got Guacamole and Stained Glass from both of us. Neither here nor there I guess.

But anyway, I agree with you on the hosta ID threads, like any other plant. I think they are useful only for suggesting what you might have. Unfortunately, some people jump on the first suggestion, and label it that. And they often do that so they are able to trade it as named. I see nothing wrong with having plants without labels. I couldn't possibly keep track of all my plants. And it makes them no less gorgeous. But if you are collecting something, and wish to sell or trade, keep the darn label.

We've lost the identity of a lot of irises that way. Caesars Brother is a prime example. No one knows for sure anymore which the real Caesars Brother is, as everyone has just stuck a label on that and traded it.

Name: Christine
Southeastern MN (Zone 4a)
Charter ATP Member Heucheras I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Level 2 I sent a postcard to Randy! Keeps Horses
Region: Minnesota Birds Raises cows Cat Lover Hostas Farmer
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Christine27360
Aug 7, 2010 6:04 PM CST
My Stained Glass has a sheen to it -- Thumb of 2010-08-08/Christine27360/ce023b


Pardon the "holes" in the hosta!
"Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."
2 Corinthians 9:6
Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
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woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 6:11 PM CST
lol - holes here also. Slugs were awful this year even though it was pretty dry.
Yep, that 's the sheen I'm talking about.
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
Image
PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 6:57 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

Thanks Christine. I guess mine does have some sheen. I had to go down and look at it, and compared to others it does. Who doesn't have holes in their hostas by this time of the year?

It sure is a lovely hosta. I've always loved Guacamole, too.
Name: Christine
Southeastern MN (Zone 4a)
Charter ATP Member Heucheras I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Level 2 I sent a postcard to Randy! Keeps Horses
Region: Minnesota Birds Raises cows Cat Lover Hostas Farmer
Image
Christine27360
Aug 7, 2010 7:20 PM CST
I agree!! I agree

Here's a pic on my Guacamole -- new to me this year -- he's so cute!!!!

Thumb of 2010-08-08/Christine27360/38b6b2
"Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."
2 Corinthians 9:6
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
Image
PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 7:23 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

Beautiful already!
Name: Christine
Southeastern MN (Zone 4a)
Charter ATP Member Heucheras I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Level 2 I sent a postcard to Randy! Keeps Horses
Region: Minnesota Birds Raises cows Cat Lover Hostas Farmer
Image
Christine27360
Aug 7, 2010 7:26 PM CST
Thanks Polly! Check this little guy out -- I got him as a liner -- he is so tiny but I love him and cant wait till he grows up!!

Radiant Star:

Thumb of 2010-08-08/Christine27360/399afd
"Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."
2 Corinthians 9:6
Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
Image
woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 7:34 PM CST
Radiant Star is cute. Who did you get it from?
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

New - Plants for Sale - co-op prices
Name: Christine
Southeastern MN (Zone 4a)
Charter ATP Member Heucheras I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Ideas: Level 2 I sent a postcard to Randy! Keeps Horses
Region: Minnesota Birds Raises cows Cat Lover Hostas Farmer
Image
Christine27360
Aug 7, 2010 7:36 PM CST
http://www.hostaliners.com

They had a nice selection and they are like $3 - 4 dollars -- of course they are tiny!!! Blinking
"Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."
2 Corinthians 9:6
Name: Polly Kinsman
Hannibal, NY (Zone 6a)

Charter ATP Member Region: United States of America I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Lilies
Seller of Garden Stuff
Image
PollyK
Aug 7, 2010 7:37 PM CST

Gone But Not Forgotten

That is really cute! A lot of color for a little guy!
Name: woodthrush
Albrightsville PA
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Garden Art Ferns Lilies Container Gardener
Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Northeast US Hostas Heucheras Sempervivums Butterflies
Image
woodthrush
Aug 7, 2010 7:50 PM CST
Oh cool. We're getting some daylilies from Ed next week. I'll ask him to throw a couple in the box too.
http://cubits.org/TartWarmersandMore/

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Name: Ann
Ottawa, ON Canada (Zone 5a)
Hostas Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Composter Region: Canadian Clematis
Canning and food preservation Container Gardener Annuals Herbs Seed Starter Vegetable Grower
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ViolaAnn
Aug 8, 2010 11:16 AM CST
I've never felt that there was a sheen to my 'Stained Glass' although maybe there is. My main garden pest this year has been EARWIGS, not slugs and they've done a number on some of my white-centred hostas.

The most recent pest problem of my 'Stained Glass' has been squirrels jumping from the oak tree above it and breaking petioles. Here's a pic of it taken end of June and most leaves appearThumb of 2010-08-08/ViolaAnn/e5b5ca
to have about 9 vein pairs. I'll go out after lunch and do an average count.

(Oh I see things have changed over here in the way we post pics. Possible to post more than on in a single message now?)

Ann
Ann

Pictures of all my hostas, updated annually and tracked since 2008 begin at: https://violaann.smugmug.com/Garden/Hostas/Hostas-in-my-gard...

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